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Thread: Supreme Court to Weigh Dispute Over Union Fees

  1. #181
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    Re: Supreme Court to Weigh Dispute Over Union Fees

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Stop trying to fake it like you explained your accusation that I was guilty of taking right wing positions and pushing right wing politics then. You are obviously impotent to document or explain these false charges.

    And continuing to insult me only shines and even greater spotlight on your own inability to offer this evidence you have been unable to present so far.
    stop try to make your comprehension skills my problem....

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    Re: Supreme Court to Weigh Dispute Over Union Fees

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    stop try to make your comprehension skills my problem....
    What is it exactly that I am failing to comprehend regarding your unfounded accusations against me ?

    You have not been able to document this charge and still are unable to do so resorting only to insults and repetition of those same insults.

    It is obvious you let your mouth get a bad case of diarrhea and now are unable to clean yourself up without losing face.

    Thrilla
    don't worry your pretty little head about my comprehension..
    post 92 in this very thread in which he accused me on being inconsistent on freeloaders then getting his logic caught in his own trap because of my answer.
    Last edited by haymarket; 07-03-15 at 03:26 PM.
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  3. #183
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    Re: Supreme Court to Weigh Dispute Over Union Fees

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    What is it exactly that I am failing to comprehend regarding your unfounded accusations against me ?

    You have not been able to document this charge and still are unable to do so resorting only to insults and repetition of those same insults.

    It is obvious you let your mouth get a bad case of diarrhea and now are unable to clean yourself up without losing face.


    post 92 in this very thread in which he accused me on being inconsistent on freeloaders then getting his logic caught in his own trap because of my answer.
    stop try to make your comprehension skills my problem....

  4. #184
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    Re: Supreme Court to Weigh Dispute Over Union Fees

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    The manager does not have complete control over who is hired - union employees with the highest seniority get the better positions. If the removed worker is replaced, it's by the person next in line who has the same qualifications and highest seniority - who may just be worse then the person just removed, and the cycle starts all over again. That's the cat and mouse game that's been happening for decades now.
    my experience was in the public/federal sector. there we had managers who refused to budge when we attempted to restrict hires to internal candidates. and they were wise to do so, because there could be external candidates who were better qualified. so, i have not seen the scenario you presented; however, since my union experience was limited to the public sector, i cannot offer a rebuttal to your own experience

    I'm not saying that all union employees are bad by any stretch but some do the bare minimum and some do less than that with the only REAL discipline being a note in their employee file and being moved to a new position, sometimes under the SAME manager. I've seen both healthy management - union locations and poisonous ones. Even in the healthy one's grievances are fairly common.
    i have represented under-performing employees in many instances. and still won. because the damn manager failed to document the employee's shortcomings. any union rep would have prevailed. the employee won NOT because management did not have sound reason to discipline them but because they failed to make a case. that requires effort. and in too many instances, i have seen managers ignore their obligations to document their case
    in the best situation i encountered in my career, the senior manager and i had a healthy, respectful, communicative and open relationship. we solved problems. we negotiated agreements found nowhere else, such as the manner in which all employees - who received a satisfactory rating or better - received a substantial year-end bonus. those who received higher ratings got even more. those who were superlative received the most. and those performance goals were set at the beginning of the year and were both achievable and documentable. as a result of these incentives, the office performed massively better than all 66 others in the nation
    the result? HQ forbade us from distributing bonus money that way again and instead imposed a procedure that gave the most money to the highest ranking. the manager was sent away to become the turn-around specialist for the other problem offices. HQ replaced him with a political hire from the coal industry who knew nothing about what we did. and the office soon returned to being an average performer

    i once formed a new, competing union. have gone to court and testified against my own union. the fellow who was my mentor initiated a strike against my union and the damned union president, who is hopefully now frying in hell. except for the uppermost levels, union officials are rank and file employees. if the employees - who by law must be democratically elected to their positions - are crooks and/or incompetent, then the union will suffer. just like the weak politicians we elect cause our nation to suffer the consequences of their presence. i mention this to demonstrate that i recognize that misdirected unions are prone to cause problems. but when the employees are actively engaged in their union and management is enlightened enough to work with rather than fight the union, a synergy ignites, resulting in beneficial outcomes for all
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
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    Re: Supreme Court to Weigh Dispute Over Union Fees

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    stop try to make your comprehension skills my problem....
    Brain stuck in rewind? Repeating the same refuted nonsense seems your only line of an extremely weak defense. You are now officially a dog chasing its own tail going round and round and round but getting nowhere. But hey, why change the only tactic that you know at this point?

    What is it exactly that I am failing to comprehend regarding your unfounded accusations against me ?

    You have not been able to document this charge and still are unable to do so resorting only to insults and repetition of those same insults.

    It is obvious you let your mouth get a bad case of diarrhea and now are unable to clean yourself up without losing face.

    from Thrilla
    don't worry your pretty little head about my comprehension..
    post 92 in this very thread in which he accused me on being inconsistent on freeloaders then getting his logic caught in his own trap because of my answer.

    So now you are attempting to apply to me the "comprehension" schtick ....when you yourself dismissed it as applied to you.

    This is extremely telling.
    Last edited by haymarket; 07-03-15 at 04:09 PM.
    __________________________________________________ _
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  6. #186
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    Re: Supreme Court to Weigh Dispute Over Union Fees

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    my experience was in the public/federal sector. there we had managers who refused to budge when we attempted to restrict hires to internal candidates. and they were wise to do so, because there could be external candidates who were better qualified. so, i have not seen the scenario you presented; however, since my union experience was limited to the public sector, i cannot offer a rebuttal to your own experience
    My experience has only been in the private sector and not in many unions but one specific one - CWA and IBEW of NJ. It certainly depends on which union, what sector and what the contracts both local and national (in my case national) specified.


    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    i have represented under-performing employees in many instances. and still won. because the damn manager failed to document the employee's shortcomings. any union rep would have prevailed. the employee won NOT because management did not have sound reason to discipline them but because they failed to make a case. that requires effort. and in too many instances, i have seen managers ignore their obligations to document their case
    in the best situation i encountered in my career, the senior manager and i had a healthy, respectful, communicative and open relationship. we solved problems. we negotiated agreements found nowhere else, such as the manner in which all employees - who received a satisfactory rating or better - received a substantial year-end bonus. those who received higher ratings got even more. those who were superlative received the most. and those performance goals were set at the beginning of the year and were both achievable and documentable. as a result of these incentives, the office performed massively better than all 66 others in the nation
    the result? HQ forbade us from distributing bonus money that way again and instead imposed a procedure that gave the most money to the highest ranking. the manager was sent away to become the turn-around specialist for the other problem offices. HQ replaced him with a political hire from the coal industry who knew nothing about what we did. and the office soon returned to being an average performer
    Granted, I have only had a manager be unprepared a few times and even then they were coached by upper managed on the grievance procedures as well as the appeal processes. Sometimes those nasty cases went to an agreed upon 3rd party arbitrator but for the most part, the documentation was provided well in advance to the union rep - sometimes the grievance was dropped most times it wasn't. However in all cases I can say that there was only 1 outright dismissal that I was involved in and that was because we had a quality control recording (union approved through contract) of a guy making a drug deal while talking on the phone to a supposed "customer". The person who replaced him was a definite improvement.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


  7. #187
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    Re: Supreme Court to Weigh Dispute Over Union Fees

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Brain stuck in rewind? Repeating the same refuted nonsense seems your only line of an extremely weak defense. You are now officially a dog chasing its own tail going round and round and round but getting nowhere. But hey, why change the only tactic that you know at this point?

    What is it exactly that I am failing to comprehend regarding your unfounded accusations against me ?

    You have not been able to document this charge and still are unable to do so resorting only to insults and repetition of those same insults.

    It is obvious you let your mouth get a bad case of diarrhea and now are unable to clean yourself up without losing face.



    post 92 in this very thread in which he accused me on being inconsistent on freeloaders then getting his logic caught in his own trap because of my answer.

    So now you are attempting to apply to me the "comprehension" schtick ....when you yourself dismissed it as applied to you.

    This is extremely telling.
    stop try to make your comprehension skills my problem....

  8. #188
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    Re: Supreme Court to Weigh Dispute Over Union Fees

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    if the unions did not help the employees, then why do many employers expend so much time and money trying to keep the unions out?
    The same reason they try and keep gophers out of their golf courses.

  9. #189
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    Re: Supreme Court to Weigh Dispute Over Union Fees

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    stop try to make your comprehension skills my problem....
    You seem to have reverted to broken English... perhaps it is not your first language?
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    Re: Supreme Court to Weigh Dispute Over Union Fees

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    You seem to have reverted to broken English... perhaps it is not your first language?
    you seem to have nothing of substance to say.... as usual.

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