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Obama proposes a record 4.1 trillion dollar Budget

RetiredUSN said:
No......Congress did, and Obama knew the courts were in line with LaPierre & Congress.
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Are you implying that Obama did not sign the law allowing firearms onto federal land? That somehow Congress did it by themselves?
 
MrT said:
Roughly 2/3rds of which we owe to ourselves.
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So who are we? We the people own those Treasury bonds that have to be converted to Cash or do you know a grocery store or real estate venture that takes treasury bonds in payment for services or property? You don't seem to grasp the issue at all. It is going to take trillions in cash to fund the unfunded debt we owe ourselves and where is that money coming from?
 
Conservative said:
Please tell me the relevance of Debt to GDP in a private sector economy where only 20% of GDP is govt. spending?
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First, this is a mixed economy, not a "private sector economy."

The relevance is very simple — as I keep repeating, you pay current obligations with currently viable resources.
 
mmi said:
First, this is a mixed economy, not a "private sector economy."

The relevance is very simple — as I keep repeating, you pay current obligations with currently viable resources.
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Name for me the components of GDP before continuing to make foolish statements. This is an economy dependent on the private sector and it is the taxpayers that fund the debt service taking more and more out of the economy moving it closer to Europe
 
Conservative said:
For those who are taking victory laps over Obama cutting the deficit in half down to still record high deficits here is another indication that Obama doesn't care about the deficit, doesn't believe the economy is as strong as supporters want to believe, and continues to promote his European style socialist economic model

Obama sends Congress record $4.1T budget plan | Fox News
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Lets ignore the price tag for a moment. He also proposes

-2.6 trillion in new taxes
-increase the deficit to 800 billion
-additional 6 trillion in debt
-6 trillion just in interest, which means we would be spending more on interest than the entire defense budget

back to spending, outlays increase to 6.5 trillion. Not that this would ever pass.
 
Conservative said:
It is going to take trillions in cash to fund the unfunded debt we owe ourselves and where is that money coming from?
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"Unfunded debt"? You have no idea what yer talking about, as always. Our debt/GDP ratio is back down below pre-Reagan levels. If we can avoid another round of destructive SSE policies, we'll be just fine.

Conservative said:
Name for me the components of GDP before continuing to make foolish statements.
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Do it yerself. I won't advise you to stop making foolish statements because it's obvious you won't.

jonny5 said:
He also proposes …
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Those figures are over ten years.
 
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mmi said:
"Unfunded debt"? You have no idea what yer talking about, as always. Our debt/GDP ratio is back down below pre-Reagan levels. If we can avoid another round of destructive SSE policies, we'll be just fine.
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You are right, you are a legend in your own mind, SS and Medicare Fund has trillions in IOU's which of course don't matter to people like you until you demand the dollars for those IOU's. I don't understand and never will understand people like you whose loyalty to liberalism has been proven to be an absolute failure and yet you continue to support the ideology

$2.5 trillion in Social Security bonds stored in filing cabinet in downtown Parkersburg, W.Va. | The Columbus Dispatch
 
mmi said:
"Unfunded debt"? You have no idea what yer talking about, as always. Our debt/GDP ratio is back down below pre-Reagan levels. If we can avoid another round of destructive SSE policies, we'll be just fine.



Do it yerself. I won't advise you to stop making foolish statements because it's obvious you won't.



Those figures are over ten years.
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Since you are a big proponent of the CBO did you ever figure out what CBO projected the 2010-2011-2012 deficits would be and what they were actually?
 
Conservative said:
SS and Medicare Fund has trillions in IOU's
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Another stupid lie you repeat ad nauseum. Those programs are pay-as-you-go. There's no vesting, so by definition there can be no "unfunded liability."

>>I don't understand and never will understand people like you whose loyalty to liberalism has been proven to be an absolute failure and yet you continue to support the ideology

I will agree with a very broadly defined category of what you don't understand and never will understand.

Conservative said:
did you ever figure out what CBO projected the 2010-2011-2012 deficits would be and what they were actually?
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I already answered that. You might wanna consider consulting a neurologist.

Here, I'll help you:

http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...-jobless-rate-declines-27.html#post1065540110
 
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mmi said:
Another stupid lie you repeat ad nauseum. Those programs are pay-as-you-go. There's no vesting, so by definition there can be no "unfunded liability."

I don't understand and never will understand people like you whose loyalty to liberalism has been proven to be an absolute failure and yet you continue to support the ideology

I will agree with a very broadly defined category of what you don't understand and never will understand,.
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Those programs WERE pay as you go until LBJ put the money on budget and the money spent on other programs other than SS and Medicare. How do you explain the IOU's in a pay as you go system? Borrowing the money still has to be paid back.
 
Conservative said:
Those programs WERE pay as you go until LBJ put the money on budget
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They still are.

>>How do you explain the IOU's in a pay as you go system?

I don't. I say they don't exist. They WOOs — we owe ourselves.

>>Borrowing the money still has to be paid back.

And the Trust Fund is collecting interest on those bonds, so it's a wash.
 
mmi said:
They still are.

>>How do you explain the IOU's in a pay as you go system?

I don't. I say they don't exist. They WOOs — we owe ourselves.

>>Borrowing the money still has to be paid back.

And the Trust Fund is collecting interest on those bonds, so it's a wash.
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What is it about liberalism that creates this kind of loyalty? Didn't read the article I posted, did you?

Like all liberals you don't seem to understand that those bonds have to be funded so where does the cash come from on top of the 4.1 trillion Obama wants?
 
mmi said:
They still are.

>>How do you explain the IOU's in a pay as you go system?

I don't. I say they don't exist. They WOOs — we owe ourselves.

>>Borrowing the money still has to be paid back.

And the Trust Fund is collecting interest on those bonds, so it's a wash.
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Do people like you ever admit when they are wrong and proven wrong? The pay for those IOU's along with interest has to be done in cash. Where is that cash going to come from?
 
Conservative said:
What is it about liberalism that creates this kind of loyalty?
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A history of successful humanitarian progress that goes back millennia. Since reactionaries always lose in the end, why do you chose to adhere to that philosophy?

>>Didn't read the article I posted, did you?

I don't need to. I understand the issues involved. What's in there that you want me to consider?

>>you don't seem to understand that those bonds have to be funded so where does the cash come from on top of the 4.1 trillion Obama wants?

As I said, the bonds in the fund are collecting interest — it's a wash.

Conservative said:
Do people like you ever admit when they are wrong and proven wrong?
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Sure, and if you ever prove me wrong, you'll find that I do.

>>The pay for those IOU's along with interest has to be done in cash. Where is that cash going to come from?

Again, there are no IOUs.
 
mmi said:
A history of successful humanitarian progress that goes back millennia. Since reactionaries always lose in the end, why do you chose to adhere to that philosophy?

>>Didn't read the article I posted, did you?

I don't need to. I understand the issues involved. What's in there that you want me to consider?

>>you don't seem to understand that those bonds have to be funded so where does the cash come from on top of the 4.1 trillion Obama wants?

As I said, the bonds in the fund are collecting interest — it's a wash.



Sure, and if you ever prove me wrong, you'll find that I do.

>>The pay for those IOU's along with interest has to be done in cash. Where is that cash going to come from?

Again, there are no IOUs.
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There you go folks a liberal in total denial. Is there any wonder we have problems in this country when we have people like this that ignores actual verifiable information and apparently believe we go to the money tree to fund those SS IOU's stored. It is a sign of maturity to admit when you are wrong, a trait most liberals don't seem to have. You show once again why you are a waste of time
 
mmi said:
The deficit as a percentage of GDP is down by 75% under Obummer.

Since 2011, the Congress has authorized one percent less in spending than the president has requested, while responsible management by the administration has reduced actual expenditures by an additional five percent.

Federal outlays over the past seven years under the Negro are up by only 4.8%. Now that the economy has recovered from a second GOP SSE Great Recession, it's only prudent that we again make smart investments in America's future, targeting education, research, and infrastructure.

SSE policies applied under Reagan and Bush43 are responsible for the large national debt piled up over the past thirty years. If you want to avoid that and vote for another GOP candidate for POTUS, you have one viable choice — John Kasich of Ohio.

Regarding the OP's claim of "still record high deficits," the shortfall last year was $439 billion, while the record was 43's $1.412 trillion.
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not really as the deficit was around 450b dollar or so when he took office.
it soared to 4 years of almost 1 trillion dollar deficits each year. even with republicans opposing his constant new spending bills
it still hasn't gotten lower than when he took office. it is around 485b or so.

he hasn't lowered the deficit at all.
 
mmi said:
A history of successful humanitarian progress that goes back millennia. Since reactionaries always lose in the end, why do you chose to adhere to that philosophy?

>>Didn't read the article I posted, did you?

I don't need to. I understand the issues involved. What's in there that you want me to consider?

>>you don't seem to understand that those bonds have to be funded so where does the cash come from on top of the 4.1 trillion Obama wants?

As I said, the bonds in the fund are collecting interest — it's a wash.



Sure, and if you ever prove me wrong, you'll find that I do.

>>The pay for those IOU's along with interest has to be done in cash. Where is that cash going to come from?

Again, there are no IOUs.
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you are 100% wrong.

The federal government has a ton of bonds that are owed to the SS fund and countries and other organizations.
the SS bonds happen to be stored at the FBI center right outside of Morgantown, WV in Fairmont.
of course the bonds are only good for the SS fund and no one else can claim them.

the interest on the US debt must be paid and it is paid in cash.
so he is correct to ask you where the money is going to come from.

from what I have seen the federal government owes the SS fund 2.7 trillion dollars.

bonds, CD's and treasury notes technically are IOU's.
 
Conservative said:
ignores actual verifiable information
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You've verified nothing, except some things about yerself that can't be stated here.

Did you notice that the artilce you posted a link to is six years old?

The Social Security OASDI program does, in fact, have unfunded obligations, but there are no unfunded liabilities. The distinction is that a liability is a present obligation, while the imbalance here involves future obligations, which are backed by the full faith and credit of the U.S. government.

Yes, additional future revenues will be required. And if we can stop applying SSE policies, which have been responsible for just about all this debt we've been piling up, we'll have no problem generating them. Notice that federal revenues under Obummer are projected by CBO to have increased by 97% when he leaves office in eleven months.

ludin said:
not really
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Yes, really.

>>the deficit was around 450b dollar or so when he took office.

As I said, CBO reported it as $1.2 trillion in Jan 2009. Obummer added $200 billion to avoid a worldwide depression. Can ya blame him?

>>he hasn't lowered the deficit at all.

2009 — $1.412 trillion

2015 — $439 billion, down by 70%. How do you define "lowered"?

ludin said:
The federal government has a ton of bonds that are owed to the SS fund
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No, the SS Trust Fund holds treasury bonds, on which it collects interest. Nothing is "owed to the SS fund."

>>he is correct to ask you where the money is going to come from.

Same place it comes from now — withholding taxes.

>>from what I have seen the federal government owes the SS fund 2.7 trillion dollars.

Whatever the amount is, it's money that taxpayers owe themselves.

>>bonds, CD's and treasury notes technically are IOU's.

In this case, WOOs — we owe ourselves.
 
Conservative said:
For those who are taking victory laps over Obama cutting the deficit in half down to still record high deficits here is another indication that Obama doesn't care about the deficit, doesn't believe the economy is as strong as supporters want to believe, and continues to promote his European style socialist economic model

Obama sends Congress record $4.1T budget plan | Fox News
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Deficits wouldn't be a problem if the Republicon$ would agree to make the rich pay their fair share.
 
mmi said:
Yes, really.

>>the deficit was around 450b dollar or so when he took office.

As I said, CBO reported it as $1.2 trillion in Jan 2009. Obummer added $200 billion to avoid a worldwide depression. Can ya blame him?
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yet he didn't avoid it interesting. in fact 4 years of trillion dollar deficits did little.

>>he hasn't lowered the deficit at all.

2009 — $1.412 trillion

2015 — $439 billion, down by 70%. How do you define "lowered"?
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Umm yea no, you don't get to sky rocket the deficit and then claim you lowered it when well you didn't
really lower it. the deficit was 450b when he came into office.

if anything the deficit only went down 11b dollars largely in part to the republican congress
not allowing Obama to continue his wild spending spree.

so you can actually thank republicans for keeping the deficit lower than what it should have been.

No, the SS Trust Fund holds treasury bonds, on which it collects interest. Nothing is "owed to the SS fund."
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you would be wrong. the federal government owes the SS fund about 2.7 trillion dollars.
it is paying that bank in the form of treasury bonds, and you are wrong money is owed to the SS fund
because the money was borrowed.

Whatever the amount is, it's money that taxpayers owe themselves.
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No it is money that the federal government has borrowed from the SS fund.

>>bonds, CD's and treasury notes technically are IOU's.

In this case, WOOs — we owe ourselves.
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yet you are claiming the exact opposite that it isn't owed anything
you were proven wrong.
 
MrT said:
Gun rights expanded under the Obama administration. They did not contract. Just wanted to point that out.
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Gun rights expanded thanks to a republican congress. You can also thank the republican congress for reigning in spending.
 
ThaiBoxer said:
Deficits wouldn't be a problem if the Republicon$ would agree to make the rich pay their fair share.
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top 50% wage earners in this country pay 98% of the taxes.
where do you wish more to come from?

the top 1% already pay 37% of the income tax.
the top 10% pay 55%
and the top 25% pay 80%.

seems they are paying their fair share.
 
ThaiBoxer said:
Deficits wouldn't be a problem if the Republicon$ would agree to make the rich pay their fair share.
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What do you believe the fair share is that the rich should pay? I keep hearing that statement over and over again but what Obama proposed wouldn't fund the government for 3 days
 
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