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Confederacy purge continues while last century's villians ignored

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Deuce said:
Because more customers are upset by confederate flags right now than Che t-shirts.

Don't think there was ever any motivation besides profit.
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Do you think they actually conducted a poll of their customers? Or did they just make arbitrary decisions?
 
Μολὼν λαβέ;1064772681 said:
And it looks like you know nothing of what you are defending.

The US flag flew over slavery for at least 87 years, the Confederate flag for 4.

You obviously don't get the point. If you want to take down/ban symbols of slavery then take down the US flag too. Or, just continue with your selective outrage, which I'm guessing you will do.
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If the US flag represents slavery then what does the confederate flag represent?
 
Deuce said:
Prove that none of them were racist.
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If you are making an accusation of racism... it is up to YOU to prove racism against each and every individual.

You don't get to make an accusation, and then demand someone else prove you wrong, without supporting your accusations yourself.


This attitude that once an accusation of racism is made someone has to prove otherwise is absolute garbage, and the lowest of the low in forms of public debate.
 
JumpinJack said:
One difference is obvious: Lenin and Stalin were leaders of a country. Guevara was a revolutionary considered by many to be a hero. Don't know if he was also an official.

Second difference: The latter are people. The former is a symbol.

Third difference: The latter don't have direct connections to a harmful period in our history.

Fourth difference: There have not been any mass murders in recent history by people carrying or wearing pics of those people.

Fifth difference: They are not representations of the denial of any Americans their constitutional rights.

Pitiful to try to connect the selling of the Confederate Flag with pics of historical people. Although I can only imagine the kind of wackos who would buy any of that stuff, whether it's the Confed. flag or pics of dictators.
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So, it is okay to support FOREIGN oppressive leaders and symbols........ just not ones that originated in the U.S.

Your argument is invalid....
 
Moot said:
If the US flag represents slavery then what does the confederate flag represent?
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Since you want a symbol of racism taken down then take them all down. Seems fair to me. To do otherwise is hypocritical.
 
Μολὼν λαβέ;1064772791 said:
Since you want a symbol of racism taken down then take them all down. Seems fair to me. To do otherwise is hypocritical.
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The US didn't fight for slavery, it fought against it. Your argument is stupid.
 
Kal'Stang said:
So tired of hearing this. Prove that they were traitors and that all of them were racist. Show me one single court case of someone convicted for treason that served under that flag. Prove that every single person that fought under that flag was racist.
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Treasonous, no. The people who fought on behalf of the confederacy were bravely fighting for their country; just like the Union troops. Constitutionally you can make a pretty good case for the right of a state to succeed; (as Jefferson argues in protest against the Alien and Sedition Acts).

But racist, hell yes.

The south gets to be non-racist unless someone can prove that each individual person in the south was also racist? I think the burden of proof is slightly misplaced. "Prove everyone is" is better constructed as "Prove one isn't".

If you want to claim that the entire South didn't fight the war for racist reasons, you need to find one person who fought for the South for reasons other than slavery AND who also thought that either slavery was wrong or that blacks and whites should be equal. Moreover, this can't be just a soldier on the ground. This needs to be someone who's opinion mattered at the time. Obviously that's pretty much impossible as most northerners were also racist.

But this doesn't make the south worse than the north. After all, both the north and the south committed genocide against the Native Americans in the name of manifest destiny. All countries and peoples have "blemishes" in their past.
 
Roadvirus said:
So....anyway care to defend Amazon.com and it's support for murderous commies?
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Well, heck, I'm not even from the South, born and raised Canadian, and live in Western NY, and I called Amazon yesterday and cancelled my Amazon-Prime membership and told them that if they wanted, like many other business, to base their business model on politics, that I would do the same. Small thing I know, but the lady I spoke with said they've been getting calls all day on that.. :)

Seems I'm not the only one.

Tim-
 
HorseLoverGirl said:
Sad thing is I can hear my granddaddy turning over in his grave right now. He warned me for years that this kind of thing was gonna happen, and he was sadly right. Of course someone forgot to tell Mitch McConnell that there is at least one monument to President Davis that he cannot get his paws on. I know where it is also.
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Sadly this should have happened a few generation before your granddaddy ever uttered his prediction.

Better late than never I suppose.
 
haymarket said:
Sadly this should have happened a few generation before your granddaddy ever uttered his prediction.

Better late than never I suppose.
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Sad thing is we are not blaming our horribly pathetic mental health system for these mass shootings, but a flag. That is very sad.
 
HorseLoverGirl said:
Sad thing is we are not blaming our horribly pathetic mental health system for these mass shootings, but a flag. That is very sad.
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There is no easy fix, nor easy "kick the can" method to address the mental health issue in the US. Therefore it is ignored, even though everyone knows its the 800lb. gorilla in the room.
 
Moot said:
The US didn't fight for slavery, it fought against it. Your argument is stupid.
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What's stupid is commenting on something you obviously no nothing about. Slavery was part of the founding principles of the US.

It was legal for at least 87 years in the USA. Still selective in your outrage I see.

How about these racist slave owners? Should their likenesses be taken down from government buildings or on forms of government currency? Why not just take down the Declaration of Independence as well?

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Ockham said:
There is no easy fix, nor easy "kick the can" method to address the mental health issue in the US. Therefore it is ignored, even though everyone knows its the 800lb. gorilla in the room.
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Exactly. Horrible mental healthcare not to mention stigmatizing the mentally ill is what has gotten us to this point. The flag, US, Confederate, Rainbow, or whatever has not caused all this
 
haymarket said:
Sadly this should have happened a few generation before your granddaddy ever uttered his prediction.

Better late than never I suppose.
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they have every right and a new USAToday poll has the nation split down the middle on the issue. So it's not as cut and dry as you think
 
Μολὼν λαβέ;1064773317 said:
What's stupid is commenting on something you obviously no nothing about.
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We'll see about that.

So tell me, if slavery was such a part of the founding principles, then why isn't the word slavery plastered all over the Constitution, BoR or DoI? In fact, it's not mentioned at all. How come?

It was legal for at least 87 years in the USA. Still selective in your outrage I see.
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People were outraged. Does Harpers Ferry ring a bell? It was called the abolitionist movement....I'm not surprised you've never heard of it.

How about these racist slave owners? Should their likenesses be taken down from government buildings or on forms of government currency? Why not just take down the Declaration of Independence as well?

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HorseLoverGirl said:
Sad thing is we are not blaming our horribly pathetic mental health system for these mass shootings, but a flag. That is very sad.
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Or... just blame idiots.


Why is some part of society to blame for an individual's actions?

Our Mental health system helps those that it can....but if one doesn't go to seek help..... how can the "mental health system" do anything about it?
 
Ockham said:
There is no easy fix, nor easy "kick the can" method to address the mental health issue in the US. Therefore it is ignored, even though everyone knows its the 800lb. gorilla in the room.
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So.... then you have documentation proving that he was turned down for requested mental health assistance at some relevant point before the shooting????
 
HorseLoverGirl said:
Exactly. Horrible mental healthcare not to mention stigmatizing the mentally ill is what has gotten us to this point. The flag, US, Confederate, Rainbow, or whatever has not caused all this
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Wrong again.

People are crazy. Besides putting us all on mind-slaving drugs at birth...... there is absolutely nothing we can do to prevent this sort of thing from happen from a mental health standpoint.

I am so sick of people blaming some obscure facet of society like, "The mental health care system" with zero knowledge on whether or not any form of assistance was requested.

Or are you to tell me that mental health care folks should burst into everyone's home and forcibly conduct some kind of special brain examination???????
 
Moot said:
Not much we can do about the racist slave owners before the war. But there is no excuse for honoring those that caused the war or kept the southern cause alive.
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AKA: I am selective in my outrage against those who were "racist slave owners".... as only those involved in the Confederacy.
 
Guys, give up.

It's over.

The flag is done for.
 
Caine said:
AKA: I am selective in my outrage against those who were "racist slave owners".... as only those involved in the Confederacy.
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The confederacy is just another word for traitor.
 
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