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Apple CEO Says "Won't Bring Home Money Until Tax Rates are Fair". (1 Viewer)

Aristaeus said:
Taxes pay for your country to function as a first world country - and a pretty good one at that. Canada may have a higher tax rate than America (?), but it's a much nicer country as a result. Same applies for high tax countries like Denmark.
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Define "nicer." I love Canada, if I had a better job opportunity there I wouldn't mind immigrating there. However, I wouldn't say it's much "nicer" than the US. Do you equate being more liberal with a country being better? That's just bias. I also don't understand the Denmark pipe dream, it's a tiny country with a population less than 6 million people. It's not a global power, has no real responsibilities, and can take advantage of other nations due to it being a tiny dot on the map. It's hardly comparable to any larger country.
 
JumpinJack said:
Apple made the money for the most part from the Americans, thanks to the tax system, which pays for the roads to get to the Apple store, the electrical grid to use many Apple products, the lights to light the stores and homes to use the products, the cell towers and tv towers so users can use the products, the health care system so that many people are healthy enough to use their products and buy them, and the economic system so that Americans have the expendable income to pay for the pricey products that Apple sells.

Apple should pay its fair share of taxes that it made off the backs of working Americans. Greed is all it is.

Don't pay attention to the man behind the screen. He's full of it. Apple would have plenty of deductions and credits off the 40% nominal rate. Exxon and GE in some years pay ZERO taxes. But it's possible that once you seek to escape the taxes, it's too late to claim some of the deductions and credits the company would have gotten, had it declared the income when it made it.

Americans should stop buying Apple products. Let Apple earn its money in the country where it likes the tax rate.
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no thanks. i already survived the early 1970's oil embargo period of self-flagellation when we were encouraged to buy a crappy small American car instead of a reliable japanese model

do yourself a favor. buy best value. always
 
justabubba said:
as it turned out, there was NO scandal


maybe hillary will explore the facts of the matter before firing the acting IRS administrator whose organization did its job the way it was supposed to

back to the thread topic

apple is a multinational corporation whose obligation is to its shareholders; to maximize share value. why should the US government expect it to act in concert with US interests?
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No scandal? I think opinions differ on that one. Last thing I heard, the hide the weenie game came to an end when Lerner's emails were in fact found, contrary to sworn testimony.

Sent from my HTC6515LVW using Tapatalk
 
Gaea said:
I guess we have a fair tax code then.

People aren't taxed more because they're liberals or conservatives. Thank goodness.
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What about progressive? What about taxing certain behaviors, or rewarding certain behaviors? What is taxing the wealthy except a ideological reasoning? Or deducting charitable contribution?
 
Tettsuo said:
What is a fair tax rate? America already has the lowest effective rates in the world.Forbes Welcome
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We can argue the rate is too high, but Apple knew the job was tax-dangerous when they took it.

Apple would not be where it successfully is, both here and abroad, had it not been an American-based business entity. No matter where it makes the money, it owes foreign corporation tax to the American people.

The tax money is needed to, if for no other reason, help pay for the outsourcing/offshoring of American jobs done by Apple to keep the domestic tax rate from rising on the rest of us, including preventing it from rising on those who were outsourced/offshored by Apple.

Yes, some income tax rates on corporations need to be lowered.

But not foreign corporation tax on corporations who utilize wage-slave labor abroad to get an unfair price advantage selling those products back here in America and at the expense of American jobs.

We also need to make a rule on our corporations who operate abroad that if you make it there, you sell it there, thereby keeping economies of scale smooth no matter where they operate.

There's a lot we need to do in this area to bring prosperity to individual Americans who've been shorn of it over time by careless or blatantly exploitive business and government collusion.
 
Ontologuy said:
We can argue the rate is too high, but Apple knew the job was tax-dangerous when they took it.

Apple would not be where it successfully is, both here and abroad, had it not been an American-based business entity. No matter where it makes the money, it owes foreign corporation tax to the American people.

The tax money is needed to, if for no other reason, help pay for the outsourcing/offshoring of American jobs done by Apple to keep the domestic tax rate from rising on the rest of us, including preventing it from rising on those who were outsourced/offshored by Apple.

Yes, some income tax rates on corporations need to be lowered.

But not foreign corporation tax on corporations who utilize wage-slave labor abroad to get an unfair price advantage selling those products back here in America and at the expense of American jobs.

We also need to make a rule on our corporations who operate abroad that if you make it there, you sell it there, thereby keeping economies of scale smooth no matter where they operate.

There's a lot we need to do in this area to bring prosperity to individual Americans who've been shorn of it over time by careless or blatantly exploitive business and government collusion.
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Assuming a tax like that existed, even though it doesn't, where would that money go?

You say "help pay for the outsourcing/offshoring of American jobs". What does that mean?
 
Why should anyone pay taxes on money made overseas? Exactly why should the government have any claim to that money? If I move to lets say Germany and yet retain my US citizenship the US government will make me pay taxes back to the US even if I get nothing from them in any sort of way. How is that right? Why should Apple pay a dime in taxes on money that was earned elsewhere?
 
Ontologuy said:
But not foreign corporation tax on corporations who utilize wage-slave labor abroad to get an unfair price advantage selling those products back here in America and at the expense of American jobs.
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Here we go again with that stupid term. Slaves are not paid. People that earn a wage and are free to leave at any time are not slaves.
 
JumpinJack said:
Apple made the money for the most part from the Americans, thanks to the tax system, which pays for the roads to get to the Apple store, the electrical grid to use many Apple products, the lights to light the stores and homes to use the products, the cell towers and tv towers so users can use the products, the health care system so that many people are healthy enough to use their products and buy them, and the economic system so that Americans have the expendable income to pay for the pricey products that Apple sells.

Apple should pay its fair share of taxes that it made off the backs of working Americans. Greed is all it is.

Don't pay attention to the man behind the screen. He's full of it. Apple would have plenty of deductions and credits off the 40% nominal rate. Exxon and GE in some years pay ZERO taxes. But it's possible that once you seek to escape the taxes, it's too late to claim some of the deductions and credits the company would have gotten, had it declared the income when it made it.

Americans should stop buying Apple products. Let Apple earn its money in the country where it likes the tax rate.
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They pay billions. And their employees from CEO down to receptionist pay billions more. Whats their fair share? Just more?
 
cabse5 said:
*Snort* Isn't our tax code, now, based on political ideology? Isn't that why our tax code is 'miles' long? Isn't a regressive tax code (everyone pays the same tax rate regardless of income) or our current progressive tax code (tax rates increase with income) based on political ideology?
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Yes, thats why its unfair.
 
jonny5 said:
What about progressive? What about taxing certain behaviors, or rewarding certain behaviors? What is taxing the wealthy except a ideological reasoning? Or deducting charitable contribution?
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Imposing higher taxes on the wealthy is easily justifiable through one basic fact:

The higher a person's income is, the less likely it is that they will spend their entire income on goods & services. Therefore, there are decreasing marginal returns to the society for increased income.
 
American said:
Strawman; no one is say that. They want the tax to be fair. 40% isn't fair.
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Define "fair". What they want is for the tax to be as low as possible, preferably zero. Do you really think they'd come back if the tax was slashed to 20%, or 10%, or even 5%, and it was still cheaper to not come back?
 
It will never happen regardless of what the US congress sets as a new corporation tax. Simple reason.. Apple paid next to nothing overseas due to tax havens and great so called legal tax agreements with small nations. So for it to be "fair" the corporate tax rate in the US has to go to basically 0. That aint gonna happen. On top of that, as it stands now, Apple can pile on the debt to pay its shareholders and actually get a tax break for all the debt it has.. win win for them.

Apple is the poster child for corporate tax evasion and a symbol of a system designed by big corporations to avoid paying taxes, while letting the tax payer actually contribute to their bottom line. Hope Americans gonna love paying Apple stockholders money...
 
CanadaJohn said:
Typical liberal response. Your best advice is to learn how to play the system rather than demand the government take less of your income and wealth in the first place. Pathetic. You believe the government owns your income/wealth and it's up to the individual to go to the expense and time to figure out how best to recover some of the income/wealth the government stole in the first place. You're probably astonished that the government allows you to retain 57% of your income - damn fools, should be skimming more off of you, right?
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The second you start putting words into my mouth and making up strawmen about my beliefs, you become little more than a troll. I expected more from you. Oh well. :shrug:
 
Henrin said:
Here we go again with that stupid term. Slaves are not paid. People that earn a wage and are free to leave at any time are not slaves.
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"wage-slave" means you're a slave to your wages
 
Gaea said:
"wage-slave" means you're a slave to your wages
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So other than the rich who work for its own sake but don't need to, or those on the brink of retirement, the rest of us are all "wage slaves." That sort of rhetoric isn't useful.
 
Gaea said:
"wage-slave" means you're a slave to your wages
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How can you be a slave to something you're free to leave behind?
 
Northern Light said:
The second you start putting words into my mouth and making up strawmen about my beliefs, you become little more than a troll. I expected more from you. Oh well. :shrug:
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Laughable. I put it bluntly to you, the effect and actuality of what you posted, and you get offended because I nailed you dead on. That's fine - if I was you and posted your nonsense, I'd also run away and claim it wasn't what I said too.

Let's recap - you claimed I should get a good tax lawyer/accountant because there's lots of loopholes and tax refunds I could be enjoying and you claimed that those who whine about taxes are only those who aren't smart enough to apply for all the tax refunds/credits they're entitled to. That, my friend, bluntly speaking, means you have zero problem with the government taxing you as much as they want and then creating refund schemes that allow you to apply for tax credits or benefits to get some of your own money back that the government shouldn't have taken from you in the first place.

No wonder you're so embarrassed and need to run.
 
Gaea said:
Imposing higher taxes on the wealthy is easily justifiable through one basic fact:

The higher a person's income is, the less likely it is that they will spend their entire income on goods & services. Therefore, there are decreasing marginal returns to the society for increased income.
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Why is society entitled to a return on someones wages (and a higher return at that)? That sounds like an ideological judgement.

In fact, 'justifiable' is a ideological term. Just - based on or behaving according to what is morally right and fair. How do we decide what is just except through moral judgment? The alternative is a actually fair (equal) treatment. Taxes are applied to everyone the same, regardless of any difference. For example, how a membership fee works. Or a sales tax.
 
Henrin said:
How can you be a slave to something you're free to leave behind?
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That's where the term comes from - the people in those countries are not free to leave their job behind. Doing so would result in starvation/homelessness because those countries lack safety nets, and wages are low enough that people are not capable of saving anything.
 
jonny5 said:
Why is society entitled to a return on someones wages (and a higher return at that)? That sounds like an ideological judgement.

In fact, 'justifiable' is a ideological term. Just - based on or behaving according to what is morally right and fair. How do we decide what is just except through moral judgment? The alternative is a actually fair (equal) treatment. Taxes are applied to everyone the same, regardless of any difference. For example, how a membership fee works. Or a sales tax.
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"Fair" treatment is just as ideological as "progressive" treatment. Ideology is inherent in taxation.
 
Gaea said:
Imposing higher taxes on the wealthy is easily justifiable through one basic fact:

The higher a person's income is, the less likely it is that they will spend their entire income on goods & services. Therefore, there are decreasing marginal returns to the society for increased income.
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Next time you get a paycheck from a poor person, how about posting it?
 
Gaea said:
That's where the term comes from - the people in those countries are not free to leave their job behind. Doing so would result in starvation/homelessness because those countries lack safety nets, and wages are low enough that people are not capable of saving anything.
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That's still not slavery. Just because the alternative is starvation doesn't mean there is any force taking place or that the conditions amount to slavery.
 
Mason66 said:
You can hold money anywhere you wish. That is not the issue here.

This money was earned not held offshore which means taxes were paid in the country in which it was earned.

Would you be willing to pay taxes a second time when bringing in your money just for the fact that you are bringing it in to the country?
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No individual has any choice in the matter. No little person has any choice in the matter over whether they get to pay taxes and how. They can't simply tell the government to eat a bag of ****, because the IRS will go after them with zeal. So if I have to take my job overseas, then I'll be paying twice no matter what.

A multinational corporation? Well, as per usual, they're super-citizens with super-rights. So not only have they been able to hide the money over seas without violating the IRS' code, they can actually sit down with the IRS and demand a tax holiday. And because our government is owned by multinational corporations, they'll almost certainly eventually get it.
 
Henrin said:
That's still not slavery. Just because the alternative is starvation doesn't mean there is any force taking place or that the conditions amount to slavery.
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By the same rationale, we've never had slavery in the United States. After all, the "slaves" were able to run away from their plantations. It's just that they frequently died or suffered physically when they tried.



When you're forced to choose between work or death/extreme suffering, you're a slave. I'm sorry if the truth is too politically incorrect for you.
 
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