• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Supreme Court Upholds Obama Health Care Subsidies[W:700]

6-3 is solid

Exactly. So now what does the right wing do about this law they hate? At what point do you simply fold your tent and realize you have lost?
 
Yep, you better pray for Hilary. Except liberals aren't Christian, so do whatever you do in place of prayer....wish upon a star maybe.

Hillary is the only chance obamacare has.

And you and o both know this is never happening, it'll be Marco Rubip or 8 more years of Bush

You cons are a funny bunch. Your GOP politicians go on and on about the evils of immigration, and illegal immigrants but even when the GOP is in charge, they never,ever do anything about illegal immigration. The don't do anything because the GOP is very, very pro-business, and businesses LOVE immigrants, both legal and illegal. But you cons fall for the GOP smoke and mirrors and foaming at the mouth rhetoric concerning immigration every single time. You guys just don't catch on.

Same thing with ACA. I doubt very much a Republican will win the WH in 2016, but if they do they won't do a damn thing about ACA. They'll talk and talk, and fire up you cons with the rhetoric, just like immigration, but in the end they won't do a thing.

You guys are gullible as hell.
 
why can't the conservative judges just vote in a sheep-like block like the liberal judges do on EVERY MAJOR DECISION? Why can't they sell out to their party's own political needs and ignore the constitution?

I will say this. If a republican wins the white house it will be because Obamacare is still an issue they can take out and beat the crap out of Hillary with(in a debate). this vote won't make it any more popular than it was this morning. keeping the issue alive helps the GOP in the race.


Heya JT. :2wave: Didn't take long. ;)



Hillary Clinton
✔ ‎@HillaryClinton
Yes! SCOTUS affirms what we know is true in our hearts & under the law: Health insurance should be affordable & available to all. -H
9:37 AM - 25 Jun 2015

Bernie Sanders
✔ ‎@BernieSanders
The Supreme Court recognized the common-sense reading of the ACA. Access to affordable health care shouldn't depend on where you live. 10:22 AM - 25 Jun 2015



Marco Rubio
✔ ‎@marcorubio
I remain committed to repealing this bad law and replacing it...9:32 AM - 25 Jun 2015

Jeb Bush
✔ ‎@JebBush
I am disappointed in the Burwell decision, but this is not the end of the fight against ObamaCare. http://jeb.cm/1GtskNQ 10:26 AM - 25 Jun 2015 .....snip~


https://www.yahoo.com/politics/scotus-obamacare-2016-candidates-react-122431771361.html
 
Math is a tricky concept for some.

These are the people that claim a Government could and should borrow, print and spend their way into prosperity.

Of-course when that strategy crashes and burns, they blame the Banks, Creditors, Corporations and Bush.

There is an almost superstitious understanding of math with the left.

Its only used as a means to further the agenda (lies).
 
Yep, you better pray for Hilary. Except liberals aren't Christian, so do whatever you do in place of prayer....wish upon a star maybe.

Hillary is the only chance obamacare has.

And you and o both know this is never happening, it'll be Marco Rubip or 8 more years of Bush

What is never happening is the repeal of the ACA and can only I hope the GOP candidate will be in favor of repeal. That will guarantee a Democratic win across the board. The idea that you believe voters will elect another Bush is quite laughable too.
uninsured-rate-gallup-april-2015.png
 

if your'e going to post pictures of people that have lost you need to post a picture of the American Middle class.

And the Millions of people that have been introduced to chronic unemployment and dependance.

If I remember correctly the Democrats who were up for election in the 2014 elections avoided ObamaCare like it was the plague.

And they still got their clocks cleaned.

What this decision did was let the GOP Congress off the hook and put the disaster that is ObamaCare right back in the laps of the Democrats

They'll have no one to blame in 2016
 
What is never happening is the repeal of the ACA and can only I hope the GOP candidate will be in favor of repeal. That will guarantee a Democratic win across the board. The idea that you believe voters will elect another Bush is quite laughable too.
uninsured-rate-gallup-april-2015.png

Why would the GOP want to repeal something that responsible for the job losses of so many Democrat Politicians ?
 
Instead of moderate rate increases for one more year, the big rate increases have begun.

You people say that every year. It never happens.

The newly ensured numbers can be attributed almost entirely to the expansion of Medicaid

No evidence offered to back that up.

You stuck your nose into a conversation I was having with Pete

Thanks for that. Another hearty laugh for me.

>>who claimed that many many people would die if the subsidies were removed and that's why the Supreme Court upheld it.

No, he did NOT say "many many."

Bringing down Obamacare would be especially messy as it would be the cause of many deaths of many people who depend upon Obamacare.

>>I called that claim nonsense.

Yes, you did.

>>I haven't changed any argument.

You changed from "many" to "many many."

>>Perhaps you'd like to comprehend what you're talking about or mind your own business.

I choose the former.

>>I proved your point wrong and now you whine about it.

Another hearty laugh. What are you talking about?
 
Heya JT. :2wave: Didn't take long. ;)

Kasich, Snyder, Sandoval, Martinez to name a few who took ME are no doubt relieved and happy.

I see Scalia is now calling it SCOTUScare . :lamo
 
I'd indicate to you that in my view, looking at this realistically, the next major move to alter or replace the ACA will be a single payer system similar to those in every other G20 nation. Reform will not go backwards. The insurance companies won't stand for it and there will never, in the highly divided US political system,be sufficient votes to simply rescind it.

Your only chance was to have an honest Chief Justice with the integrity to do his job as he swore under oath - you lost that chance when he wavered and caved to vanity and ego, not wanting to go down in history as the Chief Justice who, rightly, overturned the unconstitutional ACA.
I won't delve into your closing statement, but I'm in FULL agreement with your opening paragraph.

You make a very practical argument. That being said, I don't see single-payer coming quickly or (definitely not) easily. Mrs. Clinton is a strong universal healthcare proponent, so there may be possibilities if she were to get into office, but I'm not sure if her allegiance to big money will allow it. A public-option would be a further push in the direction of single-payer, and might be more doable. In fact, a public-option may be the initial construct leading to expansion to full single-payer (I would just expand MediCare by lowering the age over time - no idea if that's politically feasible; I doubt it, and the ACA seems to be the national umbrella system now).
 
No need to wonder. Reactionaries don't rely on facts. The liberal/progressive machine exposes their lies.



The claim is that millions would lose health insurance if the ACA subsidies were eliminated. I'm not much interested in counting corpses. And I see you've now changed to "many many." Should I assume you'd be content with just "many"?



I don't know what yer talking about. I'm sure you don't either.



You check it out.

View attachment 67186221

The only time it's been lower in the past forty years is after the Clinton economy got rolling and in the Bush43 housing bubble.



I did......what happened?


Missouri and Illinois had among the highest rates of black unemployment in 2014, according to a new study by the Economic Policy Institute.

Missouri's rise of 3.2 percentage points in black unemployment from 2013 to 2014 year was the second highest among the states, according to the study by EPI economist Valerie Wilson, which was released Thursday. Black unemployment fell in most states in 2014, according to the study, but spiked up in Wisconsin and Missouri.

Black unemployment averaged 11.4 percent nationally last year, but was 14.7 percent in Illinois and 14.4 percent in Missouri, according to the EPI, a liberal nonprofit think tank that researches economic trends and policies and their impact on labor.

“The unemployment rate for black communities is at a crisis level, even as the economy gets closer and closer to a full recovery,” Wilson said. Wilson's analysis said that Wisconsin (19.9 percent), Nevada, (16.1), Michigan (15.8), the District of Columbia (15.7), and Iowa (15.6) last year had higher black unemployment rates than Illinois and Missouri.....snip~

Black unemployment in Missouri, Illinois, among highest : News



Did you want to try a chart for those not looking for a job too?
 
LOL. Actually, the Progressive Machine invents the best facts their money can buy. It depends on the gullible to buy them and spread them. As can be seen.

Indeed. Does the name Gruber and 'Stupid American voter' ring any bell?
 
Exactly. So now what does the right wing do about this law they hate? At what point do you simply fold your tent and realize you have lost?

Probably hope to win the presidency and both houses, but even that won't result in an ending ACA.
 
Maybe the Cons will finally stop trying to rely on legislation from the bench. Perhaps they will get smart and actually work WITH the PPACA (fix the legislation, where appropriate and expand state exchanges), because they are out of options in working against it.

Screw that.

We were busy buying health insurance industry and pharmaceutical stocks.

While you guys were celebrating your victory - we were cashing in on your mistakes.

Health Care Stocks Soar After Obamacare Victory In Supreme Court
 
Heya JT. :2wave: Didn't take long. ;)



Hillary Clinton
✔ ‎@HillaryClinton
Yes! SCOTUS affirms what we know is true in our hearts & under the law: Health insurance should be affordable & available to all. -H
9:37 AM - 25 Jun 2015

Bernie Sanders
✔ ‎@BernieSanders
The Supreme Court recognized the common-sense reading of the ACA. Access to affordable health care shouldn't depend on where you live. 10:22 AM - 25 Jun 2015



Marco Rubio
✔ ‎@marcorubio
I remain committed to repealing this bad law and replacing it...9:32 AM - 25 Jun 2015

Jeb Bush
✔ ‎@JebBush
I am disappointed in the Burwell decision, but this is not the end of the fight against ObamaCare. http://jeb.cm/1GtskNQ 10:26 AM - 25 Jun 2015 .....snip~


https://www.yahoo.com/politics/scotus-obamacare-2016-candidates-react-122431771361.html

"Health insurance should be affordable & available to all."
Harruummphh! I don't see ObamaCare doing either. What I do see it doing is increasing the costs to the middle class, shrinking that very middle class they claim to be so worried about.

Next it'll end up being 'I don't dare go to the doctor even if I am sick, because I can't afford the deductibles and copays. Needed surgeries? Out of the question'.

The death of the middle class, quite literally.
 
Kasich, Snyder, Sandoval, Martinez to name a few who took ME are no doubt relieved and happy.

I see Scalia is now calling it SCOTUScare . :lamo



Heya Nimby. :2wave: What do you mean questioning, he dissented. Plus told it.....how it is. ;)



Dr. Rand Paul
✔ ‎@RandPaul
This decision turns both the rule of law and common sense on its head. #KingvBurwell 10:06 AM - 25 Jun 2015



Dr. Rand Paul
✔ ‎@RandPaul
As President I would make it my mission to repeal #Obamacare, and propose real solutions for our healthcare system. http://bit.ly/1Gtx2v0.....snip~
 
Moving the goalpost on dishonesty.....doesn't help your point of view.

I realize you placed the dishonesty goalposts to a position where you can easily hit them....but my point stands.

You are complaining the states can't do things as well as the Feds, but you can't admit that, so you jibber and jabber.
 
I realize you placed the dishonesty goalposts to a position where you can easily hit them....but my point stands.

You are complaining the states can't do things as well as the Feds, but you can't admit that, so you jibber and jabber.

On July 1, 2012, House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D., Calif.) appeared on "Meet the Press," where she promised that "everybody will have lower rates, better quality care and better access" as a result of the Affordable Care Act (a.k.a. Obamacare).


 
No evidence offered to back that up.

Private Insurance market gains: 2.4 million

Medicaid Insurance gains: 6.0 million

71% of all newly insured through 2014 were from Medicaid Expansion. (source)
 
I realize you placed the dishonesty goalposts to a position where you can easily hit them....but my point stands.

You are complaining the states can't do things as well as the Feds, but you can't admit that, so you jibber and jabber.



Yeah I did.....Right where you were standing with the leftist brethren. Plus I keep it there. Where it belongs with its Rightful owners. So no need to even try and flinch. I don't miss.

Yet then I did put up Scalia dissent which pointed out two aspects that were factual. Then of course there was the point of the Forbes article. But it is alright for you to deflect why you are slow on picking up on what I believe.

Which then I put up Vermont as an example of a State that did exceptionally well. Yet even seeing it with your own very eyes. You still couldn't figure it out.
 
Yea, well I worked my 40 years so you're welcome.

Then you don't need Obamacare but if you really want me to take care of you send me your SS number so I can deduct you as an exemption?
 

You made a specific claim: "Being insured and being able to afford treatment are two separate things. That is why disapproval remains high."

You showed me a poll about disapproval, but nothing to shed light on why. That's why I asked for the internals, that would go deeper than the top line number.

Ah, the old "Find something better or shut up!" Argument. The health care industry of 2008 was better than today. Today some more people have insurance but that doesn't mean that they can afford to go to the doctor. The PPACA solution to health care is like trying to solve world hunger by handing out dinner plates.

If it was better then, the the GOP plan should be "Repeal." Period. Not even the GOPers think that works with the public, which is why they added the "replace" to their slogan, with a plan that is continually 'to be named later' but.... I'll turn it over to FDR:

Cross our hearts and hope to die, we believe in all these things; but we do not like the way the present Administration is doing them. Just turn them over to us. We will do all of them- we will do more of them we will do them better; and, most important of all, the doing of them will not cost anybody anything."

As to the 'have insurance but can't afford treatment' claim - what is your evidence? The ACA caps total out of pocket, including premiums. So I'm not really sure why someone insured (who wasn't before) is less able to afford insurance than they were when uninsured. Is the percentage of income cap too high? And if the cost to insureds is lowered, how is that paid for, by taxpayers though higher healthcare related taxes or by less covered care? One of the two...

I've helped several previously uninsured through the ACA process. A typical one is a lady who works for us occasionally. She's reasonably healthy, makes about $15,000, and her total premiums plus out of pocket was capped at about $60 per month for a silver plan. It's not great insurance, it's the cheapest silver plan, but she is FAR better off, and she'd tell you that. I'm sure others are worse off, but that's going to be true of any change to the system.
 
you are more than welcome to leave it

somalia would seem to be a place where you would have no such 'problems'

If you really want me to take care of you send me your SS number so I can claim you as an exemption. I quite frankly have no problem with personal responsibility but apparently you do. Think you will get the same opportunities in Somalia as you have here and a liberal machine to provide you with all you want?
 
;)

Colorado (higher taxes): "The Connect for Health Colorado board of directors voted unanimously Thursday to raise the fees it charges on health insurance policies to bolster its finances as federal grants run out later this year. The state health insurance exchange raised the fee on 2016 plans purchased through its marketplace from the current 1.4 percent of premiums to 3.5 percent, the same rate charged on the federal exchange...Although insurance carriers pay the fees to the exchange, they acknowledge fees are passed on to consumers in one form or another...The fee increases are projected to help bring revenues to about $40 million in fiscal year 2015-16. It would cover operational expenses, but not capital costs, such as improving the computer system…"....snip~

Obamacare Updates: Tale of Fail from Coast to Coast - Guy Benson

Of course by then I will be on Medicare.
 
Back
Top Bottom