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Thread: Obama: Chances of an Iran nuclear deal now lower than 50-50

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    Re: Obama: Chances of an Iran nuclear deal now lower than 50-50

    Quote Originally Posted by humbolt View Post
    Damn. You're right. And Kerry already bought the frame. Just damn. Where's James Taylor?
    Indy on July 15th. and i have pavilion seats.

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    Re: Obama: Chances of an Iran nuclear deal now lower than 50-50

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    You don't see a difference between me taking 100 dollars out of your wallet and then giving it back to you and me taking a hundred dollars out of my wallet and giving it to you?
    Of course the difference is apparent but.....busted. Partisan misrepresentation.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama: Chances of an Iran nuclear deal now lower than 50-50

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    I see the difference. But neither of those are the same as "paying" them 12 billion dollars. I'm not saying it's a great idea to release the money, but either way it's not a payment.

    Also, I don't know if your statement that they are the worlds largest funder of terrorism is accurate. If we are going by "lets not give money to people who fund terrorists" then we should suspend all activity with Saudi Arabia and Qutar.
    Oh puh-leeese. Did they have the $12 billion before the negotiations? No. Do they have the $12 billion now? Yes. Your attempt at splitting hairs is noted.
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    Re: Obama: Chances of an Iran nuclear deal now lower than 50-50

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    Oh puh-leeese. Did they have the $12 billion before the negotiations? No. Do they have the $12 billion now? Yes. Your attempt at splitting hairs is noted.
    Well, if I take the hundred out of your pocket and then hand it to you, did you have it before I handed it to you?

    I'm sorry, but giving something back to someone isn't a payment. I think there is a substantial difference between unfreezing assets and just handing them money that was never theirs.

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    Re: Obama: Chances of an Iran nuclear deal now lower than 50-50

    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    It seems to me our negotiating teams, led by John Kerry, have been woefully nave when it comes to who they are meeting with. From my experience in working with people from that part of world, there really is little to negotiate. It usually comes down to an understanding of how much tolerance there will be when an agreement is violated. Every agreement I have ever had with business people from the Middle East carries this unwritten, but spoken, understanding. They know it, and respect it.

    The cat is out of the bag. Iran will have offensive and defensive nukes. It's foolish to think otherwise. The negotiations should be centered on an understanding of what the response will be should they be used, or sold. Outside of that, all this effort is really a waste of time.
    You would think that Valerie Jarrett would have contributed this cultural understanding to the negotiating team. Perhaps she has, and they are proceeding anyway?
    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    The only problem is that we have been paying Iran billions of dollars a month to sit at the table with us. If the negotiation ends with no agreement and business as usual we will have done nothing but make the Iranian regime wealthier. The only way the Obama administration could have come out ahead in this negotiation is if they brokered an enforceable deal with Iran that would prevent them from building a nuclear weapon. That was never likely not going to happen, however, so if the negotiation falls through then sending $12 billion to Iran as a precondition for joining in this farce would be the lasting legacy.
    This may have been the Iranians entire objective in entering these negotiations, easing economic sanctions and buying time. You'd have to think that any reasonably intelligent person would have considered this, but with the rhetoric coming from Kerry, Obama and the administration, I'm not so sure that they have.

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    Exactly. I've been listening to "Obama will give away anything and do anything for a nuclear deal" for months now. If he wanted it that badly, that he didn't even care what he was giving away, we'd already have a deal.

    I'll be interested in hearing how many of them will fess up to being wrong, lol.
    How many times have they do so previously? I can't think of a single time, so I anticipate that they won't on this either.

    Quote Originally Posted by OrphanSlug View Post
    It seems to me that this administration is daydreaming while at the wheel.
    Yeah, seems so.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony60 View Post
    It seems that everyone who said this was foolish and Obama is an idiot is correct. Let's get it right here. The Iranians are so unwilling to give absolutely anything, that Obama can't even make a bad deal, which is the only deal that could possibly be made here.
    Yup. I'd have to second that assessment.
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    Re: Obama: Chances of an Iran nuclear deal now lower than 50-50

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony60 View Post
    Bad? This has to be about the worst negotiation ever! So, you are telling me that going in, Iran can get $12 billion for only coming to the negotiating table? If they give us absolutely nothing, and continue with their nuke program, they walk away with $12 billion.

    Gee, who would think that they would take the $12 billion, give up nothing, and walk away?
    We didn't tell them right at the beginning that we would release the full amount. It was slowly given up in the process. But either way, it's not an incredibly large sum of money by any standards, and if they continue to reject negotiations, that will only ostracize them from the world community even more. In the grand scheme of things, if the money gives us a a shot at a good deal then it's well worth it.

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    Re: Obama: Chances of an Iran nuclear deal now lower than 50-50

    I'm confused. Iran is negotiating to have sanctions removed in exchange for a deal on nuclear materials. Aren't the under sanctions because they broke the last deal?

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    Re: Obama: Chances of an Iran nuclear deal now lower than 50-50

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    We didn't tell them right at the beginning that we would release the full amount. It was slowly given up in the process. But either way, it's not an incredibly large sum of money by any standards, and if they continue to reject negotiations, that will only ostracize them from the world community even more. In the grand scheme of things, if the money gives us a a shot at a good deal then it's well worth it.
    It's $12 Billion, with a "B", not million. Both of which are large sums of money to me. To Iran, the $12 billion is much needed cash. Looks like it is about 2% of their GDP, so no small potatoes.
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    Re: Obama: Chances of an Iran nuclear deal now lower than 50-50

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony60 View Post
    It's $12 Billion, with a "B", not million. Both of which are large sums of money to me. To Iran, the $12 billion is much needed cash. Looks like it is about 2% of their GDP, so no small potatoes.
    It's not tiny potatoes, but it's not something that is going to drastically improve their situation. That's the reality of it. It's worth it to see if we can work out a deal. I'd much rather this than the continued "lets never talk to them, just call them evil and eventually invade their country". If these talks fail then we at least know that there really was no other option.

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    Re: Obama: Chances of an Iran nuclear deal now lower than 50-50

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony60 View Post
    It's $12 Billion, with a "B", not million. Both of which are large sums of money to me. To Iran, the $12 billion is much needed cash. Looks like it is about 2% of their GDP, so no small potatoes.
    Were you equally troubled the last time we gave away/lost 12 Billion with a B?

    How the US sent $12bn in cash to Iraq. And watched it vanish | World news | The Guardian
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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