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Thread: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Europe walked away from Greece. Paul Mason is the go-to guy on the subject.

    " We’re staying in Europe! says the headline of the Greek liberal paper Kathimerini today.

    While the far left government will pose the referendum as a vote for or against austerity, the right will say it’s an in-out vote for the single currency and the EU itself.

    The problem is, at around 4pm on Saturday Europe changed. Faced with a proposal from the Greeks to extend the existing bailout until after 7 July, the Eurogroup refused.

    At this point chairman Jeroen Dijsselbloem announced there would be “a meeting of the 18” – that is the Eurogroup without Greece. Asked how such a meeting could issue a communique he replied, according to a Greek witness “we can do what we like since we are an ad hoc body”.

    The Brussels press corps dutifully reported that the Greeks had “walked out”. But if the Greek account is right, what happened at that moment was the psychological breakpoint of the Euro... "

    - See more at: Greece referendum: did the euro just die at 4pm? | Paul Mason | Paul Mason

    The only thing in doubt at the moment is whether the Troika will undemocratically pull the plug before the referendum is held.
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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by Manc Skipper View Post
    Europe walked away from Greece. Paul Mason is the go-to guy on the subject.

    " We’re staying in Europe! says the headline of the Greek liberal paper Kathimerini today.

    While the far left government will pose the referendum as a vote for or against austerity, the right will say it’s an in-out vote for the single currency and the EU itself.

    The problem is, at around 4pm on Saturday Europe changed. Faced with a proposal from the Greeks to extend the existing bailout until after 7 July, the Eurogroup refused.

    At this point chairman Jeroen Dijsselbloem announced there would be “a meeting of the 18” – that is the Eurogroup without Greece. Asked how such a meeting could issue a communique he replied, according to a Greek witness “we can do what we like since we are an ad hoc body”.

    The Brussels press corps dutifully reported that the Greeks had “walked out”. But if the Greek account is right, what happened at that moment was the psychological breakpoint of the Euro... "

    - See more at: Greece referendum: did the euro just die at 4pm? | Paul Mason | Paul Mason

    The only thing in doubt at the moment is whether the Troika will undemocratically pull the plug before the referendum is held.
    There would be no crisis had the current Greek government not won office on an irresponsible platform with no chance of enactment. This is on the Greeks.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    There would be no crisis had the current Greek government not won office on an irresponsible platform with no chance of enactment. This is on the Greeks.
    So this crisis has developed only since Jan 28th 2015?
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    So this crisis has developed only since Jan 28th 2015?
    No it started a while back.

    Greece was spending more than they took in in revenues prior to entering into the European Union under false pretenses and then continued to borrow and spend while taking advantage of a single currency and their status as a EU member Nation.

    They spread toxic bonds throughout European banks while they continued to misrepresent their financial position on debt and deficits until finally their debt was downgraded in 2009.

    Lies lies and more lies until the eventually ran out of other people's money.

    Go figure. Debt isn't inconsequential at all.

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    EC has published full draft proposal.

    In the interest of transparency and for the information of the Greek people, the European Commission is publishing the latest proposals agreed among the three institutions (European Commission, European Central Bank and International Monetary Fund), which take into account the proposals of the Greek authorities of 8, 14, 22 and 25 June 2015 as well as the talks at political and technical level throughout the week.
    Discussions on this text were ongoing with the Greek authorities on Friday night in view of the Eurogroup of 27 June 2015. The understanding of all parties involved was that this Eurogroup meeting should achieve a comprehensive deal for Greece, one that would have included not just the measures to be jointly agreed, but would also have addressed future financing needs and the sustainability of the Greek debt. It also included support for a Commission-led package for a new start for jobs and growth in Greece, boosting recovery of and investment in the real economy, which was discussed and endorsed by the College of Commissioners on Wednesday 24 June 2015.
    However, neither this latest version of the document, nor an outline of a comprehensive deal could be formally finalised and presented to the Eurogroup due to the unilateral decision of the Greek authorities to abandon the process on the evening of 26 June 2015.
    European Commission - PRESS RELEASES - Press release - Information from the European Commission on the latest draft proposals in the context of negotiations with Greece

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    So this crisis has developed only since Jan 28th 2015?
    It had its origins at least as far back as the Karamanlis government. (I lived in Athens 2003-2006.) More recently, the Samaras government had a sound plan to deal with financial difficulties, but was swept out of power by Tsipras's demagogic campaign. Tsipras is now trapped by his own rhetoric, and has brought on the crisis.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    It had its origins at least as far back as the Karamanlis government. (I lived in Athens 2003-2006.) More recently, the Samaras government had a sound plan to deal with financial difficulties, but was swept out of power by Tsipras's demagogic campaign. Tsipras is now trapped by his own rhetoric, and has brought on the crisis.
    Samaras did such a bang-up job that he was defeated. Resoundingly. He was a part of that old, ruling oligarchy that got Greece into the mess. He was Finance Minister at a time when the very worst abuses of corruption were being committed. Hardly surprising he lost and hardly surprising that having done so he's now conspiring with Brussels to explore some kind of coup.
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

    "Austerity is used as a cover to reconfigure society and increase inequality and injustice." - Jeremy Corbyn

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    It had its origins at least as far back as the Karamanlis government. (I lived in Athens 2003-2006.) More recently, the Samaras government had a sound plan to deal with financial difficulties, but was swept out of power by Tsipras's demagogic campaign. Tsipras is now trapped by his own rhetoric, and has brought on the crisis.
    citations needed, but most metrics don't seem to agree






    despite

    Last edited by SlevinKelevra; 06-28-15 at 10:34 AM.

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Samaras did such a bang-up job that he was defeated. Resoundingly. He was a part of that old, ruling oligarchy that got Greece into the mess. He was Finance Minister at a time when the very worst abuses of corruption were being committed. Hardly surprising he lost and hardly surprising that having done so he's now conspiring with Brussels to explore some kind of coup.
    You don't know the history. Samaras served in no Greek government between 1992 and 2009. He had no responsibility whatsoever for the abuses.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by SlevinKelevra View Post
    citations needed, but most metrics don't seem to agree






    despite

    Read a newspaper. There is no doubt the required steps were painful.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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