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Congress will consider proposal to raise H-1B minimum wage to $100,000

Excon said:
Needs to be higher to discourage more.
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How about a higher unemployment tax for each employed, to compensate US citizens not employed?
 
Sherman123 said:
What if that just encourages more off-shoring? It would be great if it worked out, but my fear is that it ends up as a lose-lose because we'll miss out on the payroll, income, and other associated taxes derived from these lower income H1-B employees.
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There are other things planned to make it less tempting to move more jobs out of the USA, and actually return them.

I was skeptical about Trump, but I think he will pull this off!
 
DifferentDrummr said:
Get rid of the H1-B program entirely. It isn't even necessary.

Foreign scientists and engineers who truly can do things that their American counterparts can't are able to come here on different classes of visas already. H1-B's are all for journeyman-level work.
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Considering it only requires a BS degree, think you might be right. When I was in a corporate engineering department, my H-1B coworkers were all PHD's.
 
PeteEU said:
LOL no you have not... far far from it. That is not saying there aint no good US coders or downplaying the role of American in software development, but the software industry is driven by people from all over the world. Hell the Internet (as we know it) was invented by a Brit in Switzerland. And no, naturalized Americans dont count as "American coders" if their education and start happened abroad.
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Dude come on.

1. Most of the world's best universities are in the United States. People come from all over the world to be educated here.

2. Google, Microsoft, Oracle, VMWare, Apple, Facebook, Twitter, Ebay, Amazon, Wordpress, Tumblr, Netflix, Stack Overflow..... All US companies, primarily developed by U.S. coders. Look at the Alexa top 100. The US owns it.

IT is the one sector that the United States really kicks ass at. The really good IT talent around the world that does want to come here will not come here for much less than 100k a year anyway. The current program is just a way for companies to bring in cheap labor.
 
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Mac77 said:
In that it's inexcusable that US government databases are an open book to our friends and enemies alike

And the rollout of the embarressenly flawed ObamaCare website did not help the image of IT pros in America

Or at least not the ones working for obama
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The vast majority of hacks are not due to bad code, they are due to people doing stupid things. Most are phishing attacks or brute force. Moreover, the government hardly ever gets good IT people. If you are a really good IT professional, that thrives on creativity and innovation, why on earth would you take a job working for the government?
 
How can republicans support this while being opposed to minimum wage?
 
If we continue at the rate we are going, the H-1B workers are going to displace our undocumented/illegal workers from the south.

We can't have that now.....can we?
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
You don't seem to understand. We already produce better IT people than anywhere else on earth. For example, in my department our sites do around 100 million page views a month. We build and support that infrastructure with a group of less than 20 people. That includes developers, front end guys, and Sys Admins. You don't find that kind of talent anywhere else in the world. In IT, America flat out kicks ass.
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But in India they can do it for 1/3 the cost.

Following Obama Justice Departmant Guidance, Disney Fires American Workers and Replaces them with People From India. Loretta Lynch promised not to pursue federal charges.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
Dude come on.

1. Most of the world's best universities are in the United States. People come from all over the world to be educated here.
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Yes according to Americans themselves.. They are also the most expensive and most importantly....prestigious because of myth and movies. Does not mean they are "the best", since it is hard to actually quantify what "best" means in university rankings. Most surveys are of companies and people who are asked "which do you think is the best".. hardly a real quantitative and empirical study.

2. Google, Microsoft, Oracle, VMWare, Apple, Facebook, Twitter, Ebay, Amazon, Wordpress, Tumblr, Netflix, Stack Overflow..... All US companies, primarily developed by U.S. coders. Look at the Alexa top 100. The US owns it.
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Yes and no. This is what most Americans dont understand. The US is and always has been the biggest market.. and that is very important. Before China became "China of today", the US was by far the biggest single market in the world. Money, and consumers were concentrated and because of this promoting new tech in the US to the consumer is far more easier then elsewhere in the world. This has attracted and still does, money and talent. Could Facebook have started in Europe? Frankly no.. not because we dont have the talent to do a Facebook, because we have.. but the problem would be the market aspect. If started in France, it would be in French, which would be unknown to the rest of the world. Same with Germany. So start it in the UK.. yes but that would be in a relative small market of say 60 million consumers and back in the day of the start of Facebook, you did not have the technical infrastructure that was really needed.

America has always been great to take an idea, from anywhere, and market it to the masses.. that is what made America great. But in many cases (not all), the actual "inventing" was done by non Americans. Yes not in Facebooks case, but in the Internets case yes. The worlds most used server software.. yes. But just because the companies are based in the US, or even started.. does not mean that the companies primary talent pool more and more comes from overseas.. not because of cost, but because that is where the talent is.

A good example. The UK has been the European and even the world center of computer game programming for quite a while. Is it because that the local talent was absolute great? Not really. Sure there are Brits who can do the job, but a lot of them actually come from all over the world.... even America.

This reminds me a lot of that new movie Hidden Figures. Was the race to the moon an American white mans game? No. There were black women who had considerable contribution to the moon shot, and of course lets not forget, that the whole basis for the American space program came from the Germans.

IT is the one sector that the United States really kicks ass at. The really good IT talent around the world that does want to come here will not come here for much less than 100k a year anyway. The current program is just a way for companies to bring in cheap labor.
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Kicks ass? Sure if you want to be that nationalistic and chest thumping, but try to look at it one more time. Who makes the best mobile phones in the world.. Apple? hardly. Best computers? Apple? Hardly.. who makes them? China, South Korea, Japan and so on. Does Apple create their software.. sure, but is it by a 100% pure American team? Hell no, not even close. Hell Google was founded by a Russian born and an American.. the world is not as black and white as you grew up thinking it was. Immigrants have had a massive impact on American business and technology if not the primary impact.

Plus a quick google on the salary of computer programmers in the US.

Starting salaries is from 44k to 130k. Average is 79k. Since the present cap is what.. 60k. Wait, so the average starting wage is higher than the cap, and the mimimum starting salary is way less than the cap. That basically means, if you raise it to 100k (the cap), then you push wages on average up, because the problem is not the wages, but the lack of talent! How do I know this? The average wage is already over the cap.. If it was a cost issue, then the average wage would be around 60k or under. It is not.
 
PeteEU said:
Yes according to Americans themselves.. They are also the most expensive and most importantly....prestigious because of myth and movies. Does not mean they are "the best", since it is hard to actually quantify what "best" means in university rankings. Most surveys are of companies and people who are asked "which do you think is the best".. hardly a real quantitative and empirical study.



Yes and no. This is what most Americans dont understand. The US is and always has been the biggest market.. and that is very important. Before China became "China of today", the US was by far the biggest single market in the world. Money, and consumers were concentrated and because of this promoting new tech in the US to the consumer is far more easier then elsewhere in the world. This has attracted and still does, money and talent. Could Facebook have started in Europe? Frankly no.. not because we dont have the talent to do a Facebook, because we have.. but the problem would be the market aspect. If started in France, it would be in French, which would be unknown to the rest of the world. Same with Germany. So start it in the UK.. yes but that would be in a relative small market of say 60 million consumers and back in the day of the start of Facebook, you did not have the technical infrastructure that was really needed.

America has always been great to take an idea, from anywhere, and market it to the masses.. that is what made America great. But in many cases (not all), the actual "inventing" was done by non Americans. Yes not in Facebooks case, but in the Internets case yes. The worlds most used server software.. yes. But just because the companies are based in the US, or even started.. does not mean that the companies primary talent pool more and more comes from overseas.. not because of cost, but because that is where the talent is.

A good example. The UK has been the European and even the world center of computer game programming for quite a while. Is it because that the local talent was absolute great? Not really. Sure there are Brits who can do the job, but a lot of them actually come from all over the world.... even America.

This reminds me a lot of that new movie Hidden Figures. Was the race to the moon an American white mans game? No. There were black women who had considerable contribution to the moon shot, and of course lets not forget, that the whole basis for the American space program came from the Germans.



Kicks ass? Sure if you want to be that nationalistic and chest thumping, but try to look at it one more time. Who makes the best mobile phones in the world.. Apple? hardly. Best computers? Apple? Hardly.. who makes them? China, South Korea, Japan and so on. Does Apple create their software.. sure, but is it by a 100% pure American team? Hell no, not even close. Hell Google was founded by a Russian born and an American.. the world is not as black and white as you grew up thinking it was. Immigrants have had a massive impact on American business and technology if not the primary impact.

Plus a quick google on the salary of computer programmers in the US.

Starting salaries is from 44k to 130k. Average is 79k. Since the present cap is what.. 60k. Wait, so the average starting wage is higher than the cap, and the mimimum starting salary is way less than the cap. That basically means, if you raise it to 100k (the cap), then you push wages on average up, because the problem is not the wages, but the lack of talent! How do I know this? The average wage is already over the cap.. If it was a cost issue, then the average wage would be around 60k or under. It is not.
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IT people can demand higher salaries because of the critical nature of their work to a company. For example, let's say you are a Sys Admin. If you don't do your job right, you very well could put the entire company out of production. Thus a skilled Sys Admin commands a high salary. The same is true for developers.

As to your market theory. American IT companies like Google or Facebook have little trouble with localization of their sites and products, so why would a French or Germany company have trouble with it? A German company could have produced a social network like FB and just localized the site to different markets. That is exactly what American companies do.

Finally, yes the American IT industry has a fair number of immigrants. This is precisely because the United States is the world's mecca for IT.

Look, if we were talking healthcare there is no way I would argue that the United States kicks ass. If we were talking about cars or hybrid technology, no way would I argue that the United States kicks ass compared to the rest of the world. If we were talking about communications, chemicals, or a whole array of industries I would not argue that the United States kicks ass compared to the rest of the world.

However, one sector where we do is IT.
 
OK, so he request 69 licenses for cooks, waiters, and housekeeping for peak season, under the H-2B visa.

He has to be able to stay competitive. He isn't if he has to pay more than his competition.

This guest worker program is one that is championed by democrats. What's wrong? Are republicans not allowed to use regulations loved by liberals?
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
Congress will consider proposal to raise H-1B minimum wage to $100,000 | Ars Technica

This is a great idea and I hope it passes. Corporations have been abusing the H-1B program for years. [/FONT][/COLOR]
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Its a start in the right direction. However I don't think those visas should exist. We are country of almost 320 million people,surely there are qualified Americans out there.And if there are no qualified Americans then those companies should train Americans,which is something companies used to do a long time ago.
 
Lord of Planar said:
Considering it only requires a BS degree, think you might be right. When I was in a corporate engineering department, my H-1B coworkers were all PHD's.
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Most PhD's are underemployed (in the US and worldwide). One look at the state of academia will explain why.
 
Blue_State said:
Technical jobs...technical pay.

My only issue with this is where is the American to take the job? If the minimum is 60k, I am sure a lot of Americans would want to make that. (I am not taking in job location into this thought). It just seems, if we kick out these people because a company will not want to pay them 100k for a job they deem is worth 60k...where is the American to take the job?

I ask because, as an American, I would rather hire an American for 60k then go through the H-1B program to pay a foreigner 60 k to do the same job. Am I missing something?
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there are people to do the job.
Disney just fired a whole ton of workers and brought in a ton of h1b guys.

those people will need jobs.

to get into that 60k category you really need to have the job skills to do it.
 
Lord of Planar said:
So, as usual. You are making things up again...

Par for the course...
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I'm not making up the fact that Trump, despite his "bring back American jobs to America" meme, is importing foreign workers for his Mar A Lago resort. In fact, I don't have to make up anything about Trump. His actions and words speak for themselves.
 
apdst said:
Oh, the race card card. :lamo
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The best description for it. Nobody suggested racism, and here you are whining about people crying racism.
 
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