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Thread: Court sides with ACLU, strikes down Patriot Act gag provision

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    Court sides with ACLU, strikes down Patriot Act gag provision

    Under the gag provision, once a person was targeted in an investigation, and sent a "security letter", that person had no right to defend himself against the accusations. If he was not charged with anything, he still had the onerous accusations over his head, and was not allowed to even say he was innocent.

    Today, that has all changed. Kudos to the courts for that, and another big middle finger to the Patriot Act.

    Historical note: Although people will remember that it was the Bush administration that rammed through the Patriot Act, it will, unfortunately, be forgotten that this was merely an extension to Bill Clinton's own so-called 1994 Antiterrorism Act. It takes two political parties to tango and take away your freedoms. It only takes the efforts of American citizens to get those freedoms back. Never forget - They don't own us. We own THEM.

    Article is here.
    Last edited by danarhea; 12-16-08 at 04:02 PM.
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    Re: Court sides with ACLU, strikes down Patriot Act gag provision

    The whole of it needs to be struck down.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Court sides with ACLU, strikes down Patriot Act gag provision

    I suspect that ruling might make it to the Supreme Court
    And why does your tone suggest that you do not care about children?

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    Re: Court sides with ACLU, strikes down Patriot Act gag provision

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    The whole of it needs to be struck down.
    Boo!

    Sincerely,
    The Patriot Act.


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    Re: Court sides with ACLU, strikes down Patriot Act gag provision

    Quote Originally Posted by JMak View Post
    Boo!

    Sincerely,
    The Patriot Act.

    I'm sure the Patriot Act would be well opposed to being destroyed. But it's best for freedom and liberty if it is.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Court sides with ACLU, strikes down Patriot Act gag provision

    I'm glad that the Courts are reigning in NSL's. They are far too powerful with far too little oversight. The FBI has openly admitted to abusing NSL's and continues to do so.

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    Historical note: Although people will remember that it was the Bush administration that rammed through the Patriot Act, it will, unfortunately, be forgotten that this was merely an extension to Bill Clinton's own so-called 1994 Antiterrorism Act. It takes two political parties to tango and take away your freedoms. It only takes the efforts of American citizens to get those freedoms back. Never forget - They don't own us. We own THEM.
    The democratic Congress has a lower approval rating than Bush. People are well aware of the democrats' part in everything Bush has done

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    Re: Court sides with ACLU, strikes down Patriot Act gag provision

    Good for the courts, now just got to wait for the hyperpartisans to be screaming "legislation from the bench".

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    Re: Court sides with ACLU, strikes down Patriot Act gag provision

    Well done SCOTUS. I just hope we can get rid of all this authoritarian anti-terror legislation in the UK as well.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

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    Re: Court sides with ACLU, strikes down Patriot Act gag provision

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    Historical note: Although people will remember that it was the Bush administration that rammed through the Patriot Act, it will, unfortunately, be forgotten that this was merely an extension to Bill Clinton's own so-called 1994 Antiterrorism Act. It takes two political parties to tango and take away your freedoms. It only takes the efforts of American citizens to get those freedoms back. Never forget - They don't own us. We own THEM.

    Article is here.
    Historical note: Actually, PATRIOT's foundation was the 1968 OMNIBUS Crime Control and Safe Streets Act as well as the 1978 FISA Act. A large amount of its provisions simply update 30-40 year old surveillance law to such modern day things as cell phones, web boards, email, pagers, and chat rooms. Amazingly, there is no public outcry for THOSE Bills to be struck down...and why would there? People don't bother to take time to research the PATRIOT act beyond a few websites or blogs and what's commonly said by the people that hate the act anyways so don't actually learn jack **** about it and most of the stuff they know they have faulty information on...so why would they even know the Acts that its based off of to protest those in the first place?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    The whole of it needs to be struck down.
    No, it really doesn't.

    It needs to continue the path its going. Numerous of the more questionable portions of PATRIOT are set to sunset in the very near future and will be written off the books. Similarly, the few other places that are egregious are being challenged in court or having other legislature to remove them. Like just about every other time in our countries history, PATRIOT came about during a time when Security was at the utmost concern of the people and as the pendulum swings back towards freedom the portions of PATRIOT that are harmful will be removed. Meanwhile, the VAST majority of the Act that is useless, potentially vital, remain to update decades old law.

    To strike down ALL of PATRIOT is like going out and shooting a man that has the Flu before he spreads it to someone else. Its huge over kill that is counter productive.

    Technology has advanced leaps and bounds since 1968. Previously, tapping a single phone was simple...because at most they may be using their one phone or maybe a pay phone. Your two ways of communication was pretty much Phone or Mail. Now you have Pay Phones, Cell Phones (available through multiple carriers), Text Messaging, IM's, Email, Forum posts, Chat Rooms, (The last 4 of which accessible in public areas like libraries, internet cafe's, etc), faxes, on top of the other two things. By not addressing this update in technology you open up loopholes for both the law AND criminals to exploit.

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    Re: Court sides with ACLU, strikes down Patriot Act gag provision

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Historical note: Actually, PATRIOT's foundation was the 1968 OMNIBUS Crime Control and Safe Streets Act as well as the 1978 FISA Act. A large amount of its provisions simply update 30-40 year old surveillance law to such modern day things as cell phones, web boards, email, pagers, and chat rooms. Amazingly, there is no public outcry for THOSE Bills to be struck down...and why would there? People don't bother to take time to research the PATRIOT act beyond a few websites or blogs and what's commonly said by the people that hate the act anyways so don't actually learn jack **** about it and most of the stuff they know they have faulty information on...so why would they even know the Acts that its based off of to protest those in the first place?



    No, it really doesn't.

    It needs to continue the path its going. Numerous of the more questionable portions of PATRIOT are set to sunset in the very near future and will be written off the books. Similarly, the few other places that are egregious are being challenged in court or having other legislature to remove them. Like just about every other time in our countries history, PATRIOT came about during a time when Security was at the utmost concern of the people and as the pendulum swings back towards freedom the portions of PATRIOT that are harmful will be removed. Meanwhile, the VAST majority of the Act that is useless, potentially vital, remain to update decades old law.

    To strike down ALL of PATRIOT is like going out and shooting a man that has the Flu before he spreads it to someone else. Its huge over kill that is counter productive.

    Technology has advanced leaps and bounds since 1968. Previously, tapping a single phone was simple...because at most they may be using their one phone or maybe a pay phone. Your two ways of communication was pretty much Phone or Mail. Now you have Pay Phones, Cell Phones (available through multiple carriers), Text Messaging, IM's, Email, Forum posts, Chat Rooms, (The last 4 of which accessible in public areas like libraries, internet cafe's, etc), faxes, on top of the other two things. By not addressing this update in technology you open up loopholes for both the law AND criminals to exploit.
    How does the patriot act address those technological advances and what do those advances have to do with complete suspension of a person's rights based on just one branch declaring them a terrorist suspect?
    In fact, if it was just to update FISA, that's all that would've been needed to be done, update FISA.
    However the patriot also seeked to circumvent the provisions within FISA requiring court review and issue of warrants. The Patriot act does not require warrants which is why a whole new bill was required - all the more reason that the patriot act has no place in our society.
    Fine, update the technological provision to the simple telephone that was mentioned in FISA, IOW, update FISA, not circumvent it - no matter who is in power, no executive can have such unbalanced power.
    Last edited by jfuh; 12-16-08 at 08:58 PM.

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