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Thread: Cruz: Opposition To Same-Sex Marriage Will Be 'Front And Center' In 2016 Campaign

  1. #121
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    Re: Cruz: Opposition To Same-Sex Marriage Will Be 'Front And Center' In 2016 Camp...

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    I'm not asking anyone to explain themselves to me.

    I'm simply stating that I would rather see us elect judges, as we do senators, than have them be lifetime appointed lawyers who decide the fate of 350 million people without those people having a say in who represents them.

    That's all I'm saying. Everything else you are projecting on to me.
    So you would rather have them rule based on what will get them elected than on what the law and the constitution is? That seems wrong somehow...
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    Re: Cruz: Opposition To Same-Sex Marriage Will Be 'Front And Center' In 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    Why should the Supreme Court be insulated from the will of the very people it is meant to govern? The American People are not idiots or children, we can govern ourselves quote capably.

    The safeguards to judicial power you have outlined, while important, represent an emergency brake when what we, the Anerican Public, require, is much more involved oversight.

    I think we have a fundamental difference of political philosophy. I understand that the American People will get it wrong from time to time, just as the unelected 9 will get it wrong a lot of the time as well. History has proven both of these statements out.

    But when the cards are laid down....I would much rather ride with the Anerican People than with 9 elitist appointees who hide behind their robes and their marble walls.
    Checks and balances. They need to be removed from influence. Also the reason for the high hurdle to change/amend the constitution. It can be done, just not easy.

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    Re: Cruz: Opposition To Same-Sex Marriage Will Be 'Front And Center' In 2016 Camp...

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    So you would rather have them rule based on what will get them elected than on what the law and the constitution is? That seems wrong somehow...
    I don't think the will of the people and the constitution/law are in direct opposition. It's not an either/or. I want judges who base their decision on the rule of law AND who are accountable to the public whom they serve.

    I think six year terms are quite reasonable in this regard.

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    Re: Cruz: Opposition To Same-Sex Marriage Will Be 'Front And Center' In 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Add my family to that. They are all for folks going their own way. But even the ones who campaigned in their states for homosexual marriage, hate this decision and the way in which they got what they wanted. When will the namecallers learn that the method counts often more than the result.
    How else could this have been solved? Isn't this the purpose, basically of the SC..to settle constitution disputes? The bare basics of this right is that gay people are taxpayers too and they deserve the same benefits of any other tax payer. Our society cannot function with the opposing side always getting their way on every issue. This right doesn't affect anyone except the ones who need it. The States were not able to handle this issue fairly and it was turfed to a higher court. Not all decisions make everyone happy...but this one was such a no brainer and has very little impact on normal society. This should have happened years ago.

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    Cruz: Opposition To Same-Sex Marriage Will Be 'Front And Center' In 2016 Camp...

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    I'm not asking anyone to explain themselves to me.

    I'm simply stating that I would rather see us elect judges, as we do senators, than have them be lifetime appointed lawyers who decide the fate of 350 million people without those people having a say in who represents them.

    That's all I'm saying. Everything else you are projecting on to me.
    Do you recall why we pushed to elect Senators? Increased majority input as opposed to well-entrenched minorities. Electing judges is a purposeful act of trying to impose democratic wills onto a traditionally oligarchical institution. Likewise, the reason why this has come up was because of gay marriage. That's the rationale for elected judges, and Ted Cruz rationalized in on that basis. So did you.

    We also both know I am not projecting what your motivations are here.
    "We all of us know down here that politics is a tough game. And I don't think there's any point in being Irish if you don't know that the world is going to break your heart eventually."-Daniel Patrick Moynihan, December 5, 1963

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    Re: Cruz: Opposition To Same-Sex Marriage Will Be 'Front And Center' In 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by Winchester View Post
    Checks and balances. They need to be removed from influence. Also the reason for the high hurdle to change/amend the constitution. It can be done, just not easy.
    Influence from what, the will of the people they serve?

    I want them to be more in touch, not more out of touch.

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    Re: Cruz: Opposition To Same-Sex Marriage Will Be 'Front And Center' In 2016 Camp...

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Do you recall why we pushed to elect Senators? Increased majority input as opposed to well-entrenched minorities. Electing judges is a purposeful act of trying to impose democratic wills onto a traditionally oligarchical institution. Likewise, the reason why this has come up was because of gay marriage. That's the rationale for elected judges, and Ted Cruz rationalized in on that basis. So did you.

    We also both know I am not projecting what your motivations are here.
    Your continued insistence on making this personal, in spite of my repeated requests to keep this discussion civil and on topic, regrettably leave me with no choice but to stop debating with you on this topic for the time being.

    I just want to discuss the issues, man.

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    Re: Cruz: Opposition To Same-Sex Marriage Will Be 'Front And Center' In 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    Influence from what, the will of the people they serve?

    I want them to be more in touch, not more out of touch.
    Justices are supposed to be kept Out of touch.
    "If you can't stand the way this place is, Take yourself to higher places!"
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    Hilliary Clinton/Tim Kaine 2016

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    Re: Cruz: Opposition To Same-Sex Marriage Will Be 'Front And Center' In 2016 Camp...

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    Your continued insistence on making this personal, in spite of my repeated requests to keep this discussion civil and on topic, regrettably leave me with no choice but to stop debating with you on this topic for the time being.

    I just want to discuss the issues, man.
    If you have trouble confronting the scope of the issue, that's your and Cruz's problem. Luckily for the rest of us, we aren't going to put in place a system which puts our justice system in a position where it has to produce the results the majority wants, even if it oppresses a minority that the majority has made no attempts to disguise it's hatred for.
    "We all of us know down here that politics is a tough game. And I don't think there's any point in being Irish if you don't know that the world is going to break your heart eventually."-Daniel Patrick Moynihan, December 5, 1963

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    Re: Cruz: Opposition To Same-Sex Marriage Will Be 'Front And Center' In 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by Unitedwestand13 View Post
    Justices are supposed to be kept Out of touch.
    Says who? That seems backwards. I don't want a justice who is out of touch, I want one who is tuned in to public discourse and who is ultimately accountable to the people he serves.

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