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Thread: Nikki Haley: 'I could not look my kids in the face and justify that flag'

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    Re: Nikki Haley: 'I could not look my kids in the face and justify that flag'

    Lincoln was an opportunist politician if ever there were one. He knew what the consequences of the South exercising their right to secede would be.
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    Re: Nikki Haley: 'I could not look my kids in the face and justify that flag'

    Quote Originally Posted by HorseLoverGirl View Post
    Simple, it was over the state's right to govern themselves, as this country was originally founded.
    And that governance issue at the time was...?
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    Re: Nikki Haley: 'I could not look my kids in the face and justify that flag'

    Quote Originally Posted by JC Callender View Post
    Does that sound like a good reason to secede and start a civil war, risking hundreds of thousands of lives?
    If you were being taxed out the wazoo wouldn't you want to leave also?
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    Re: Nikki Haley: 'I could not look my kids in the face and justify that flag'

    Quote Originally Posted by JC Callender View Post
    Does that sound like a good reason to secede and start a civil war, risking hundreds of thousands of lives?
    It was basically what the American Revolution started over, in case you've forgotten.

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    Re: Nikki Haley: 'I could not look my kids in the face and justify that flag'

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    And that governance issue at the time was...?
    The states, supposedly, but the feds were getting more power than they were ever supposed to have. I think now we can see that a large central government is not a good thing.
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    Re: Nikki Haley: 'I could not look my kids in the face and justify that flag'

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    It was basically what the American Revolution started over, in case you've forgotten.
    I know it was. The colonists didn't like ol' King George pushing them around so they pushed back.
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    Re: Nikki Haley: 'I could not look my kids in the face and justify that flag'

    Quote Originally Posted by HorseLoverGirl View Post
    If you were being taxed out the wazoo wouldn't you want to leave also?
    So secession was essentially about taxes? I've never heard that one before. Taxes on everything or just specific things?

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    Re: Nikki Haley: 'I could not look my kids in the face and justify that flag'

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    The flags of Britain, Portugal and Spain ( among other ) flew on the ships that brought slaves to the new world.

    Are those " racist symbols " too ?
    Do those countries still have slaves? Are generations of former slaves still living with the shadow of oppression in those countries and if so, do the national flags you mentioned still act as reminders of oppression in those countries?
    "A fair exchange ain't no robbery." Tupac Shakur w/Digital Underground

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    Re: Nikki Haley: 'I could not look my kids in the face and justify that flag'

    Quote Originally Posted by JC Callender View Post
    No, because under Lincoln and the Stars and Stripes we also abolished slavery.
    And, thus, the U.S. Flag stands more for national unity than national oppression. It's that "united we stand, divided we fall...anyone can make it if you try" thang.
    "A fair exchange ain't no robbery." Tupac Shakur w/Digital Underground

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    Re: Nikki Haley: 'I could not look my kids in the face and justify that flag'

    Quote Originally Posted by JC Callender View Post
    Do you believe Lincoln actually meant it though? I and many others believe that he said and did what he had to at times to keep the US together at all costs. Everyone knew Lincoln was anti-slavery even though he would talk out of both sides of his mouth from time to time for political reasons. Besides, what other major issues did the south have other than slavery?

    If he talked out of both sides of his mouth on the issue, how can anyone claim to know what he really thought/felt/meant?


    The South had been involved in a series of political and economic conflicts with the North for decades. A lot of involved tariffs and trade restrictions imposed on the South by the Federal Congress, at the behest of northern industrial and shipping concerns who wanted to plunder the South's foreign trade lines. Also at issue was whether the States were sovereign and still capable of exerting internal autonomy, the "null and void" crisis.

    I've studied the history leading up to the war extensively. I was allowed to take some post-grad-level history courses in college; the two I chose were the Vietnam War and the Civil War, both by the same professor, a brilliant man whose classes on history were always in DEPTH... I mean in the Vietnam war class he started off on Day 1 saying "To understand the roots of the Vietnam war, you have to go back to about 1000 BC..." He was similarly thorough about the Civil War, beginning with pre-Revolution differences between the North and South in climate, economy, politics, settlements, and more, and proceeding to detail the conflicts that lead to the war. He said very plainly that while slavery was AN issue it was far from the only one, and not necessarily the most causal.

    He had no dog in this fight, as he liked to point out, as his ancestors didn't arrive in America until the 1920's and mostly lived in the Northeast and Northwest.

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