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Thread: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    Get in people's faces and there is a problem, even if you are legally correct...
    No oppression has ever been solved by not getting in people's faces though.

    Do you really think Women or Blacks would have the right to vote if they didn't get in people's faces about it and just kept quiet about it?

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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    I am. I see no reason whatsoever to keep polygamy between consenting adults illegal.
    It is practiced more than the public knows about, but the smart ones keep a very low profile, and don't involve the kids...
    I have no moral opposition to it, but some of them have been known to abuse welfare and foodstamp programs...and the fiscal conservative side of me objects to that...
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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    It is like sausage or hot dogs, if you know how they are made, you might not eat them.
    Keep the ickiness behind closed doors and there is no problem. Get in people's faces and there is a problem, even if you are legally correct...
    But there needs to be a principle, or it's just case-by-case, and that's not rule of law; it's just arbitrary.

    If the principle is, consenting adults have the right to marry whomever they wish, what's the principled argument against polygamy, group marriages, or siblings marrying?

    I did mention brothers marrying in order to take an incestuous child out of the equation, but seriously, couldn't a brother and sister marry and just abort any child?

    So, what's the principled argument against it?
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    No oppression has ever been solved by not getting in people's faces though.

    Do you really think Women or Blacks would have the right to vote if they didn't get in people's faces about it and just kept quiet about it?
    When did blacks ever crash the services at a white church?
    MLK knew it, preached it, lived it....the low level confrontation, out in public. It took a long time, but it is happening. It will take a long time on the gay issues as well.
    I see a more effective tool that should be used here. management by embarrassment...MBE...
    If the churches are made to look like denizens of the OT, instead of followers of their saviour re the NT, things will change....
    After all, it was the Southern Baptists that were pro slavery, and now they have apologizied and moved on...
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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    When did blacks ever crash the services at a white church?
    I'm not excusing these people's actions in the least. However, I do believe getting in people's faces while in public about something is necessary at times for change.

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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    I'm not excusing these people's actions in the least. However, I do believe getting in people's faces while in public about something is necessary at times for change.
    MLK did more with passive resistance, preaching logic, making sense than all the "angry" blacks combined....
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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    It is practiced more than the public knows about, but the smart ones keep a very low profile, and don't involve the kids...
    I have no moral opposition to it, but some of them have been known to abuse welfare and foodstamp programs...and the fiscal conservative side of me objects to that...
    I also see no problem with legalizing polygamy. The financial aspect of it is concerning as well but I believe that it should fall under the same observations that all marriages should undergo for possible financial fraud.

    Heterosexual marriages can commit tax or financial fraud that same as any other marriage.
    "Gold gets dug out of the ground in Africa, or someplace. Then we melt it down, dig another hole, bury it again and pay people to stand around guarding it. It has no utility. Anyone watching from Mars would be scratching their head."
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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    But there needs to be a principle, or it's just case-by-case, and that's not rule of law; it's just arbitrary.

    If the principle is, consenting adults have the right to marry whomever they wish, what's the principled argument against polygamy, group marriages, or siblings marrying?

    I did mention brothers marrying in order to take an incestuous child out of the equation, but seriously, couldn't a brother and sister marry and just abort any child?

    So, what's the principled argument against it?
    If the marriage constitutes a health risk for the offspring or is a genetic abomination then it shouldn't be allowed. This eliminates inter-species marriage and incestial marriage.

    The only arguments against polygamy and same-sex marriage are possible financial fraud and social acceptance which exists in stages for heterosexual marriage as well.
    "Gold gets dug out of the ground in Africa, or someplace. Then we melt it down, dig another hole, bury it again and pay people to stand around guarding it. It has no utility. Anyone watching from Mars would be scratching their head."
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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    It is practiced more than the public knows about, but the smart ones keep a very low profile, and don't involve the kids...
    I have no moral opposition to it, but some of them have been known to abuse welfare and foodstamp programs...and the fiscal conservative side of me objects to that...
    The fiscal conservative side of me objects to that abuse regardless of someone's marital status.

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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    The fiscal conservative side of me objects to that abuse regardless of someone's marital status.
    A few years ago some of the FLDS who live amonst the LDS were found to be abusing the welfare system.
    Certainly a man should not be able to marry more women than he can afford.
    Now, having said that, how does ANYONE afford more than one wife, much less 25 kids?
    Me, I got a great wife, conservative spender, earned more than me when working (except at first), better retirement....
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