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Thread: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

  1. #251
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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by downthecenter View Post
    You should probably have read my entire post. I stated that I believe we should come to middle and allow for all people to be happy. It's a very simple process, allow civil unions for those who are "gay" and allow "marriage" for those who are not. We have to afford the same rights for all people in our nation. But that doesn't mean that we have to call it the same. They don't call it the same thing in Spain and everyone there is happy. Civil Unions with full status rights are the perfect solutions. If you would pay attention to what I am saying you would fully grasp what I am hoping for. On a Federal level we need to protect the rights of both homo/hetero union. If the word "marriage" upsets people, then we change that and offer the same rights branded differently.

    Why you would compare that to Jim Crowe laws is beyond me. I'm from the South and I would never advocate taking away the rights of any human being. These are two different issues from two different eras.
    I did read your entire post....and I appreciate your sentiment. However, being from the South, then you must understand why the concept of "separate but equal" was not an acceptable alternative.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by Heretic View Post
    One is recognition. Marriages are recognized by both the state govenrments and the federal. Civil unions are not, and may be invalidated or ignored depending on which state you move to after getting one.
    so a civil union is a recent thing designed for gay/lesbian marraiges?
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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    so a civil union is a recent thing designed for gay/lesbian marraiges?
    I think they're recent. 2000 or so?
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  4. #254
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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by downthecenter View Post
    Shawn- I understand why they compare the two. But again it is two very different ideas. Jim Crow laws were separate but equal laws. I'm not talking a definition of separation. I'm not saying that we redefine and reconstitute Jim Crow type laws. I'm saying that we simply affirm that Civil Unions and Marriage are equal institutions and have the same rights and privileges. It is okay to define marriage in many different forms. If the "marriage" word is so divisive, yet many Americans would accept "civil unions" why not push forward with that. Why not allow every person in this nation to have rights as "joint tenants in common" whether they be straight or gay. That is what I am stating. Jim Crow laws were segregation laws that were meant to subjugate a "lesser" people. This idea is both antiquated and does not fit into what we want here.

    Give the "right" their marriage and give the "left" their civil unions. It's really quite simple. Every person should have the same privileges. Regardless of what people want to call it.
    There is a stigma attached to "civil unions" that makes them less than "marriage".
    The simple solution would be for the government to do away with marriage altogether and leave it to the church. That way people could either choose a religious (marriage) or secular (civil union).
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector View Post
    Marriage is not discrimination. It is a ceremony between a man and a woman to create a binding contract in the eyes of God to procreate and have children.

    Now I ask you the same question everyone else is desperately avoiding; why is it gays are not content with Civil Unions, why do they HAVE to redefine marriage, a term we have understood and accepted for over 2000 years?

    Carry on; your desperate attempts to suggest otherwise are noted.
    Like I have said many times in these marriage debates it has very little to with marriage or civil unions.......It is and attempt by "Feel Good" Liberals and a few militant gays to shove the gay lifestyle down our throats and to make us believe it s a suitable alternative life style and that my left wing friends will never happen..........I have no problem with Civil Unions with the same rights marriage gives but you will not call it marriage......Most gay people could care less and the ones I know tell me the "Feel Good" Liberals and few militant gays don't speak for them...................
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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    Like I have said many times in these marriage debates it has very little to with marriage or civil unions.......It is and attempt by "Feel Good" Liberals and a few militant gays to shove the gay lifestyle down our throats and to make us believe it s a suitable alternative life style and that my left wing friends will never happen..........I have no problem with Civil Unions with the same rights marriage gives but you will not call it marriage......Most gay people could care less and the ones I know tell me the "Feel Good" Liberals and few militant gays don't speak for them...................
    It isn't a lifestyle. And isn't this just some hateful conservatives and a few militant religious fanatics attempt to shove a religious agenda down the throat of America?
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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by veganshawn View Post
    It isn't a lifestyle. And isn't this just some hateful conservatives and a few militant religious fanatics attempt to shove a religious agenda down the throat of America?
    Exactly. No one is trying to force a "gay agenda" down anyone's throat. People are still and will always (hopefully) be entitled to their own opinion and own beliefs. It is those who are opposed to gay marriage who are the ones that are trying to force their belief system on everyone else, because they are saying that everyone has to live according to their value system. The same cannot be said of gay rights advocates, because no one is asking those opposed to gay marriage to change their opinion.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    There is a stigma attached to "civil unions" that makes them less than "marriage"...
    You've made the Christian argument, thankyou! Something I've stated on this board before as your hidden agenda.

    Civil unions ARE not marriage. Just as any same sex marriage would NOT be marriage. Whether Gavin Newsom likes it or not. So what must be the interest in gay advocates needing to declare their unions as marriage? They already have most of the legal benefits in California? What's the hidden agenda?...the beach head for a whole new set of radical gay lawyer legal maneuvers through the courts to eventually force the rest of us to treat your behaviors and lifestyles as equal to heterosexuals...whether we like it or not.

    Your side won't be placated regardless of how much we of the vast majority make reasonable concessions for your relative equality as a minority, as we have the last few decades, until some on your side can freely walk down streets and and in public media like tv, acting out your gay behaviors that many of the rest of us find repulsive. Behaviors many especially do not want exposed to their children. If your side continues to act so, I would predict a backlash by Americans is likely to occur.
    Last edited by 70s_guy; 11-06-08 at 09:19 PM.

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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    The bottom line is the people have spoken and they are against gay marriage.....They also voted it down in Arizona and Florida......As long as this is a Judo/Christian Nation that will happen........Almost every state has a DOMA or and amendment protecting marriage........Activist judges tried to change that in California and were shot down big time............
    "God Bless Our Troops in Harms Way."

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    Re: Ban on gay marriage in CA still unclear

    I have a feeling Supreme Court Justice Anthony Kennedy will be deciding for the whole country just how exactly this issue will be resolved.
    "Everyone has his axe to grind - his favorite fiction to pimp. We live in a world of hustlers and clowns."
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