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Thread: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

  1. #271
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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by DDD View Post
    After Rome and the Byzantines the next order of business for Greece is to ruin the EU.
    If anything it was their fellow Christians in the 4th Crusade that ruined Byzantium. How did the Greeks ruin the Romans?

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Paddy Power has started paying out to people gambling on a 'Yes' in the referendum.

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    How exactly does democracy overcome mathematics?

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by DDD View Post
    I provided dates and the century, I have a historical book to support the above mentioned claims, while you give me Weak-O-Pedia?
    Okay, so you think the Byzantine Empire wasn't Greek, and began 3 centuries after it was created by Constantine the Great in 330CE. Fine. I'll leave you to your ignorance.
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

    "Austerity is used as a cover to reconfigure society and increase inequality and injustice." - Jeremy Corbyn

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Okay, so you think the Byzantine Empire wasn't Greek, and began 3 centuries after it was created by Constantine the Great in 330CE.
    Constantine the Great was Dardanian. By definition the Byzantines were not a Greek empire alone. Others ruled the empire and after Foca's despotism the Greeks invited the Cartagenian Heraclious to defeat Foca with the promise to make Heraclious King should he defeat Foca. So it happened and then the two did a "bang up job" maintaining and ruling the Empire, especially since they allowed in Slavs, which took lands and enslaved its native inhabitants (including us).

    So now its the EU's turn.

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Fine. I'll leave you to your ignorance.
    Now I will leave you to an elevated knowledgable state.
    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    Stats come out and always show life getting better. News makes money in making you think its not.
    The Republic of Dardania is the proper name for: http://www.debatepolitics.com/europe...ification.html

  6. #276
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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by PoS View Post
    If anything it was their fellow Christians in the 4th Crusade that ruined Byzantium. How did the Greeks ruin the Romans?
    Neither we nor Greeks wanted to cooperate with the Romans.
    Quote Originally Posted by poweRob View Post
    Stats come out and always show life getting better. News makes money in making you think its not.
    The Republic of Dardania is the proper name for: http://www.debatepolitics.com/europe...ification.html

  7. #277
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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite Chaos View Post
    Absolutely agree - however it is also clear the major EU nations knew or should have suspected that Greece was not in the best condition to share a currency. If you as a wealthy, hardworking person agreed to share financial status and an account with someone way below you in terms of output, industry etc why would you be surprised that the person was using your good reputation and buying what he / she couldn't afford?

    Germany and France were the first to break the spending limits... So the Greeks looking on could hardly be blamed for thinking "why shouldn't we?" .

    Uhm, Greece NEVER qualified under the Maastricht rules on deficit spending.

    They weren't persuaded or influenced after watching others spend, Greece is a Country not a child.

    They were spending beyond their means prior to entering into the Union amd they never stopped until their debt was downgraded.

    Greece Caught Underreporting Its Budget Deficit By Nearly 50% | Zero Hedge

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by DDD View Post
    Constantine the Great was Dardanian.
    Born in York to Thracian-Illyrian parents. Saying he's 'Dardanian' is like claiming Jesus was Israeli or Hannibal was Tunisian, only even more stupid since there's no such country as Dardania.
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

    "Austerity is used as a cover to reconfigure society and increase inequality and injustice." - Jeremy Corbyn

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    That's not true. The Greek debt hasn't suddenly increased. Government spending hasn't increased. The past accumulation of debt is what the whole discussion is about. It's not about a debt that the Syriza government has had any hand in creating. This very current banking issue has been created by the limit of the ELA by the institutions in retaliation for Tsipras call for a referendum. Tsipras has called their bluff and hence Juncker has come back with an improved offer, which the Greek government are currently discussing, one that will make the payment to the IMF slightly more possible. of course, Juncker has added the rider that acceptance of this deal will be contingent on Tsipras recommending a yes vote on the referendum - so much for Merkel's assurance that no external force will try to influence the electorate's decision.
    The current Greek government deliberately provoked a liquidity and possibly solvency crisis in its banking system. The capital controls and pension rationing were completely avoidable and unnecessary had the government acted with a view of Greece's larger interests, not Syriza's narrower ones.

    The European Union needs to communicate forcefully to the Greek people that the referendum has implications for Greece's Euro Zone viability. While Europe almost certainly won't attempt to expel Greece, something Tsipiras would probably prefer rather than his having to make a choice, a Greek rejection could prolong the capital controls as the self-inflicted liquidity crisis intensifies. It could also lead to the ECB's withdrawing part of its emergency liquidity assistance, triggering a solvency crisis.

    On the debt issue, the matter is more complex. To the extent that the Tsipiras government has created the liquidity crisis and to the extent that situation undercuts macroeconomic activity, Greece's debt burden relative to its economy will increase. So, even if it doesn't increase in absolute terms, a relative increase would occur.

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    Re: Greece's Tsipras calls referendum to break bailout deadlock

    Quote Originally Posted by AliHajiSheik View Post
    How exactly does democracy overcome mathematics?
    The referendum has little to do with democracy. It has almost everything to do with a radical government's seeking to offload its leadership responsibilities on the people in order to evade accountability for the consequences of the reckless fiscal and financial crisis it provoked.

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