• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

UK work time opt-out under threat

Didn't you make this exact same thread?
 
What is the 'opt-out' that the article repeatedly references but never explains? From context it sounds like this would bar people from voluntarily working overtime. If that's true, why would that ban be a good thing?
 
You have a problem with people voluntarily working extra hours?

Nope, but under special arrangements then, not as part of the regular contract hours.

Volunteers depends on how you define it, if its a person who cannot afford not to work over time because the system have him work over time to afford to survive, then no I do not support it, that has been the scenario in the UK at least.

Same scenario in Norway, property prices, prices in general and taxes are so high that most people are forced to work over time. And we are talking about the "richest" country in the world.
People in France for example manage fine with 35 hours. Do not know many there who would volunteer to work the same times they work in the UK.
 
What is the 'opt-out' that the article repeatedly references but never explains? From context it sounds like this would bar people from voluntarily working overtime. If that's true, why would that ban be a good thing?

It bans regular contracts from having more than 48 hour work weeks.
 
Nope, but under special arrangements then, not as part of the regular contract hours.

Volunteers depends on how you define it, if its a person who cannot afford not to work over time because the system have him work over time to afford to survive, then no I do not support it, that has been the scenario in the UK at least.

So because there are people whose situation forces them to work overtime to survive, you support a ban on working overtime? I don't follow
 
So because there are people whose situation forces them to work overtime to survive, you support a ban on working overtime? I don't follow

No, when everyone have to work overtime because no one can afford not to, then there is obviously a problem..
 
Nope, but under special arrangements then, not as part of the regular contract hours.
People in the UK aren't allowed to define their own contract hours when they take a job?

Volunteers depends on how you define it, if its a person who cannot afford not to work over time because the system have him work over time to afford to survive, then no I do not support it, that has been the scenario in the UK at least.
Can you rephrase this? I think the ESL messed up what you were trying to say.

Same scenario in Norway, property prices, prices in general and taxes are so high that most people are forced to work over time. And we are talking about the "richest" country in the world.
So high taxes make people work more? Hmmmm....


People in France for example manage fine with 35 hours. Do not know many there who would volunteer to work the same times they work in the UK.

I bet those who need the money would love to be allowed to work overtime.
 
No, when everyone have to work overtime because no one can afford not to, then there is obviously a problem..

The problem is they need a better job...or a better union...or the government to stop taking so much of their money.
 
The problem is they need a better job...or a better union...or the government to stop taking so much of their money.

Damned straight. People can negotiate their own contracts, and through proper use of collective arbitration (the unions) pay and such can be fixed at sustainable levels. Plus if you slash taxes and wasteful government spending, then the people can save even more of their money. It sounds like there is a huge economic bubble going on there where prices soar to unsustainable levels. Usually caused by some form of government interference, and in the socialist Europe, I can see that happening quite readily. What do all the scientists do? I bet dollars to donuts they pay no mind to these restrictions. Scientists are usually paid salary, and we put in 48 hours in under 4 days if you tally it all up. Count the fact that we work pretty much 7 days a week; and we put in tons of hours. That ain't gonna stop, and no one can afford to pay scientists "overtime" (heheh, like we would get such a thing anyway).

Free market would have taken care of this along with responsible government. Not limiting how much a person can work through government law...that's stupid.
 
Damned straight. People can negotiate their own contracts, and through proper use of collective arbitration (the unions) pay and such can be fixed at sustainable levels. Plus if you slash taxes and wasteful government spending, then the people can save even more of their money. It sounds like there is a huge economic bubble going on there where prices soar to unsustainable levels. Usually caused by some form of government interference, and in the socialist Europe, I can see that happening quite readily. What do all the scientists do? I bet dollars to donuts they pay no mind to these restrictions. Scientists are usually paid salary, and we put in 48 hours in under 4 days if you tally it all up. Count the fact that we work pretty much 7 days a week; and we put in tons of hours. That ain't gonna stop, and no one can afford to pay scientists "overtime" (heheh, like we would get such a thing anyway).

Free market would have taken care of this along with responsible government. Not limiting how much a person can work through government law...that's stupid.

Doctors are one group that is also highly effected by this law. One would think that having free health care would require more doctors and more hours, but apparently they are also overworked.
 
And you think the solution is to outlaw overtime?

Thats not the talk here. Overtime is allowed, but regular contract work is only allowed to work 48 hours, if they want more they must also take the complication to register, apply, get permission and what not to work more than 48 hours.
 
Thats not the talk here. Overtime is allowed, but regular contract work is only allowed to work 48 hours, if they want more they must also take the complication to register, apply, get permission and what not to work more than 48 hours.

They have to apply to the government to work more than 48 hours? You don't think that this should be up to the workers and employers involved?
 
Thats not the talk here. Overtime is allowed, but regular contract work is only allowed to work 48 hours, if they want more they must also take the complication to register, apply, get permission and what not to work more than 48 hours.

Then what is the impact of this bill, except to make it harder for people to voluntarily work overtime?
 
They have to apply to the government to work more than 48 hours? You don't think that this should be up to the workers and employers involved?

No. I think there should be incredibly tight procedures and regulations for being allowed to work such slavish hours.
 
Then what is the impact of this bill, except to make it harder for people to voluntarily work overtime?

The regulation is about standard contract work.. It will tighten the rules and make new regulation for ANY work over 48 hours. Most contracts in Europe are 37.5 or 40 hours per week, any time over that is considered overtime, over 48 hours is something else alltogether.
 
No. I think there should be incredibly tight procedures and regulations for being allowed to work such slavish hours.

What is so slavish about working for a friggin living?

My average work week is usually between 45-60 hours. But I love my work. It doesn't even feel like work to me.

It's also one of those professions that require that work be done when it is necessary or the whole company shuts down. It's just a fact of life that there is work and it must be done in an industrious society. I also would not be happy witht he idea of having to hire someone to pass the buck to when I hit my government approved work limit unless go get licenses to what?...do my friggin job?

I believe some countries need to develop a sense of pride in their work instead of begging their governments to dream up schemes to get them out of it.
 
No. I think there should be incredibly tight procedures and regulations for being allowed to work such slavish hours.

Well, forget all about individual privacy and right to contract huh?

That's messed up man. For a guy who claims to hate politicians you sure seem intent on letting them make choices for you.
 
Well, forget all about individual privacy and right to contract huh?

That's messed up man. For a guy who claims to hate politicians you sure seem intent on letting them make choices for you.

I think this one choice is pretty damn good. In my opinion a protection of human rights to live a life of their own and not for a company.
 
What is so slavish about working for a friggin living?

My average work week is usually between 45-60 hours. But I love my work. It doesn't even feel like work to me.

It's also one of those professions that require that work be done when it is necessary or the whole company shuts down. It's just a fact of life that there is work and it must be done in an industrious society. I also would not be happy witht he idea of having to hire someone to pass the buck to when I hit my government approved work limit unless go get licenses to what?...do my friggin job?

I believe some countries need to develop a sense of pride in their work instead of begging their governments to dream up schemes to get them out of it.


What about family time? What about time to make good healthy cooking? Time to exercise? Time to play and enjoy? Time to study and learn? Time to do things around the house, or improve on it? Time to sleep well? And so on..
 
The regulation is about standard contract work.. It will tighten the rules and make new regulation for ANY work over 48 hours. Most contracts in Europe are 37.5 or 40 hours per week, any time over that is considered overtime, over 48 hours is something else alltogether.

Okay, so what rules and regulations are added and what problems do they solve? Ya know, what does the bill do? All I see is an additional burden and red tape on people who want to voluntarily work overtime.
 
Okay, so what rules and regulations are added and what problems do they solve? Ya know, what does the bill do? All I see is an additional burden and red tape on people who want to voluntarily work overtime.

The problem it solves is the bubble in the UK for example, where everyone now have to work more than 48 hours to keep up with everyone else which does that, creating a situation where its almost impossible NOT to work under 48 hours. Yes, it has made the UK one of the most effective economies of the world, but the population are slaves of companies while having minimal lives of their own.

And all this work is usually to pay down the debt they have, the mortgage on a house which they have to pay for 20-30 years, because property prices are also bubbled, mostly because of enormous loans that everyone takes, but also because everyone who works more than 48 hours drives up the prices thereby forcing everyone else to have to work more than 48 hours as well.
 
Last edited:
What about family time? What about time to make good healthy cooking? Time to exercise? Time to play and enjoy? Time to study and learn? Time to do things around the house, or improve on it? Time to sleep well? And so on..

I have all that. It's called managing your time and making the most of your leisure time.

And believe me, if I have things going on, it is no problem to scale work back and attend to those things that should be done away from work.

There are 104 personal days per year that belong totally to you. They're called Saturday and Sunday.
 
Back
Top Bottom