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Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New York

blackjack50

blackjack50

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The New York State attorney general on Tuesday ordered the two biggest daily fantasy sports companies, DraftKings and FanDuel, to stop accepting bets from New York residents, saying their games constituted illegal gambling under state law.
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http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/11/1...to-stop-taking-bets-in-new-york.html?referer=

What is the deal with this? Why are they opposed to fan duel? The claim is that it isn't a game of skill...which is quite silly. It is a game of brain power. When will a player get injured? Well...you CAN pick players who aren't usually injured. Weather? Well...don't rely heavily on players who play poor in certain conditions. You need to know who is doing what and how.

I guess I just don't get it because I'm suspecting there is more to this, like who in New York wants their pockets lined. And who in New York is opposed to fan duel does line the pockets of. So. Anyone got more information?
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

This video by John Oliver may help:

Start it at 9 minutes for the chance thing specifically. But watch the whole video it is very informative.

Effectively it is a game of skill in the same way poker is a game of skill, but poker is considered gambling.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

stonewall50 said:
http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/11/1...to-stop-taking-bets-in-new-york.html?referer=

What is the deal with this? Why are they opposed to fan duel? The claim is that it isn't a game of skill...which is quite silly. It is a game of brain power. When will a player get injured? Well...you CAN pick players who aren't usually injured. Weather? Well...don't rely heavily on players who play poor in certain conditions. You need to know who is doing what and how.

I guess I just don't get it because I'm suspecting there is more to this, like who in New York wants their pockets lined. And who in New York is opposed to fan duel does line the pockets of. So. Anyone got more information?
Click to expand...

I can make the argument that picking horses is a game of skill because you can study the trends and look for horses that are unlikely to get hurt, or that pair well with particular jockeys, or that run faster on particular types of material.

There really is very little debate as to whether daily sports fantasy should qualify as gambling. It is gambling.

Now, with that said, if Draft Kings ever wanted to hire me as an attorney to defend their billion dollar business and is willing to foot the legal bills, then let me be clear. Daily Fantasy Sports is a game of skill that requires dedication to understanding numbers and trends!
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

I play it, and I'm from NY, so now only Draft Kings is still accepting lineups.. I play I win way more than I lose, but I will tell you that I would like to see some transparency and regulation. Currently there is no real oversight and that is what is scary!

Tim-
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

MrT said:
I can make the argument that picking horses is a game of skill because you can study the trends and look for horses that are unlikely to get hurt, or that pair well with particular jockeys, or that run faster on particular types of material.

There really is very little debate as to whether daily sports fantasy should qualify as gambling. It is gambling.

Now, with that said, if Draft Kings ever wanted to hire me as an attorney to defend their billion dollar business and is willing to foot the legal bills, then let me be clear. Daily Fantasy Sports is a game of skill that requires dedication to understanding numbers and trends!
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But somehow horse racing is still ok in New York?
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

stonewall50 said:
http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/11/1...to-stop-taking-bets-in-new-york.html?referer=

What is the deal with this? Why are they opposed to fan duel? The claim is that it isn't a game of skill...which is quite silly. It is a game of brain power. When will a player get injured? Well...you CAN pick players who aren't usually injured. Weather? Well...don't rely heavily on players who play poor in certain conditions. You need to know who is doing what and how.

I guess I just don't get it because I'm suspecting there is more to this, like who in New York wants their pockets lined. And who in New York is opposed to fan duel does line the pockets of. So. Anyone got more information?
Click to expand...

Really? So you don't think horse racing is gambling either then? That's exactly the way one handicaps horses, for heaven's sake.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

MrT said:
I can make the argument that picking horses is a game of skill because you can study the trends and look for horses that are unlikely to get hurt, or that pair well with particular jockeys, or that run faster on particular types of material.
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That isn't how you handicap horse racing.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

MaggieD said:
Really? So you don't think horse racing is gambling either then? That's exactly the way one handicaps horses, for heaven's sake.
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What does horse racing have to do with this? And no, you don't handicap horses based on who may get hurt.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

tres borrachos said:
What does horse racing have to do with this? And no, you don't handicap horses based on who may get hurt.
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You don't? Do you bet on horses? If you do, you know that weather is a very Important component, that previous injuries, their severity and when they happened are also taken into account. Handicapping the jockeys is also important.

To say that fantasy football isn't gambling doesn't make sense. To talk about the brain power it takes to handicap them and extrapolate that that somehow proves it isn't gambling doesn't make sense.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

MaggieD said:
You don't? Do you bet on horses? If you do, you know that weather is a very Important component, that previous injuries, their severity and when they happened are also taken into account. Handicapping the jockeys is also important.

To say that fantasy football isn't gambling doesn't make sense. To talk about the brain power it takes to handicap them and extrapolate that that somehow proves it isn't gambling doesn't make sense.
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I've been around race horses my entire life. My user name was a California bred recently retired horse. And no, "he may get hurt" is not part of true handicapping. ANY horse may get hurt. A track vet won't let a horse run who had sever previous injuries and is not sound. And I'm very much aware of the impact of the jockeys. Weather is important but smart trainers don't run their horses in weather that they do not prefer with few exceptions. If a horse doesn't take to mud, mostly he will not be run in mud. The only exceptions usually come with the graded stakes races.

I never said fantasy football wasn't gambling. FanDuel IS gambling. I'm pointing out that that this has nothing to do with horse racing.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

MaggieD said:
You don't? Do you bet on horses? If you do, you know that weather is a very Important component, that previous injuries, their severity and when they happened are also taken into account. Handicapping the jockeys is also important.

To say that fantasy football isn't gambling doesn't make sense. To talk about the brain power it takes to handicap them and extrapolate that that somehow proves it isn't gambling doesn't make sense.
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You have to be a dedicated football fan to actually learn the stuff. And it is possible. Why do you think some guys do it for fun? There is far more too it than injury. Claiming that it is "chance" is what I'm pointing out.

If I go out and pick a few of the best players, and then I decide to pick a guy who is a grinder who is going to get me points because he plays hard but never gets headlines? That isn't luck. That was knowing the game. That is understanding who is the better player despite the headlines.

I don't even play fantasy sports. I suck at it. I am not a dedicated enough fan to do so. But I know my friends got into it. They would actually research all kinds of things. A couple of the guys were really good, and the others one not so much. To say "it is just luck" is ignoring that even games of skill require luck.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

This has nothing to do with gambling, the state is upset that they aren't getting their cut. Clearly there are enough ways to gamble in New York but these companies made the mistake of getting too big.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

Actually it isn't gambling based on the law that is being used.
it actually is a game of skill.

https://www.dailyfantasycafe.com/academy/undergraduate/is-daily-fantasy-sports-legal

federally it is legal and it was even written into the bill to be legal.
the NY AG is overstepping their bounds.

I agree though. they are just mad because they aren't getting their cut, and neither was NV.
but that is up to them.

he can send all the ceases and desist orders he wants. without a court backing him up then it is just an empty letter.
of course these sites are fighting it based on the federal law which is on their side.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

AliHajiSheik said:
This has nothing to do with gambling, the state is upset that they aren't getting their cut. Clearly there are enough ways to gamble in New York but these companies made the mistake of getting too big.
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the whole industry is big. last year fantasy football made 60b dollars in revenue.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

stonewall50 said:
But somehow horse racing is still ok in New York?
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It is legislatively authorized by New York law. If Draft Kings and the other daily fantasy websites earned the same legislative legitimacy, then I am sure the Attorney General would not be sending them cease and desist letters.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

tres borrachos said:
What does horse racing have to do with this? And no, you don't handicap horses based on who may get hurt.
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Horse racing is just an analogy that relies on many of the same predictive aspects in order to pick a winner. I am just trying to help other individuals who don't see these daily fantasy websites as gambling in a way that should be easy to understand. I understand that there may be differences - that's why the example of horse racing is an analogy - it will be inherently flawed either way.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

ludin said:
the whole industry is big. last year fantasy football made 60b dollars in revenue.
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According to Forbes, most of that is a calculation on the amount of time spent on playing and ad revenue. The actual revenue is probably 25% of that figure. New York just sees another source of tax revenue.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

AliHajiSheik said:
According to Forbes, most of that is a calculation on the amount of time spent on playing and ad revenue. The actual revenue is probably 25% of that figure. New York just sees another source of tax revenue.
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Those sites report any withdrawal over 600 dollars in a year to the IRS which means it would go to the state as well.
it is illegal for them not to.

so the state is getting whatever tax dollars come from that.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

ludin said:
Those sites report any withdrawal over 600 dollars in a year to the IRS which means it would go to the state as well.
it is illegal for them not to.

so the state is getting whatever tax dollars come from that.
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True, but the state isn't getting any of "the vig" as they do with Casinos and the lottery.
 
Re: Attorney General tells draft kings and fan duel to stop taking entries in New Yor

MrT said:
It is legislatively authorized by New York law. If Draft Kings and the other daily fantasy websites earned the same legislative legitimacy, then I am sure the Attorney General would not be sending them cease and desist letters.
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The question is WHY is one acceptable alt and one not?
 
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