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Thread: White House to okay negotiating with terror groups holding U.S. hostages

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    Re: White House to okay negotiating with terror groups holding U.S. hostages

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Your reference to Canada here is unclear. Canada did help free Americans from the Iranian Embassy but there was no money involved. Canada to the Rescue | TIME.com

    Robert Fowler
    Robert Fowler, Canadian diplomat, was freed on $1M, al-Qaeda reveals | National Post
    An al-Qaeda letter obtained by The Associated Press suggests about $1-million was paid for the release of Canadian diplomat Robert Fowler in Niger four years ago.

    Fowler, the highest-ranking UN official in Niger, and his colleague Louis Guay, were kidnapped and held for four months before being released in April 2009.
    Ransom paid for Canadian diplomats, leaked cable suggests - The Globe and Mail
    The Globe and Mail's Geoffrey York later reported that several AQIM prisoners had been released from African prisons as part of the deal and that "several million dollars in cash was given to the kidnappers."

    Mr. Harper had told reporters that "the government of Canada does not pay ransom or money." Then he added that "what efforts or initiatives may have been undertaken by other governments are questions you'll have to put to those governments."
    If my post offends you, I deeply Apple-O-Jize.

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    Re: White House to okay negotiating with terror groups holding U.S. hostages

    "The Associated Press report does not indicate who paid the ransom for Fowler and Guay".There is no evidence here either.
    I know we tend to mistrust our governments these days and ransoms may well have been paid. But I'm also very reluctant to trust terrorist groups, or any Mid East agencies.

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    Re: White House to okay negotiating with terror groups holding U.S. hostages

    Quote Originally Posted by JANFU View Post
    So the issue is some countries do pay ransom it may be thru the host Govt paying and favor for favor changes hands. To the Italian and others that also pay.
    To Canada who used the first example to free one of our Diplomats.
    Then the US traded the GITMO 5 for the US Soldier.

    Paying is not the big problem, it is people in areas where most should not be.
    Well obviously we should try to prevent hostage situations in the first place, but the entire point of this discussion is what to do when they occur.
    Social democrat is no longer an accurate description of my views.

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    Re: White House to okay negotiating with terror groups holding U.S. hostages

    Quote Originally Posted by Anomalism View Post
    Thoughts?

    Obama to okay negotiating with terrorists over hostages - CNNPolitics.com

    The White House will release on Wednesday a presidential directive and an executive order that will allow the government to communicate and negotiate with terrorist groups holding Americans hostage, a source briefed on the matter told CNN. While the government will maintain its policy of not making "substantive concessions" to captors or paying ransoms, the White House will announce that officials will no longer threaten with criminal prosecution the families of American hostages who do pay ransoms to their relatives' captors, according to a senior administration official. Family members of former hostages were meeting at the White House on Tuesday to learn of the administration's decisions after a months-long review of U.S. policies in dealing with American citizens held captive. The families were set to meet with President Barack Obama on Wednesday.
    The article should be titled "Obama to okay Americans buying weapons and paying for other people to be taken hostage and killed". Because that is what you are ****ing doing when you pay a ransom to a terrorist.The terrorists are not donating the money to goodwill or to the Red cross/crescent.They re are not building homes with that money for the poor or paying for schools.They are using that money for weapons and to pay other terrorists to go out and kill more people and take hostages.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: White House to okay negotiating with terror groups holding U.S. hostages

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Wait, we'd actually consider sending someone to jail for being desperate enough to pony up money to a terrorist group who has their family member!? Why the flying **** was that the policy before!?
    What do you think terrorists do with that money? Donate it to goodwill? Build homes for the poor? Pay for medical expenses of the poor? Donate to feed the children? Or do you think they are going to use that money to taken more hostages, buy weapons and murder more innocent people and anything else that helps their operations?
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: White House to okay negotiating with terror groups holding U.S. hostages

    Quote Originally Posted by SocialDemocrat View Post
    Well obviously we should try to prevent hostage situations in the first place, but the entire point of this discussion is what to do when they occur.
    They should be jailed and fine.Because when someone paid ransoms to terrorists they bought those terrorists weapons and paid for more members in the terrorists
    army to kidnap and kill more innocent.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: White House to okay negotiating with terror groups holding U.S. hostages

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    "The Associated Press report does not indicate who paid the ransom for Fowler and Guay".There is no evidence here either.
    I know we tend to mistrust our governments these days and ransoms may well have been paid. But I'm also very reluctant to trust terrorist groups, or any Mid East agencies.
    Myself, a deal was made with the local govt paying the ransom.
    If my post offends you, I deeply Apple-O-Jize.

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    Re: White House to okay negotiating with terror groups holding U.S. hostages

    Quote Originally Posted by SocialDemocrat View Post
    Well obviously we should try to prevent hostage situations in the first place, but the entire point of this discussion is what to do when they occur.
    Thank you for clarifying the point of the OP.
    If my post offends you, I deeply Apple-O-Jize.

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    Re: White House to okay negotiating with terror groups holding U.S. hostages

    It's a bad idea. First, if that's the case, they'll focus more on $$$ ransoms than political ones like prisoner releases or conditions.

    Second, the $$$ will be alot more...good luck to the families raising it. And good luck to them actually getting their family members alive. Mexico & South America has a lot of experience with this stuff.

    Third, it's not about money, it's about terrorism and leverage and emotional blackmail and public outrage. Start allowing individuals to minimize this impact and they'll either raise the stakes (as I mentioned) or come up with something else.

    OTOH, this doesnt mean I think people should go to jail however it most certainly does weaken our country's position and in the end, will have even more dangerous downstream effects IMO.
    "Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free."

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    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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    Re: White House to okay negotiating with terror groups holding U.S. hostages

    Quote Originally Posted by SocialDemocrat View Post
    If terrorists find that holding hostages is a successful way to get money, they're going to use their power to take more hostages and get more money because they know that families will give in. As wrong as it feels to prohibit this sort of thing, allowing it to continue encourages terrorism.
    As did the removal of Hussein, Mubarak, Gaddafi and Assad in the first place.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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