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SEC: Companies must show CEO-to-worker pay ratio

Henrin said:
Sigh. It's none of your damn business what the CEO is paid. If you want to impose on business just to piss people off then frankly you deserve a jail cell.
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As a shareholder or an employee it's absolutely my business.
 
PirateMk1 said:
CEO's CFO's and other officers of publically traded companies compensation packages, have been for some time public information. I don't see what this new rule is supposed to accomplish. This information is already known.

SEC.gov | Executive Compensation
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You don't understand. This will give CEOs the ammunition they need to raise their employment packages. "The McDonald's CEO makes 5000% of its median wage. I only make 4500. (insert whining here.)

Seriously, I think if this information is more readily available in a database, the end result of raising consciousness may be positive.
 
MaggieD said:
You don't understand. This will give CEOs the ammunition they need to raise their employment packages. "The McDonald's CEO makes 5000% of its median wage. I only make 4500. (insert whining here.)

Seriously, I think if this information is more readily available in a database, the end result of raising consciousness may be positive.
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CEO's already have that ammunition. The great ones get paid like Derek Jetet or Tom Brady which is in the 5000% range. Which based on their performance is probably a bargain. Most CEO's don't get paid near that level similar to most MLB or NFL players don't get paid like Tom Bray or Derek Jeter.
 
PirateMk1 said:
CEO's already have that ammunition. The great ones get paid like Derek Jetet or Tom Brady which is in the 5000% range. Which based on their performance is probably a bargain. Most CEO's don't get paid near that level similar to most MLB or NFL players don't get paid like Tom Bray or Derek Jeter.
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Here's a difference though - 16 times a year I get to see Tom Brady or, 162 times a year saw Derek Jeter earn his pay. As an average Joe Citizen I don't see a CEO earn his pay every day - hell, I'd be lucky to even see them or read about them once a year in their end of year statement to shareholders on the corporations fiscal and market accomplishments. I'm not saying CEO's work, but I do question whether the work they do is worth the compensation provided. A CEO's job is basically an PR position to talk to the press, make speeches, and approve major changes in the corporation's direction - with the approval of the board. Tom Brady however is a working man - he signed a 3 year deal worth 30 million and a 30 million dollar signing bonus - he also won the Super Bowl in 2014, meaning his team with him included were the tops according to the rules of the game. Brady is basically making $20M a year but I at least see if he earns it in a very public way, same with Jeter. We may collectively say that's still too much but what he does and how much he's paid is all public - the CEO's not necessarily so.
 
Ockham said:
Here's a difference though - 16 times a year I get to see Tom Brady or, 162 times a year saw Derek Jeter earn his pay. As an average Joe Citizen I don't see a CEO earn his pay every day - hell, I'd be lucky to even see them or read about them once a year in their end of year statement to shareholders on the corporations fiscal and market accomplishments. I'm not saying CEO's work, but I do question whether the work they do is worth the compensation provided. A CEO's job is basically an PR position to talk to the press, make speeches, and approve major changes in the corporation's direction - with the approval of the board. Tom Brady however is a working man - he signed a 3 year deal worth 30 million and a 30 million dollar signing bonus - he also won the Super Bowl in 2014, meaning his team with him included were the tops according to the rules of the game. Brady is basically making $20M a year but I at least see if he earns it in a very public way, same with Jeter. We may collectively say that's still too much but what he does and how much he's paid is all public - the CEO's not necessarily so.
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I am just saying why they are paid so much. Me personally if I hired a CEO it wouldn't be at those kinds of levels unless it could be proved he was the reason that a company made multiples more than his salary as a result.
 
PirateMk1 said:
I am just saying why they are paid so much. Me personally if I hired a CEO it wouldn't be at those kinds of levels unless it could be proved he was the reason that a company made multiples more than his salary as a result.
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Agreed. My view is there are very few Steve Jobs types in any generation. An Elon Musk may be another... who made over 6 years, made 78.5M in total compensation, meaning about $13M a year, but on the books only pulls a $33K salary. I see $13.M a year for a CEO as reasonable. In my other example of McAdams at Verizon, $56M a year is not a reasonable salary as it is excessive IMO.

How much money did Elon Musk make?
 
Ockham said:
Agreed. My view is there are very few Steve Jobs types in any generation. An Elon Musk may be another... who made over 6 years, made 78.5M in total compensation, meaning about $13M a year, but on the books only pulls a $33K salary. I see $13.M a year for a CEO as reasonable. In my other example of McAdams at Verizon, $56M a year is not a reasonable salary as it is excessive IMO.

How much money did Elon Musk make?
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Depends on if McAdams is worth that kind of money to the folks at Verizon. Maybe his presence brings in double or triple that. In which case he is worth it in strictly monetary terms.
 
PirateMk1 said:
Depends on if McAdams is worth that kind of money to the folks at Verizon. Maybe his presence brings in double or triple that. In which case he is worth it in strictly monetary terms.
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I've yet to see any CEO other than say a Jobs or Musk that brings in business and profits, especially for 1 years worth of work. I can't justify ANY job that would be worth $54M a year.
 
Captain Adverse said:
Well this should prove interesting. We'll be able to see how much corporations are saving by cutting employee wages....compared to what their top officers are getting in salary and benefits.

Probably won't make much difference in the scheme of things...and by that I mean the scheme where the top 1% keep getting richer, while soothing the rest of us with the belief "anyone can become a billionaire" if you just work hard enough. ;)
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Excellent! It's always good to keep the masses riled up and make everyone mad at those evil CEOs.

:roll:

I'm embarrassed for this country.
 
Ockham said:
I've yet to see any CEO other than say a Jobs or Musk that brings in business and profits, especially for 1 years worth of work. I can't justify ANY job that would be worth $54M a year.
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Alan Mulally ran Ford for about 8 years. His compensation, with options was probably more than $54 million. His leadership kept Ford out of Bankruptcy, avoided Fed loans that screwed taxpayers, avoided handing partial ownership to the UAW, and transformed the company into a profit making leader in it's field.

Was Mulally worth the money?
 
Ockham said:
Here's a difference though - 16 times a year I get to see Tom Brady or, 162 times a year saw Derek Jeter earn his pay. As an average Joe Citizen I don't see a CEO earn his pay every day - hell, I'd be lucky to even see them or read about them once a year in their end of year statement to shareholders on the corporations fiscal and market accomplishments. I'm not saying CEO's work, but I do question whether the work they do is worth the compensation provided. A CEO's job is basically an PR position to talk to the press, make speeches, and approve major changes in the corporation's direction - with the approval of the board. Tom Brady however is a working man - he signed a 3 year deal worth 30 million and a 30 million dollar signing bonus - he also won the Super Bowl in 2014, meaning his team with him included were the tops according to the rules of the game. Brady is basically making $20M a year but I at least see if he earns it in a very public way, same with Jeter. We may collectively say that's still too much but what he does and how much he's paid is all public - the CEO's not necessarily so.
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And how is it any of the publics business what a private citizen is paid by the company he works for. If it was a goverent job than yea for sure but this is not. Does the public have a right to know how much money you make so they can judge if you are worth what you are paid.
 
Ockham said:
I've yet to see any CEO other than say a Jobs or Musk that brings in business and profits, especially for 1 years worth of work. I can't justify ANY job that would be worth $54M a year.
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Well when you own a company what you pay your CEO is between you and him. Just as what another company pays its employees is between them. What right does anyone else have to try and dictate what others do with their business
 
ludin said:
what a load of crock.

taxpayers don't foot the bill for a company keeping more of the money it's earned.
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Unless it's one of the numerous companies and corporations getting subsidies and tax writeoffs.
 
Soho gator said:
As a shareholder or an employee it's absolutely my business.
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Then why did you agree to not have that information when you chose to buy shares? Have you asked for it of the company? Attended a shareholder meeting? Did you ask BEFORE you bought shares?
 
It's a tentative first step in the right direction.

The better choice would be to put a limit on the maximum ratio.
 
braindrain said:
And how is it any of the publics business what a private citizen is paid by the company he works for.
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If the company is private, with no stock holders and no board, then it's only public knowledge if that private person is running for public office or must provide their income to the government for taxation purposes. If the company is PUBLIC - like Verizon for example, then the board as well as the stockholders have a right to know what that CEO's pay is.

braindrain said:
If it was a goverent job than yea for sure but this is not. Does the public have a right to know how much money you make so they can judge if you are worth what you are paid.
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The public has a right to know if the company or corporation is PUBLIC. If it's a private company, then the general public has no right of knowledge except as I stated, under other certain circumstances.
 
braindrain said:
Well when you own a company what you pay your CEO is between you and him. Just as what another company pays its employees is between them. What right does anyone else have to try and dictate what others do with their business
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See Post #42.
 
PirateMk1 said:
I am just saying why they are paid so much. Me personally if I hired a CEO it wouldn't be at those kinds of levels unless it could be proved he was the reason that a company made multiples more than his salary as a result.
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What if the govt came along and FORCED you to pay your CEO at those kind of levels (or to expose to your employees that you dont)? Why is either one of those scenarios right?
 
Ockham said:
If the company is private, with no stock holders and no board, then it's only public knowledge if that private person is running for public office or must provide their income to the government for taxation purposes. If the company is PUBLIC - like Verizon for example, then the board as well as the stockholders have a right to know what that CEO's pay is.

The public has a right to know if the company or corporation is PUBLIC. If it's a private company, then the general public has no right of knowledge except as I stated, under other certain circumstances.
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Public is a misnomer. The company is not publicly owned. It is owned by private individuals under a contract by which they purchased stock. As such they have only the rights agreed to in the purchase.
 
ocean515 said:
Alan Mulally ran Ford for about 8 years. His compensation, with options was probably more than $54 million. His leadership kept Ford out of Bankruptcy, avoided Fed loans that screwed taxpayers, avoided handing partial ownership to the UAW, and transformed the company into a profit making leader in it's field.

Was Mulally worth the money?
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I would say no. How do I know that he couldn't do the same job for 30 million or that someone else couldn't do as good or better of a job keeping Ford out of the red for even less? I don't look at the entirety of a hindsight is 20/20 situation and say it was worth it. Did it work out? Sure. Was Ford positioned for the future? A definitive yes. Is Ford still doing well? Absolutely.
 
SEC: Companies must show CEO-to-worker pay ratio
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i completely support that. it would help me make better decisions when i'm purchasing products.
 
jonny5 said:
Public is a misnomer. The company is not publicly owned. It is owned by private individuals under a contract by which they purchased stock.
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I was talking about publicly owned. Hell, even a privately owned company that issues private stocks and allows the employees to own a % of the company has a right to know what their CEO makes a year. As part owners the CEO works for them. If we're talking about "Bob's Tree Cutting Service" who has 3 employees who work 6 months out of the year, then no - the public doesn't have a right to know what Bob makes a year.
 
braindrain said:
And how is it any of the publics business what a private citizen is paid by the company he works for. If it was a goverent job than yea for sure but this is not. Does the public have a right to know how much money you make so they can judge if you are worth what you are paid.
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You're right and fully private businesses won't have to do that, but those PUBLICLY traded will, and since publicly traded businesses are invested in by the public, seems okay for the public to know.
 
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