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Israeli air strikes target Gaza

SquareMelon said:
where 220+ died, 400 injured over 120 seriously, many more still under the wreckage
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I have not seen such inflated numbers from any source. Can you post your source on this??
 
Laila said:
UK Military did respond, i was merely making the point that it did not respond in such a way as being demonstrated now to achieve its goal.

I have searched how many have died not only in this raid but over the past few weeks and it seems to me through the articles i have been scanning, the numbers are still higher on the Palestinian side.
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This is very possible actually.

But how many of the palestinian casualties were innocent people, and how many were Hamas activists??
 
Laila said:
UK Military did respond, i was merely making the point that it did not respond in such a way as being demonstrated now to achieve its goal.

I have searched how many have died not only in this raid but over the past few weeks and it seems to me through the articles i have been scanning, the numbers are still higher on the Palestinian side.
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Israel didn't attacked Gaza in purpose to kill more people.
They just have showed them that we can fight too and they better stop fire Israel.
 
Tal said:
To be honest with you, to me that doesn't sound like condemning both sides. We don't count bodies here. It's really quite easy to feel sorry for what appears to be the underdog. And yet, think logically. The blame is put on Hamas. They have started this. They fire rockets into civilian areas. They have been warned.
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I also said

Laila said:
i want my PM to show some form of backbone and morality. Condemn both sides
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The blame should be put on both sides.
This has played out many sides
each side wanting the other to act resulting in:
Israeli siege of Gaza
civilian deaths
condemnation of attack by I Community
air raid stops for a while
A 'peace' being brokered by some country
Hamas rockets Israel
Israel warns

Anddd the cycle continues :/

What is the pressing issue? Israel has launched an attack on establishments related to Hamas.
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And how many dead Hamas militants have resulted from this raid?
 
Laila said:
I have searched how many have died not only in this raid but over the past few weeks and it seems to me through the articles i have been scanning, the numbers are still higher on the Palestinian side.
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The IDF does not hide behind Israeli civilians. Hamas does use civilians as shields. That is why Palestinian casualties are usually higher.
 
lynnb said:
But how many of the palestinian casualties were innocent people, and how many were Hamas activists??
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It doesn't say, it merely says 'civilians'
 
SquareMelon said:
Unfortunately, there is nobody posting here from Gaza to tell us how it feels to be under siege with no electricity, fuel, food and medical supplies in a day where 220+ died, 400 injured over 120 seriously, many more still under the wreckage with F16s flying over head causing fear and terror for a 1.5 million people.
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What siege are you talking about? Israel has and still is supplying Palestinians with electricity, fuels, food and medical supplies. As I've mentioned in my post, Israel constantly provides Palestinians in need with medical assistance, in Israeli hospitals and with Israeli ambulances. Seems you are a little uninformed.

While I don't think your numbers are correct, I want to explain: Hamas brought this about. They had their choice, and they have been warned before. This is not a case of a merciless aggressor randomly slaying civilians.
 
Shayah said:
The IDF does not hide behind Israeli civilians. Hamas does use civilians as shields. That is why Palestinian casualties are usually higher.
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Perhaps, or perhaps Israel needs to show further restraint.

It has used this 'tactic' before many times in not only Gaza but Lebanon.
You do not manage to kill Militants by attacking civilian areas, they should know civilians will be the ones who die
 
Tal said:
What siege are you talking about? Israel has and still is supplying Palestinians with electricity, fuels, food and medical supplies. As I've mentioned in my post, Israel constantly provides Palestinians in need with medical assistance, in Israeli hospitals and with Israeli ambulances. Seems you are a little uninformed.

While I don't think your numbers are correct, I want to explain: Hamas brought this about. They had their choice, and they have been warned before. This is not a case of a merciless aggressor randomly slaying civilians.
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Please let me highlight one fact from your post.
If a Muslim Arabic person get injured in israel area, he gets the same treatment as a Israeli person which includes Ambulance, Hospital and Medical supply
 
Laila said:
You do not manage to kill Militants by attacking civilian areas, they should know civilians will be the ones who die
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There is no other option remaining. Israel has warned Hamas to stop for weeks. Even Egypt has warned Hamas to stop. Hamas does not listen to anything except raw power.
 
Shayah said:
There is no other option remaining. Israel has warned Hamas to stop for weeks. Even Egypt has warned Hamas to stop. Hamas does not listen to anything except raw power.
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Either their memory isn't very good or they don't respond to raw power either.

They just don't respond to anything.
 
Shayah said:
There is no other option remaining. Israel has warned Hamas to stop for weeks. Even Egypt has warned Hamas to stop. Hamas does not listen to anything except raw power.
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It does not seem to even respond to that tbh
 
Laila said:
I know Hamas was warned, i even said above Israel was provoked.

Where my problem lies is the figures that seem to be emerging is highly favored on one side. No guesses as to which side that is.

Im sorry that your country is going through this and i would not expect no Government to take it, but when IRA bombings happened in UK. UK Government did not respond by air raiding and bombing civilian populations. More restraint should have been shown because sadly, Israel is not coming off as the victim here.
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The Muslims seem to operate under the premise that only retaliatory violence in direct proportion to the original offense is acceptable.

Westerners see retaliation as a way of stopping any further offenses.

And in regards to the IRA here's Mark Steyn...

That, by the way, is the one point of similarity between the jihad and conventional terrorist movements like the IRA or ETA. Terror groups persist because of a lack of confidence on the part of their targets: The IRA, for example, calculated correctly that the British had the capability to smash them totally but not the will. So they knew that while they could never win militarily, they also could never be defeated. The Islamists have figured similarly. The only difference is that most terrorist wars are highly localized. We now have the first truly global terrorist insurgency because the Islamists view the whole world the way the IRA view the bogs of Fermanagh: They want it, and they've calculated that our entire civilization lacks the will to see them off.

Extra - WSJ.com
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Laila said:
Perhaps, or perhaps Israel needs to show further restraint.

It has used this 'tactic' before many times in not only Gaza but Lebanon.
You do not manage to kill Militants by attacking civilian areas, they should know civilians will be the ones who die
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How then do you kill militants when they are in civilian areas wearing civilian cloths? Maybe Hamas should come out in the open and take the mask off of thier face and dress in military uniforms. But they will not because they are cowards who hide behind children.
 
SgtRock said:
How then do you kill militants when they are in civilian areas wearing civilian cloths? Maybe Hamas should come out in the open and take the mask off of thier face and dress in military uniforms. But they will not because they are cowards who hide behind children.
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Well yes but why would they?
They are not soldiers but cowards

Israel is just not making itself look any better
 
Laila said:
It does not seem to even respond to that tbh
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Actually, it does. But not for long.

Force and overwhelming force is the only thing that has been shown to stop Palestinian terrorist attacks...for awhile, anyway.
 
so if Israel is in the wrong for bombing civliian areas
maybe some of our Palestinian sympathizers can direct me to the Palestinian military bases or terrorist bases that are not in civilian areas?
just where are the legitimate targets?



clue: hiding among civilians
 
bhkad said:
The Muslims seem to operate under the premise that only retaliatory violence in direct proportion to the original offense is acceptable.
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Interesting.
I didn't think of it like that.
 
Shayah said:
I have not seen such inflated numbers from any source. Can you post your source on this??
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Waves of Israeli aircraft swooped over the Gaza Strip on Saturday, firing missiles at Hamas’s security headquarters and killing more than 200 people, bringing the highest death toll in Gaza in years
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http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/28/world/middleeast/28mideast.html?_r=1&hp

Israeli F-16 bombers have pounded key targets across the Gaza Strip, killing more than 200 people, local medics say.

Most of those killed were policemen in the Hamas militant movement, which controls Gaza, but women and children also died, the Gaza officials said.

About 700 others were wounded, as missiles struck security compounds and militant bases, the officials said.
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BBC NEWS | Middle East | Massive Israeli air raids on Gaza
 
SquareMelon said:
Bob,

This was a massacre. The targets were mostly police stations as evident by the uniform the dead were wearing. This is not the first time these buildings were targeted. Most were destroyed when Abbas was in control before in Gaza. A lot of damage was also done to civilian areas as most police stations are in civilian areas.
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200 dead in Israel's Gaza strikes - Israel-Palestinians- msnbc.com
The strikes caused widespread panic and confusion in Gaza, as black clouds of smoke rose above the territory, ruled by Hamas for the past 18 months. Some of the Israeli missiles struck in densely populated areas as children were leaving school, and women rushed into the streets frantically looking for their children.

“My son is gone, my son is gone,” wailed Said Masri, a 57-year-old shopkeeper, as he sat in the middle of a Gaza City street, slapping his face and covering his head with dust from a bombed-out security compound nearby.

He said he had sent his 9-year-old son out to purchase cigarettes minutes before the airstrikes began and now could not find him. “May I burn like the cigarettes, may Israel burn,” Masri moaned.
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They need their Martin Luther King over there really, really badly.
 
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DeeJayH said:
so if Israel is in the wrong for bombing civliian areas
maybe some of our Palestinian sympathizers can direct me to the Palestinian military bases or terrorist bases that are not in civilian areas?
just where are the legitimate targets?



clue: hiding among civilians
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You do know that Gaza is the most densely populated place on earth and that there is next to no non civilian area right?
 
bhkad said:
Actually, it does. But not for long.

Force and overwhelming force is the only thing that has been shown to stop Palestinian terrorist attacks...for awhile, anyway.
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They should try 1 year of turning the other cheek no matter what happens as long as the whole country is not at risk. Im sure rogue Palestinian who want revenge might see it then as a honest and better alternative over time. And if they don't stop in 1 year of absolutely no revenge killings then so be it... .Thats the only way I can see to stop this.
 
PeteEU said:
You do know that Gaza is the most densely populated place on earth and that there is next to no non civilian area right?
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no it is not

and that makes it Israel's fault, how?
if your 'military' hides among the civilians, then civilians are going to die
that is not the fault of Israel
 
Laila said:
Ofc not.
Who says condemnation gets anyway? Sanctions and severing trade agreements does and seeing EU is Israel's largest 'customer' ....
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So hurt Israel for defending itself after repeated warnings to the opposition....

WHAT!?!
 
Shewter said:
So hurt Israel for defending itself after repeated warnings to the opposition....

WHAT!?!
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Didn't Isreal invent the damn trophy defense missle system? That also works on rpgs? Freaking start putting them everywhere then.... Of course then they would lose their reasons to bomb everything. It would take a month of working to make a non accessable wall of these after you found a good way to adapt this as a barrier.

YouTube - Anti Tank Protection System-Trophy
 
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