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Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border {W:164]

Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

DDD said:
Tough bone's these Turkmens suddenly became, or were they always and only came to spot just now?
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PYD terrorists were with Assad at the first day, in return Assad left some area in north; and now PYD acts with Russia.

Turkmens had no power at first day, remained so for a long time; but when ,along with The IS, PYD terrorists attacked them, they start to defend their families and land.

Today Russia plays a game, and i mentioned it shortly; Turkmens are the main target for Russia, even The IS is not important for them as Turkmens.

Turkish PM made some remarks Whoeever bombs Turkmens, Arabs etc right next to us; we will hit them. This was made right after Putin's threat against Turkey in his speech.

Here is Amnesty International report in video, PYD terrorists clean captured land of civilian Turkmens:

 
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Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

Luftwaffe said:
Hell yeah, an American plane taking down a commie bastard plane. Beautiful!

Our technology is clearly superior :cool:
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Welcome to the Twentieth Century. :mrgreen:
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

Apocalypse said:
I've read an earlier report from Russian sources that one of the Russian helicopters trying to search and rescue the pilots have been shot down by Turkmen rebels, I've seen nothing about three more planes being shot down though. If you're getting this on rebel sources I would be more careful and wait a bit before believing it.
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You are right, but the same Russia claimed the downed jet was hit by Turkmens while Turkey said she hit unkown jet.
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

Fenton said:
Ironic coming from a guy that rubs elbows with the Iranian Mullahs.
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because usa is supporting isis and russia cant .:lamo
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

Higgins86 said:
This is why you don't play Chicken with Turkey.
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What will actually be learned is that you don't poke the bear. Russia isn't really known for it's controlled, humanitarian reactions.
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

HowardBThiname said:
Putin's making some strong allegations that Turkey is complicit in supporting terrorism.

Putin: Turkey protects ISIS, Russia backstabbed by terrorist accomplices | InSerbia News
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They very much do support terrorism.

"But in fact there is reason to believe that Erdoğan’s government does support the Syrian branch of al-Qaida (Jabhat al-Nusra) too, along with any number of other rebel groups that share its conservative Islamist ideology. The Institute for the Study of Human Rights at Columbia University has compiled a long list of evidence of Turkish support for Isis in Syria.

And then there are Erdoğan’s actual, stated positions. Back in August, the YPG, fresh from their victories in Kobani and Gire Spi, were poised to seize Jarablus, the last Isis-held town on the Turkish border that the terror organisation had been using to resupply its capital in Raqqa with weapons, materials, and recruits – Isis supply lines pass directly through Turkey.

Commentators predicted that with Jarablus gone, Raqqa would soon follow. Erdoğan reacted by declaring Jarablus a “red line”: if the Kurds attacked, his forces would intervene militarily – against the YPG. So Jarablus remains in terrorist hands to this day, under de facto Turkish military protection." (Turkey could cut off Islamic State’s supply lines. So why doesn’t it? | David Graeber | Comment is free | The Guardian)

"Documents and flash drives seized during the Sayyaf raid reportedly revealed links 'so clear' and 'undeniable' between Turkey and ISIS 'that they could end up having profound policy implications for the relationship between us and Ankara,' senior Western official familiar with the captured intelligence told the Guardian.

NATO member Turkey has long been accused by experts, Kurds, and even Joe Biden of enabling ISIS by turning a blind eye to the vast smuggling networks of weapons and fighters during the ongoing Syrian war." (http://www.businessinsider.com/links-between-turkey-and-isis-are-now-undeniable-2015-7)

See here as well: 'ISIS Sees Turkey as Its Ally': Former Islamic State Member Reveals Turkish Army Cooperation
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

So far, the only countries that have made genuine efforts to combat the Islamic State would be Russia and Iran.
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

Apocalypse said:
Video: Syrian rebels shooting at one of the Russian pilots as he's making his way to the land. (Nothing graphic)

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I stopped watching at the 0:22 mark; I'd seen enough. It's a miracle that either pilot survived.
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

Montecresto said:
Then why did you seem to dismiss Putin's claim?
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I wasn't dismissing Putin's claims. I just said he was making "strong allegations" and I left the link so other could read it. At least, I didn't mean to come across that way.
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

Mr. Invisible said:
They very much do support terrorism.

"But in fact there is reason to believe that Erdoğan’s government does support the Syrian branch of al-Qaida (Jabhat al-Nusra) too, along with any number of other rebel groups that share its conservative Islamist ideology. The Institute for the Study of Human Rights at Columbia University has compiled a long list of evidence of Turkish support for Isis in Syria.

And then there are Erdoğan’s actual, stated positions. Back in August, the YPG, fresh from their victories in Kobani and Gire Spi, were poised to seize Jarablus, the last Isis-held town on the Turkish border that the terror organisation had been using to resupply its capital in Raqqa with weapons, materials, and recruits – Isis supply lines pass directly through Turkey.

Commentators predicted that with Jarablus gone, Raqqa would soon follow. Erdoğan reacted by declaring Jarablus a “red line”: if the Kurds attacked, his forces would intervene militarily – against the YPG. So Jarablus remains in terrorist hands to this day, under de facto Turkish military protection." (Turkey could cut off Islamic State’s supply lines. So why doesn’t it? | David Graeber | Comment is free | The Guardian)

"Documents and flash drives seized during the Sayyaf raid reportedly revealed links 'so clear' and 'undeniable' between Turkey and ISIS 'that they could end up having profound policy implications for the relationship between us and Ankara,' senior Western official familiar with the captured intelligence told the Guardian.

NATO member Turkey has long been accused by experts, Kurds, and even Joe Biden of enabling ISIS by turning a blind eye to the vast smuggling networks of weapons and fighters during the ongoing Syrian war." (Links between Turkey and ISIS are now 'undeniable' - Business Insider)

See here as well: 'ISIS Sees Turkey as Its Ally': Former Islamic State Member Reveals Turkish Army Cooperation
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Is it the same Turkey you claim supporting terrorism?
Iraqi Peshmerga fighters have arrived in Turkey ahead of their planned deployment to the Syrian border town of Kobane, where their fellow Kurds are locked in battle with Islamic State (IS) militants.

The troops landed at Sanliurfa airport in south-eastern Turkey amid tight security.

A convoy of white buses escorted by armoured jeeps and police cars left the airport shortly afterwards.
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Islamic State: Kurdish Peshmerga fighters arrive in Turkey en route to Kobane - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)


Russian FM issiued notification that No Russian should visit Turkey.
 
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Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

HowardBThiname said:
I wasn't dismissing Putin's claims. I just said he was making "strong allegations" and I left the link so other could read it. At least, I didn't mean to come across that way.
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I see. My apology, it did leave the impression that you thought it to be wrong.
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

DDD said:
And this measure is used indefinitely? I ask because Russia infiltrated Turkish airspace 10 times by now!
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Russia had done same in Europe with RAF used to them doing so, and had made them turn back more than once. What surprises me is the other EU member states. To even approach the UK the Russians have to fly over their air space. That one fact sure as hell does not raise any confidence in their abilities.
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

nota bene said:
I stopped watching at the 0:22 mark; I'd seen enough. It's a miracle that either pilot survived.
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Turkish army reporting they killed both of them in their parachutes as they were descending.
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

Putin said:

"They were carrying out an operation against Isis [Islamic State] in the mountains of northern Latakia, where militants are focused."

BBC
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There's only one problem ... Putin is lying. ISIS is not challenging Assad in his stronghold province of Latakia and never did.


Syria-Map-ISIS.jpg
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

Simpleχity;1065284046 said:
Putin said:




There's only one problem ... Putin is lying. ISIS is not challenging Assad in his stronghold province of Latakia and never did.


Syria-Map-ISIS.jpg
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Any criticisms for the pilot killed dangling from his parachute?
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

donsutherland1 said:
The facts concerning what happened will need to be established, as it is a serious incident. However, typically when planes stray in another country's territory--and it is uncertain whether that was the case with the Russian plane (differing claims exist)--they are escorted out, not shot down.
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That's why the question needs to be asked depending on what the facts are...

Has Turkey lost its ****ing mind?

Taking such unilateral and aggressive action against a world power such as Russia without consulting the alliance to which they belong exclusively to oppose Russian influence is a massive error in judgment.

Agree we need more facts but... When I read this I let out an "oh ****!" And my wife was looked at me funny.
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

Apocalypse said:
As I've mentioned above I've seen the video that Reuters are referring to, and the pilot's heavy injuries seem to strongly imply that he was killed, probably by being shot at. The second video showing the rebels firing at the Russian pilot seem to indicate that this was the pilot that was killed. Yes, it's a clear violation of the Geneva Conventions. Frankly, I don't think they care much about that.
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Do you imagine for a moment that these medieval savages have even heard of the Geneva convention ?
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

Phoenix One UK said:
Russia had done same in Europe with RAF used to them doing so, and had made them turn back more than once. What surprises me is the other EU member states. To even approach the UK the Russians have to fly over their air space. That one fact sure as hell does not raise any confidence in their abilities.
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The normal MO for the Russian Bear bombers was to approach the UK from around the North Cape Norway from bases around Murmansk and Archangel. I was intimately involved with these activities during my time in the RAF during the Cold war. They do not approach across the territory of continental Europe as a rule
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

Montecresto said:
Any criticisms for the pilot killed dangling from his parachute?
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The pilot had his orders.

When Putin lies, it deserves exposure.
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

DDD said:
It should also be noted that Russians claim that their jet was shot down from the ground, and not from Turkish jets (which would have been "shot from air combat" or so). So, are Turks trying to defend Turkmens by claiming responsibility of the shot Russian jet? Or is Russia chickened up to accept that a NATO member shot their jets and resorts to attributing Turkmens (a less dangerous adversary) instead?

Either way, bad for the Turkmen's!
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At the time the statement was released, much was uncertain about the details of how the plane was shot down. Russia has since released an updated statement:

Russian Su-24 aircraft shot down by Turkish F-16 fighter on its way to the Hmeymim airbase

The Russian Su-24 aircraft was shot down on its way to the Hmeymim airbase in the territory of the Syrian Arab Republic by a Turkish F-16 fighter.

Analysis of the objective monitoring data definitely showed that there had not been any violation of the Turkish air space.
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http://eng.syria.mil.ru/en/index/syria/news/more.htm?id=12066651@egNews

As noted previously, key details won't be known until all the credible and relevant data are reviewed. Such details include whether or not the Russian plan had actually crossed into Turkish air space. Moreover, even if it had done so, if it was attacked when it was in Syrian air space and while moving away from Turkey, that could raise additional issues.
 
Re: Turkey shoots down Russian war plane on Syria border

American said:
I doubt serious that Turkey didn't consider this when they decided to shoot down a plane of the Russian military.
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I don't know what the actual circumstances were. Until the evidence has been reviewed, there are simply competing claims and a lot of questions that need to be answered.
 
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