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Thread: Supreme Court Upholds Obama Health Care Subsidies[W:700]

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    Re: Supreme Court Upholds Obama Health Care Subsidies[W:700]

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    Most of the drop in the misery index was due to interest rates coming down after the Fed raised them to put a stake in the 70s era inflation, in part because of Nixon (R) taking us off the gold standard. Reagan's big tax cuts and huge deficit spending had nothing to do with those interest rates coming down, although Keynesian stimulus probably did bring the unemployment rate around quicker than if he'd raised taxes or slashed spending to fight the evils of DEFICITS!! "You know, Paul, Reagan proved deficits don't matter."
    Yes, and do you understand what the Reagan tax cuts did? Think the 17 million jobs created has anything to do with a reduction in the misery index? Reagan proved that deficits that generated double the GDP, created 17 millions jobs and a total debt of 52% of GDP is a pretty good return on investment. Deficits obviously don't matter to you and Obama because we have created 7.6 Trillion of them and 3 million jobs in 8 years after the end of the recession.

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    Re: Supreme Court Upholds Obama Health Care Subsidies[W:700]

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    Look, if the Misery Index is a gauge of economic policies and if lower is better and that's all we need to know about how effective are an Administration's policies, then clearly and obviously Obama has done a better job than Reagan who could never bring the Misery index down to current levels, even with two full terms.

    Now you're caught and have to backtrack because the data don't show what you hoped to prove, which is always republicans ==> Good, democrats ==> BAD!!!
    Actually Conservative economic policies that empower people good, Democrat economic policies that empower govt. bad.

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    Re: Supreme Court Upholds Obama Health Care Subsidies[W:700]

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    You people can cheerlead each other while ignoring context and poor economic policies. Are you telling me that the high inflation on top of the 81-82 recession didn't affect the value of your dollar? How did this recession affect you and your family? Do you realize that many banks were forced to take TARP and that the 350 billion Bush lent was paid back with interest? What did Obama do with the money?
    "Forced to take TARP." LMAO. I suppose there is some truth to that - they didn't really need TARP because sugar daddy Uncle Federal Reserve was funneling those same banks who "didn't need" the TARP bailouts 10 times TARP in liquid capital behind the scenes. When the Fed allows banks to put up the equivalent of toilet paper as collateral for Fed loans, sure, the taxpayer TARP funds were just gravy.

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    Re: Supreme Court Upholds Obama Health Care Subsidies[W:700]

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Really? so people don't compare the affects of a recession to their own economic conditions? Therein is another difference between conservatives and liberals. conservatives understand leadership and the U.S. economy whereas liberals understand one thing, spending in the name of compassion.

    When you get a tax cut what does that do to your paycheck and what do you do with the money? As I stated millions and millions of Americans weren't affected by this recession and you have yet to refute that. You don't get it and never will. This country's economy isn't built on govt. spending whereas most of the world's economy is. That is where austerity and the debt bubble hurt the most.
    I don't know about liberals and conservatives, but people who know how economics work understand that GDP = private sector spending + government spending - trade deficit. They also understand that a recession is defined as two consecutive reductions in GDP. Federal spending is 20% of GDP, State Spending is 9% and local government is 10%.

    That means the government as a whole directly accounts for 40% of the US GDP. Indirectly it's considerably higher. When you consider that the Federal Highway system, the initial internet infrastructure, and almost all of the basic research behind things like computer chips were all government programs, it's easy to see that effective government is single most effective economic driver.

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    Re: Supreme Court Upholds Obama Health Care Subsidies[W:700]

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    "Forced to take TARP." LMAO. I suppose there is some truth to that - they didn't really need TARP because sugar daddy Uncle Federal Reserve was funneling those same banks who "didn't need" the TARP bailouts 10 times TARP in liquid capital behind the scenes. When the Fed allows banks to put up the equivalent of toilet paper as collateral for Fed loans, sure, the taxpayer TARP funds were just gravy.
    Yep

    Bankers: Take your TARP money back - Mar. 27, 2009

    Goldman Sachs (GS, Fortune 500), Bank of New York/Mellon (BK, Fortune 500), Wells Fargo (WFC, Fortune 500), JP Morgan Chase (JPM, Fortune 500) and Bank of America (BAC, Fortune 500) - all 'mega-banks' that the government forced to take bailout money - say they want to return taxpayer funds "as soon as practical."
    Get it yet? Light bulb go off yet? Ready to admit you are wrong yet? Ready to admit that Obama and liberal elites have lied to you yet?

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    Re: Supreme Court Upholds Obama Health Care Subsidies[W:700]

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithros View Post
    I don't know about liberals and conservatives, but people who know how economics work understand that GDP = private sector spending + government spending - trade deficit. They also understand that a recession is defined as two consecutive reductions in GDP. Federal spending is 20% of GDP, State Spending is 9% and local government is 10%.

    That means the government as a whole directly accounts for 40% of the US GDP. Indirectly it's considerably higher. When you consider that the Federal Highway system, the initial internet infrastructure, and almost all of the basic research behind things like computer chips were all government programs, it's easy to see that effective government is single most effective economic driver.
    Ok, and we have taxes that fund those things, not INCOME TAXES. The unified budget has been indoctrinated into the minds of liberals who buy the rhetoric that all dollars are the same. There is quite a difference between local, federal, and state spending as a percentage of GDP and the movement more towards a European economic model. Greece hasn't had any affect on the liberal thought process or the Paul Krugman ideology.

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    Re: Supreme Court Upholds Obama Health Care Subsidies[W:700]

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    You people can cheerlead each other while ignoring context and poor economic policies. Are you telling me that the high inflation on top of the 81-82 recession didn't affect the value of your dollar? How did this recession affect you and your family? ...
    We are fortunate , and this last recession did not effect us personally.
    Our stocks did go down but since we just let them ride the recession out they have recovered and are doing better than they were before the great recession hit.
    Last edited by minnie616; 07-06-15 at 09:53 AM.

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    Re: Supreme Court Upholds Obama Health Care Subsidies[W:700]

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Yep

    Bankers: Take your TARP money back - Mar. 27, 2009

    Get it yet? Light bulb go off yet? Ready to admit you are wrong yet? Ready to admit that Obama and liberal elites have lied to you yet?
    OK, here's an article from Bloomberg. The Fed doled out $7,700 billion. TARP was only 700 billion. So Fed loans to the same banks who didn't need any bailout were TEN TIMES the TARP money. As I said, they didn't need TARP funds when Uncle Fed was willing to and did extend them all the short term capital they needed, backed by toilet paper.

    The six biggest U.S. banks, which received $160 billion of TARP funds, borrowed as much as $460 billion from the Fed
    ....
    Bank of America and New York-based Citigroup each received $45 billion from TARP. At the time, both were tapping the Fed. Citigroup hit its peak borrowing of $99.5 billion in January 2009, while Bank of America topped out in February 2009 at $91.4 billion.
    What's hilarious is you mention Bank of America. At their peak, BoA borrowed $280 billion from just one program, the TAF - by far the number one borrower. Go look at the GAO report, Table 30. It's linked in this article from Forbes. Golden boy Jamie Dimon's firm (JPM) only borrowed $100 BILLION from that Fed program. More from others.

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    Re: Supreme Court Upholds Obama Health Care Subsidies[W:700]

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    OK, here's an article from Bloomberg. The Fed doled out $7,700 billion. TARP was only 700 billion. So Fed loans to the same banks who didn't need any bailout were TEN TIMES the TARP money. As I said, they didn't need TARP funds when Uncle Fed was willing to and did extend them all the short term capital they needed, backed by toilet paper.



    What's hilarious is you mention Bank of America. At their peak, BoA borrowed $280 billion from just one program, the TAF - by far the number one borrower. Go look at the GAO report, Table 30. It's linked in this article from Forbes. Golden boy Jamie Dimon's firm (JPM) only borrowed $100 BILLION from that Fed program. More from others.
    What you failed to recognize or acknowledge is the reality that some banks were forced into taking TARP meaning that the financial crisis wasn't nationwide or all banks suffering the same way. Keep believing what you are told and ignoring reality.

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    Re: Supreme Court Upholds Obama Health Care Subsidies[W:700]

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    I find that people like you have such passion for ignorance. When someone claims it was the worst recession in history and I respond with information proving that 81-82 was worse because it affected more people that isn't derailing the thread that is responding to someone who already did that.
    You 'proved' it?

    LOL. You threw out one number. I dont recall anyone thinking the economy was going to completely crash, like we did in 2008, and I dont recall anyone in 1983 talking about how horrible the economy was. This crash was both deeper and longer, and was not self imposed deliberately, like the 81 one was. Kind of a big difference.

    But congratulations, you derailed us from the main topic, which was showing how clownish all your responses to this health care thread have been.
    Many Trump supporters have lots of problems, and those deplorables are bringing those problems to us. They’re racists. They’re misogynists. They’re islamophobic. They're xenophobes and homophobes. And some, I assume, are good people.

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