Four Dead In Canada High School Shooting

Re: 5 Dead In Canada High School Shooting

I followed up on the story a little further and found out that he shot his two younger brothers before heading off to the school.

Geeees!

I wonder what happened to make this kid go off like that?

Re: 5 Dead In Canada High School Shooting

Quag said:

Actually it was a Liberal govt that enacted the long gun registry with the claim it would only cost 1 million. It ended up costing 1 billion and as you said was pretty useless. The Conservative govt scrapped it. The Quebec provincial govt went to court to get the info to set up their own but lost and now is considering just making one themselves. The present Liberal party has no plans to reintroduce it federally as far as I know.

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It was? Damn. Must have been on Chretien's watch. And I liked the guy, too.

Re: 5 Dead In Canada High School Shooting

RetiredUSN said:

I followed up on the story a little further and found out that he shot his two younger brothers before heading off to the school.

Geeees!

I wonder what happened to make this kid go off like that?

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An isolated community, way up there in the bush, who knows? More information coming, no doubt, but in a place like that mental issues could go undiagnosed and untreated.
I read that the mayor's daughter was a teacher and one of the victims. I bet everyone in town knows or is related to all the victims, and the shooter, too.

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RetiredUSN said:

I followed up on the story a little further and found out that he shot his two younger brothers before heading off to the school.

Geeees!

I wonder what happened to make this kid go off like that?

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Sometimes things just don't make sense. What the hell is wrong with people.

The teacher was only 23 years old and just got started with her career. Now that is sad.
My own daughter teaches in Canada so this hits close to home.

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american said:

plenty of canadians have politicized things on this board.

this isn't a sympathy thread. I don't remember anyone holding back on sandy hook.

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"Timmy did it first" has never been a valid excuse for bad behavior. Check with your mama on this.

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The gun issue is really irrelevant. There were virtually no gun laws in the 1950s, guns could be purchased mail order from magazines, and still nobody shot up schools.
The reason why this is a current phenomena is so much bigger than guns, but most people want an immediate solution to every problem, so they overly simplify what the causes are.

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American said:

Canada should ban guns.

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Honestly. This is bad even for you.

Re: 5 Dead In Canada High School Shooting

RetiredUSN said:

I followed up on the story a little further and found out that he shot his two younger brothers before heading off to the school.

Geeees!

I wonder what happened to make this kid go off like that?

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It is very small and very isolated town quite literally in the middle of nowhere, I would assume extreme depression.

Re: 5 Dead In Canada High School Shooting

TurtleDude said:

I didn't see any information as to what sort of weapon was used so whether its an indictment of Canada gun laws or not is hard to say. What I did find interesting was that there apparently have been some murders in canada with machine guns-in the USA we have had maybe two in 80 years with legally owned machine guns. Of course it doesn't say and I don't know if you can legally possess a machine gun in Canada

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I doubt that very much as something like that would have made the news, but even if there was I am going to say it was probably the mafia.

My condolences to the family that lost three sons yesterday - two innocently at the hands of a third - who knows the reason or cause. My condolences also to the family of the 23 yr old teacher who happened to be the daughter of the Mayor of this small community. Very difficult to be the leader of a community, trying to bring comfort and security, when your own daughter was a victim.

As for the gun issue, this is a small northern community, adjacent to the boreal forest. Shotguns like the one used here are a way of life in such communities. Far different, in my view, from a shooting in an urban community where most of the inhabitants have no use for or experience with such weapons.

Tragic none the less that a young person, once again, takes other lives with him when he decides to end his own life.

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If this had happened in a small town in say Montana, it would be another chance to rail for tighter gun control, NOT seeing how many excuses we can make for the perpetrator.

Re: 5 Dead In Canada High School Shooting

Grand Mal said:

It was? Damn. Must have been on Chretien's watch. And I liked the guy, too.

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Yes it was Chretien.

RetiredUSN said:

What a waste.

Four Dead After Shooting at School in Canada - NBC News


4 Dead......sorry about my fat fingers.

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Very sorry to hear this. Not much detail at this point, so I hesitate to speculate or pontificate about what happened.



Since the gun aspect has already been addressed by some, I'll add just a few things. Canada's gun laws are rather strict compared to baseline US laws, but loose compared to much of Europe. Canadians possess several times as many firearms per-capita as is the case in the UK, but have a murder rate that is in the same ballpark. The entire country has far fewer murders than Chicago alone. IMO this is cultural... as I've said Canadians are too polite to murder each other too often.

Even so, no nation has a monopoly on the "lone nutcase" killer (if that is what this incident is, we don't really know anything yet). My sympathies to the nation and hopes for a carefully considered and rational response.

Re: 5 Dead In Canada High School Shooting

RetiredUSN said:

I followed up on the story a little further and found out that he shot his two younger brothers before heading off to the school.

Geeees!

I wonder what happened to make this kid go off like that?

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Man, that just makes it worse. Granted, I have cussed out a few relatives and once smacked a cousin upside the head, but killing your own younger brothers?? How awful, especially for the family.


Very sad incident.

Re: 5 Dead In Canada High School Shooting

j-mac said:

If this had happened in a small town in say Montana, it would be another chance to rail for tighter gun control, NOT seeing how many excuses we can make for the perpetrator.

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Apparently, a law abiding gun owner didn't lock up his gun.

Re: 5 Dead In Canada High School Shooting

Carjosse said:

It is very small and very isolated town quite literally in the middle of nowhere, I would assume extreme depression.

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Yeah,...high rates of unemployment and domestic violence can make for a very depressing environment...especially in a small isolated community.

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Very sorry for our Canadian neighbors.

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American said:

Plenty of Canadians have politicized things on this board. This isn't a sympathy thread. I don't remember anyone holding back on Sandy Hook.

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Really doesn't seem the best time for a tit for tat, though. Just my opinon. I'd never want the Canadians that I know of here to think we revel in this in some way. I don't and I know you don't either.

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So they have charged a 17 year-old with the crime. Since he is 17 no other details on his identity can be released because of the Youth Criminal Justice Act unless he is sentenced as an adult.

Re: 5 Dead In Canada High School Shooting

truthatallcost said:

The gun issue is really irrelevant. There were virtually no gun laws in the 1950s, guns could be purchased mail order from magazines, and still nobody shot up schools.
The reason why this is a current phenomena is so much bigger than guns, but most people want an immediate solution to every problem, so they overly simplify what the causes are.

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I agree. There are several reasons why things like this happen. Firstly, poor mental health treatment. When it comes to medical treatment, "early intervention" has been a buzzword for quite some time. If you catch something early, it is far easier to treat and causes less damage. Yet, often because of the stigma of mental health treatment, people either wait too long to get help... or don't go at all. We have yearly medical check ups. Yearly mental health check ups would be a good idea, also. Secondly, when we find younger people doing this, it is often due to either what I just said... poor mental health assessment and treatment, poor management in schools regarding bullying, or the desire for "hero worship". Though I believe that the last one is more rare, when kids see that the Columbine killers are worshiped by some and seen in a positive light, for kids with self-esteem issues, this seems like an easy way to be seen as "cool". Of course, this also goes back to my first point... mental health. Thirdly, we live in a society that practically fosters jealousy and anger. Everything is commercialized and in order to "fit in" one is "expected to have what others have. And the anger that is spewed from extremists on politicized issues often gives reason to the mentally unstable to act on that extremism.

The issue really isn't about guns. It's more about mental health and society in general.

Goshin said:

Very sorry to hear this. Not much detail at this point, so I hesitate to speculate or pontificate about what happened.



Since the gun aspect has already been addressed by some, I'll add just a few things. Canada's gun laws are rather strict compared to baseline US laws, but loose compared to much of Europe. Canadians possess several times as many firearms per-capita as is the case in the UK, but have a murder rate that is in the same ballpark. The entire country has far fewer murders than Chicago alone. IMO this is cultural... as I've said Canadians are too polite to murder each other too often.

Even so, no nation has a monopoly on the "lone nutcase" killer (if that is what this incident is, we don't really know anything yet). My sympathies to the nation and hopes for a carefully considered and rational response.

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Yeah I know. My family is from Canada (Newfoundland & PEI). They all have rifles & shotguns. I did a bit of hunting while I was stationed in Argentia NFLD. I think I had to wait until I was there at least 3 months before I could apply for a hunting license.

Re: 5 Dead In Canada High School Shooting

CaptainCourtesy said:

I agree. There are several reasons why things like this happen. Firstly, poor mental health treatment. When it comes to medical treatment, "early intervention" has been a buzzword for quite some time. If you catch something early, it is far easier to treat and causes less damage. Yet, often because of the stigma of mental health treatment, people either wait too long to get help... or don't go at all. We have yearly medical check ups. Yearly mental health check ups would be a good idea, also. Secondly, when we find younger people doing this, it is often due to either what I just said... poor mental health assessment and treatment, poor management in schools regarding bullying, or the desire for "hero worship". Though I believe that the last one is more rare, when kids see that the Columbine killers are worshiped by some and seen in a positive light, for kids with self-esteem issues, this seems like an easy way to be seen as "cool". Of course, this also goes back to my first point... mental health. Thirdly, we live in a society that practically fosters jealousy and anger. Everything is commercialized and in order to "fit in" one is "expected to have what others have. And the anger that is spewed from extremists on politicized issues often gives reason to the mentally unstable to act on that extremism.

The issue really isn't about guns. It's more about mental health and society in general.

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There has been a radical change in people since the 60's & 70's. People are more brazen, mean, and in your face. More adults are acting like kids. Kids that used to go out and play, mostly sit around and text, play video games, and roam around the internet. The cell phone and computer are the new babysitters in many homes while the parents are at work. Kids are easily influenced.

Re: 5 Dead In Canada High School Shooting

RetiredUSN said:

There has been a radical change in people since the 60's & 70's. People are more brazen, mean, and in your face. More adults are acting like kids. Kids that used to go out and play, mostly sit around and text, play video games, and roam around the internet. The cell phone and computer are the new babysitters in many homes while the parents are at work. Kids are easily influenced.

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Technology has both been a plus and a minus for our society. On the plus side, we can access information and each other so much more easily than ever before. On the minus side, technology has taken the humanity out of interactions. I listen to how kids talk to each other via text. I watch how people talk to each other online. A lot of this stuff is quite mean. This really isn't the problem. The problem is that for many kids, this is their most active type of socialization, and if THAT is how they are learning the dos and don'ts of socializing with others, it is no wonder that we see kids acting out in the way that we do. They act like they do when the text or post online, which, because of distance and sometimes anonymity, forgets that there is another human on the other end of the technology. The solution isn't to take away technology. The solution is to teach responsibility for one's actions.

Re: 5 Dead In Canada High School Shooting

CaptainCourtesy said:

Technology has both been a plus and a minus for our society. On the plus side, we can access information and each other so much more easily than ever before. On the minus side, technology has taken the humanity out of interactions. I listen to how kids talk to each other via text. I watch how people talk to each other online. A lot of this stuff is quite mean. This really isn't the problem. The problem is that for many kids, this is their most active type of socialization, and if THAT is how they are learning the dos and don'ts of socializing with others, it is no wonder that we see kids acting out in the way that we do. They act like they do when the text or post online, which, because of distance and sometimes anonymity, forgets that there is another human on the other end of the technology. The solution isn't to take away technology. The solution is to teach responsibility for one's actions.

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Tech matters dont get me wrong, but keep your eye on the ball, which is labeled "mental health". We are not ok. Nothing much means anything to us anymore, sure we are cleaver and have fun and and we get to live longer than we figured and the food is better and the internet is pretty cool.......but we are empty. We are not grounded anywhere anymore. And our kids are going to not have more crap easier than their parents for the first time in who knows how many generations so we jacked that up good.... In fact they maybe pretty well ****ed, who knows.Look around and America is pretty ratty too, things are done poorly to include our government, lots of things are shinny and are supposed to be something but really they are crap. And way way too many of us keep ourselves doped up to deal with our spiritual problem, many getting help from the doc and our insurance company to do it which is cool I suppose. Some still go to church, but not as many or as often as are claimed, and it does not help much. And we keep busy. And we try not to think about it. And if anything "triggers" us like maybe by saying the wrong things we lash out in anger and try to shut them down and if that does not work we skedaddle. A tolerant people we are not, we just claim to be. People with backbone we are not, we just play that we have one sometimes. And try not to think about how it can be that we claim to be the bestest humans that ever walked the Earth and yet we feel the way we do. Something aint right with the story, and it does not seem like the truth is something that we are going to like hearing so let's just move on shall we...

We are not well.

Note: just to be clear this is an observation on the collective, and while my personal experience is hugely important in these observations they do not directly describe my personal situation.

MKay?