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Thread: Texas AG Says Workers Can Refuse Marriage Licenses to Gays[W:297]

  1. #201
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    Re: Texas AG Says Workers Can Refuse Marriage Licenses to Gays

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    Arguing that you can't do something new because of what currently exists isn't a winning argument. States would simply have to pass legislation removing themselves from the marriage licensing business and eliminating all State tax and other State benefits that accrue to holding that license. That does not impinge on the feds ability to issue licenses or for States to recognize those licenses or licenses from other States for other purposes.
    That's not an argument I'm making. The Feds could, arguably should, take over licensing. Or better get the government out of the licensing business altogether. The only real role for the state is to insure that both sides don't misrepresent themselves - i.e. if someone says they aren't married that they really aren't married, to adjudicate cases where the marriage contract isn't complied with and to insure that minors are cared for. Outside of that people should be able to craft their own marriage agreement - even if it's to say "we'll use a government drafted template contract."

    The reality is that it won't happen. Any state stupid enough to suspend issuing all marriage licenses is going to get its ass kicked both by the Feds and it's own citizens. I know if I was looking to marry and NY indefinitely halted issuance of marriage licenses over this my next stop after the NY clerk's office would be the courthouse.
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  2. #202
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    Re: Texas AG Says Workers Can Refuse Marriage Licenses to Gays

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    Clearly, we disagree. But I'll defer to your apparent credentials as a jurist in order to close the argument.
    You don't have to be a constitutional scholar to know animus is a basic principle of constitutional law. I will also predict the future for you:

    1. If clerks in Texas refuse to issue marriage licenses to same sex couples, they will be sued.

    2. The will lose in court.

    3. The social conservatives then will bitch about activist judges ignoring the fact that those clerks were violating a basic tenant of constitutional law.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

  3. #203
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    Re: Texas AG Says Workers Can Refuse Marriage Licenses to Gays

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    No less than 14 times SCOTUS has determined marriage to be a right. And now 15 times.
    That's good. Since I've had my eyes on these 14 year old Asian twins for a while now.
    They're both female so you'll probably disapprove. But, how does my marrying them affect you?
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  4. #204
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    Re: Texas AG Says Workers Can Refuse Marriage Licenses to Gays

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    A fair degree of proof... for what? A constitutional crisis? Lmao. This isn't the first 5-4 vote or for that matter a rare one. It's not a constitutional crisis.



    You can do that, however, you'll still be going against the majority of those learned words.
    Well, I can't help that you chose to ignore the words of Supreme Court Justices.

    “I write separately to call attention to this Court’s threat to American democracy.”

    “[I]t is not of special importance to me what the law says about marriage. It is of overwhelming importance, however, who it is that rules me. Today’s decree says that my Ruler, and the Ruler of 320 million Americans coast-to-coast, is a majority of the nine lawyers on the Supreme Court. The opinion in these cases is the furthest extension in fact—and the furthest extension one can even imagine—of the Court’s claimed power to create ‘liberties’ that the Constitution and its Amendments neglect to mention. This practice of constitutional revision by an unelected committee of nine, always accompanied (as it is today) by extravagant praise of liberty, robs the People of the most important liberty they asserted in the Declaration of Independence and won in the Revolution of 1776: the freedom to govern themselves.”

    “This is a naked judicial claim to legislative—indeed, super-legislative—power; a claim fundamentally at odds with our system of government. Except as limited by a constitutional prohibition agreed to by the People, the States are free to adopt whatever laws they like, even those that offend the esteemed Justices’ ‘reasoned judgment.’ A system of government that makes the People subordinate to a committee of nine unelected lawyers does not deserve to be called a democracy.”

    "It is not about whether, in my judgment, the institution of marriage should be changed to include same-sex couples," he said. "It is instead about whether, in our democratic republic, that decision should rest with the people acting through their elected representatives, or with five lawyers who happen to hold commissions authorizing them to resolve legal disputes under the law."

    Sorry, but those words trump your amateur opinion.
    President Donald J Trump, 45th President of the United States of America. A victory born in the hearts and minds of Everyday Americans

  5. #205
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    Re: Texas AG Says Workers Can Refuse Marriage Licenses to Gays

    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    Well, I can't help that you chose to ignore the words of Supreme Court Justices.
    Emotional jibber jabber from the side that lost. Get serious, this isn't a constitutional crisis anymore than Loving v. Virginia was.
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  6. #206
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    Re: Texas AG Says Workers Can Refuse Marriage Licenses to Gays

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Emotional jibber jabber from the side that lost. Get serious, this isn't a constitutional crisis anymore than Loving v. Virginia was.
    LOL.

    I rest my case.
    President Donald J Trump, 45th President of the United States of America. A victory born in the hearts and minds of Everyday Americans

  7. #207
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    Re: Texas AG Says Workers Can Refuse Marriage Licenses to Gays

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    You don't have to be a constitutional scholar to know animus is a basic principle of constitutional law. I will also predict the future for you:

    1. If clerks in Texas refuse to issue marriage licenses to same sex couples, they will be sued.

    2. The will lose in court.

    3. The social conservatives then will bitch about activist judges ignoring the fact that those clerks were violating a basic tenant of constitutional law.
    One and two may be correct, but number three? We are so far from constitutional law here it isn't even funny. This is the very definition of pyrrhic victory.
    Roberts wrote: "If you are among the many Americans -- of whatever sexual orientation -- who favor expanding same-sex marriage, by all means celebrate today's decision. ... But do not celebrate the Constitution. It had nothing to do with it."

  8. #208
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    Re: Texas AG Says Workers Can Refuse Marriage Licenses to Gays

    Quote Originally Posted by keymanjim View Post
    That's good. Since I've had my eyes on these 14 year old Asian twins for a while now.
    They're both female so you'll probably disapprove. But, how does my marrying them affect you?
    Stupid argument. A 14 year old, just like a dog, chimp, or inanimate object, cannot consent. Legal consent by both parties is a legal prerequisite for any marriage.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

  9. #209
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    Re: Texas AG Says Workers Can Refuse Marriage Licenses to Gays

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    One and two may be correct, but number three? We are so far from constitutional law here it isn't even funny. This is the very definition of pyrrhic victory.
    Constitutional law 101: What is an is not constitutional is determined by the federal court system, not by some dude going by the name of clownboy on an internet forum.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

  10. #210
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    Re: Texas AG Says Workers Can Refuse Marriage Licenses to Gays

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Emotional jibber jabber from the side that lost. Get serious, this isn't a constitutional crisis anymore than Loving v. Virginia was.
    Not a constitutional crisis, but rather the moment the camel finally announces itself in the tent. We left constitutional ages ago.
    Roberts wrote: "If you are among the many Americans -- of whatever sexual orientation -- who favor expanding same-sex marriage, by all means celebrate today's decision. ... But do not celebrate the Constitution. It had nothing to do with it."

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