Bergdahl judge mulls dismissing case over McCain comments

Napoleon said:

Like I said, I doubt it's worth the hassle to post evidence you're not willing to see. 2 demotions and 2 reassignments for insubordination, conduct, and discpline issues is evidence. It's pretty clear that a unit has considerable issues with conduct when command wipes out all of its officers and the media continues to capture and catalog issues with the remaining soldiers. Btw - command wasn't responding to any report or claim from Bergdahl when it made those decisions. It was a decision based on observed behaviors either directly experienced or through the reports, and images publicly released by the media and the issues of discipline and conduct were further noted by the investigating officer assigned to Bergdahl's case. The fact that you attributed it solely to what Bergdahl claimed indicates you didn't even read the articles.

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First of all an infantry platoon only ever has one officer, so no the command didn't wipe out all its officers and as I already explained to you a unit excspecially one as small a platoon hot having an officer is not that big a deal. So no it's not clear that his unit was having considerable issues. That's simply you lack of knowledge on the topic showing.

And the other main reassignment was over some pictures taken of soldiers not wearing proper uniforms. Something that happens in pretty much every unit that is out away from its command. And according to your own link he was a popular and well respected leader who wasn't relieved until after Bergdahl want on his little walk. If you don't think that his disappearance had more to do with it then the photos then you just have your head in the sand.



And according to your own link the Army disagrees with Bergdahls claims stating his perceptions were completely off the mark. Doesn't sound to much like your claims are independently verified or proved.


Still nothing even hinting at the level of misconduct you were claiming earlier.

But at the end of the day it really doesn't matter as virtual no matter the level of misconduct outside of war crimes would make his story of wondering miles through Taliban controlled territory in an attempt to report misconduct believable. Excspecially considering the fact he already claimed prior to even leaving for Afghanistan that if things didn't go the way he liked he was going to head of into Afghanistan on his own.

Napoleon said:

Yeah, we all know the story - he and the GOP have been milking it for decades. Why anyone is so gullible to believe that blowing up your own ship and spending a few years in a rathole in Vietnam makes him a military genius is beyond comprehension.




Abandoning your post and desertion are not the same thing as outlined in a prior post. I didn't say he was a hero nor did I say that he shouldn't be discharged. Nobody died searching for Bergdahl - that myth was debunked ages ago.

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Talk about gullible. You should probably study up a bit on the the USS Forrestsl accident. It might keep you from making yourself look foolish. Here is a hint. He had virtually zero to do with the accident other then being in his plane on the flight deck.

Napoleon said:

Yeah, we all know the story - he and the GOP have been milking it for decades. Why anyone is so gullible to believe that blowing up your own ship and spending a few years in a rathole in Vietnam makes him a military genius is beyond comprehension.




Abandoning your post and desertion are not the same thing as outlined in a prior post. I didn't say he was a hero nor did I say that he shouldn't be discharged. Nobody died searching for Bergdahl - that myth was debunked ages ago.

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Facts are still facts. Do judges normally care what spectators sitting a courtroom think when they make a ruling? What makes McCain's thoughts any more important than what someone's Aunt Gertrude might think? There are rules and laws in place for a reason, and if the standard punishment is given for Bergdahl's actions - no more or no less - I'm in agreement with that. Anything else makes a mockery of our legal system.

braindrain said:

First of all an infantry platoon only ever has one officer, so no the command didn't wipe out all its officers and as I already explained to you a unit excspecially one as small a platoon hot having an officer is not that big a deal. So no it's not clear that his unit was having considerable issues. That's simply you lack of knowledge on the topic showing.

And the other main reassignment was over some pictures taken of soldiers not wearing proper uniforms. Something that happens in pretty much every unit that is out away from its command. And according to your own link he was a popular and well respected leader who wasn't relieved until after Bergdahl want on his little walk. If you don't think that his disappearance had more to do with it then the photos then you just have your head in the sand.



And according to your own link the Army disagrees with Bergdahls claims stating his perceptions were completely off the mark. Doesn't sound to much like your claims are independently verified or proved.


Still nothing even hinting at the level of misconduct you were claiming earlier.

But at the end of the day it really doesn't matter as virtual no matter the level of misconduct outside of war crimes would make his story of wondering miles through Taliban controlled territory in an attempt to report misconduct believable. Excspecially considering the fact he already claimed prior to even leaving for Afghanistan that if things didn't go the way he liked he was going to head of into Afghanistan on his own.

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Again, those are responses indicative of not reading the articles.

Napoleon said:

Again, those are responses indicative of not reading the articles.

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In other words you have no argument against what I said so you will just play silly games.

VanceMack said:

You dont get much more influential than the guy that signs the checks and sicks the JD on people. Sorry. You dont get to have it both ways.

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The president of the united states signs checks for my local police force? :shock: Who knew? :roll:

Know.. you don't get to have it both ways. You try to claim that Obama.. that's about as far removed from my local police force as one can be.. influences an officers trial/investigation.. because he makes a general comment about police.

Meanwhile.. a congressman.. that is sitting Chairman on the Armed Forces Committee. Actually states that in a particular case... if the suspect in a military court is not found guilty and punished, that he is going to convene a special investigation into the trial.

Yeah.. they aren't even in the same ballpark.. in the same town in the same country.

jaeger19 said:

The president of the united states signs checks for my local police force? :shock: Who knew? :roll:

Know.. you don't get to have it both ways. You try to claim that Obama.. that's about as far removed from my local police force as one can be.. influences an officers trial/investigation.. because he makes a general comment about police.

Meanwhile.. a congressman.. that is sitting Chairman on the Armed Forces Committee. Actually states that in a particular case... if the suspect in a military court is not found guilty and punished, that he is going to convene a special investigation into the trial.

Yeah.. they aren't even in the same ballpark.. in the same town in the same country.

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If you dont know the fed kicks down funding for your state and local law enforcement you better call somebody.

braindrain said:

You keep claiming that the misconduct of Bergdahls unit is well documented but after being asked multiple times you refuse to provide any evidence of that. I wonder why.

It doesn't take guts to do what he did, it takes extreme stupidity as well as being extremely naive. Those are not the same thing.

So tell us what in your experience makes the military a lousy institution.
I think your feelings on the military is why you believe his extremely unbelievable story as well as accept the claims of misconduct in his unit despite not being able to provide any evidence to support those claims. Extreme bias can make people believe things no rational person would.

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It's a typical liberal tactic. ' Peers in his Bergdahl's unit are pointing out his bad behavior. Bergdahl was part of the equation in Obama's release of 5 extremely dangerous taliban terrorists, therefore, in their minds, Bergdahl is innocent and they must destroy the messengers who claim he was a bad boy. Then when asked multiple times to show evidence of his accusers alleged misconduct, you get the following:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzN3yJXlWrg

ObamacareFail said:

It's a typical liberal tactic. ' Peers in his Bergdahl's unit are pointing out his bad behavior. Bergdahl was part of the equation in Obama's release of 5 extremely dangerous taliban terrorists, therefore, in their minds, Bergdahl is innocent and they must destroy the messengers who claim he was a bad boy. Then when asked multiple times to show evidence of his accusers alleged misconduct, you get the following:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzN3yJXlWrg

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I haven't seen anyone in this thread do what you describe. And you were provided evidence of the misconduct, which both of you haven't read.

jaeger19 said:

The president of the united states signs checks for my local police force? :shock: Who knew? :roll:

Know.. you don't get to have it both ways. You try to claim that Obama.. that's about as far removed from my local police force as one can be.. influences an officers trial/investigation.. because he makes a general comment about police.

Meanwhile.. a congressman.. that is sitting Chairman on the Armed Forces Committee. Actually states that in a particular case... if the suspect in a military court is not found guilty and punished, that he is going to convene a special investigation into the trial.

Yeah.. they aren't even in the same ballpark.. in the same town in the same country.

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There is more then enough evidence to put Bergdahl on trial in military court(court martial). Court martial proceedings will either find him guilty or innocent. Not forwarding the case to court martial proceedings would be a clear shirking of duties. If there are no court martial proceedings, I certainly hope that congress will hold inquiries. It would be part of it's oversight duties. Bergdahl's attorneys are just grasping at any straws they think are available. The problem is that military courts are not the same as civilian courts. Military courts are based on the US Code of Military Justice.

Napoleon said:

I haven't seen anyone in this thread do what you describe. And you were provided evidence of the misconduct, which both of you haven't read.

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Perhaps some day you might learn the difference between evidence and hearsay. When asked for evidence, just posting opinion based links does not qualify.

ObamacareFail said:

Perhaps some day you might learn the difference between evidence and hearsay. When asked for evidence, just posting opinion based links does not qualify.

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Only one was opinion based and the opinion of the investigating officer assigned to the case certainly does qualify.

Napoleon said:

McCain should have kept his mouth shut.

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politicians should keep their mouths shut tight while a case is still in front of a judge, they should only speak after the trial was held. Really stupid of McCain there.

Napoleon said:

Only one was opinion based and the opinion of the investigating officer assigned to the case certainly does qualify.

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Opinions do not count either. Evidence does. What the deserters fellow soldiers have to say however is admissible in court. They are witnesses.

Peter King said:

politicians should keep their mouths shut tight while a case is still in front of a judge, they should only speak after the trial was held. Really stupid of McCain there.

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I disagree...and I do not even like McCain. McCain's concern is that the due to pressure from Obama, the Army will not hold court martial proceedings at all because Obama wants to bury it. Whether you think Bowe is guilty or innocent, there is more then enough evidence to proceed with court martial hearings. If they do not, then they have made a mockery of the US Code of Military justice and congressional hearings should be held.

ObamacareFail said:

I disagree...and I do not even like McCain. McCain's concern is that the due to pressure from Obama, the Army will not hold court martial proceedings at all because Obama wants to bury it. Whether you think Bowe is guilty or innocent, there is more then enough evidence to proceed with court martial hearings. If they do not, then they have made a mockery of the US Code of Military justice and congressional hearings should be held.

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I do not mind McCain, I only disliked his choice for Palin, if he had chosen differently he might have won the presidency. But as said, politicians should hold their tongue when a case is still in front of a judge.

And I do not think Obama cares what happens to Berdahl, I doubt he cares very much about anything except helping Hillary win the white house to stick it to the republicans who have been stalling his reasonable judicial choice for the supreme court.

And I do not have a real opinion about Bergdahl, I agreed with people that he had to be brought home but besides from that I could care less. If he is guilty may he rot in jail, if he is not than so be it. As long as the trial is fair and if politicians speak up prior to even the trial you muddy the water and that should not happen.

Peter King said:

I do not mind McCain, I only disliked his choice for Palin, if he had chosen differently he might have won the presidency. But as said, politicians should hold their tongue when a case is still in front of a judge.

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McCain needed conservative credentials to have a chance of winning at all. That's why he picked Palin. McCain could have picked a better VP choice to gain conservative credentials. however Palin was not really the problem. He was. I think the outcome would have been the same no matter who he chose. The republican ticket had two things going against them.....a weak candidate at the top of the ticket(McCain)......and the novelty of the first viable African American candidate. African Americans turned out to vote in larger numbers then they ever had.

And I do not think Obama cares what happens to Berdahl, I doubt he cares very much about anything except helping Hillary win the white house to stick it to the republicans who have been stalling his reasonable judicial choice for the supreme court.

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Obama does not give a damn about Bergdahl on a personal level. Bowe merely served as a useful idiot for the sake of Obama's goal of emptying the prison in Guanatanamo Bay before he leaves office.In this case, he used him to justify the release of five extremely dangerous taliban terrorists. Obama was just too out of touch to work out how it was going to be seen by rank and file Americans. He truly thought that the dog and pony show he put on with Bergdahls parents on the White House lawn was going to come off as him gaining the release of an American hero. it did not work out that way. Rank and file Americans saw it as Obama releasing 5 dangerous terrorists in trade for a pathetic deserter.

And I do not have a real opinion about Bergdahl, I agreed with people that he had to be brought home but besides from that I could care less. If he is guilty may he rot in jail, if he is not than so be it. As long as the trial is fair and if politicians speak up prior to even the trial you muddy the water and that should not happen.

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My point is that Court martial proceedings should go forward. If he is guilty, he will be punished. If he is innocent, he will be exonerated His lawyers want to avoid a court martial altogether only because they know that the did desert his unit and the military would have a good case against him.