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Thread: Marines looking at deploying aboard foreign ships

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    Re: Marines looking at deploying aboard foreign ships

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    One needs to be cautious about using only total expenditures for a number of reasons. First, purchasing power differs. For example, according to official statistics (which may understate military expenditures by Russia and China for obvious regions e.g., to mask support for strategic programs), China's and Russia's military expenditures are just under 50% of U.S. expenditures. However, on a PPP-basis, their spending is about 80% of U.S. spending. Second, allocation of spending also matters. The U.S. spends a higher share of its military budget on salaries and benefits than do either Russia or China. Third, inefficient practices e.g., the military bidding-contracting-delivery process can also reduce the benefits of spending. The Pentagon has had a chronic history of cost-overruns and delays in numerous big-ticket programs (e.g., the F-35). Data concerning such issues in Russia and China aren't public--almost certainly some inefficiencies exist but the extent is unknown. This inefficiency should be a focus of reform, as programs that ultimately produce weapons systems at twice or three times the cost originally set forth in accepted bids are wasteful and they undercut the power impact from military investments.
    That's why I posted actual military capabilities. Anybody who thinks that Russia and China pose a threat to the US in any military capacity is simply out of their mind. Good grief, if we wanted to, we could literally nuke every major Chinese/Russian city overnight, cripple their entirely military infrastructure, and there wouldn't be a damn thing they'd be able to do short of kneeling down and asking for a quick death. It sounds really cocky, but the fact that Russia is telling the West not to fear Russia and China won't do much other than cry at the UN is proof enough.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Marines looking at deploying aboard foreign ships

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    The world is on fire and the Chump in Chief has shrunk the military budget to the point that our own Marines have to hitch rides with the Euros. Terror flourishes, Moscow and Beijing are emboldened-and we are stuck this way for at least the next 13 years thanks to President weaksauce.
    Actually, the Navy has been growing since President Obama took the helm.

    During the George W. Bush administration the Navy fell to it's smallest size since the 19th century.

    Since Obama took office he's slowly been building it back up.

    But you have to understand that the Navy can't just snap its fingers and miracle ships up out of nowhere.

    America's shipbuilding capacity isn't what it once was and building eight or ten amphibious ships, the quantity necessary to meet the demand from the combat commands, is going to take time, especially considering that the Marines aren't the only people in the DOD with a need for ships and has to share the limited capability to lay down hulls with the deep water Navy.

    We also have to look at this from President Bush's perspective, though, and understand that he and the Congresses he was dealing with were fighting active ground wars for most of his presidency and the need to fund those wars was eating up the defense budget (and then some) hand over fist while he was, at the same time, trying to cut taxes (or at least not implement new taxes).

    As much as he might have liked to plan for the future of force projection he had his plate full with the here and now.

    There are a great many things that president Obama has messed up, but this situation with Marine transport ships is not something that can be laid at his feet.
    “Now it is not good for the Christian’s health to hustle the Aryan brown,
    For the Christian riles, and the Aryan smiles and he weareth the Christian down;
    And the end of the fight is a tombstone white with the name of the late deceased,
    And the epitaph drear: “A Fool lies here who tried to hustle the East.”

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    Re: Marines looking at deploying aboard foreign ships

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Military equipment around the world is purchased and sold in their US dollar value; not yens or rubles. Don't just throw out terms thinking you know how to use them in the real world, doc. However, let's say for a second you have some sort of point. Do you think the Russians are getting more for their money now that their currency is worth a 3rd of what it use to be? Think carefully about this one.



    Fine, let's compare actual military power:

    How much stronger is the US military compared with the next strongest power?



    Seriously. Just stop.



    You get what you pay for. China gets sub-par equipment, we get the world's leading technology. Do you honestly think they pose a threat? Get serious, man who saves lives.



    Military recruitment can outgrow actual military spending. It happens all around the world. Hitching a ride with the Europeans isn't the issue you're making it out to be. Get serious.
    Our military advantage is a strategic one we should not give up lightly, shrinking the budget as we have while China and Russia are expanding theirs, and with the world as unstable as it is-is incredibly myopic.

    Much of our budget goes to reseach and development that is being stolen and then altered by both China and Russia-thats nothing new.

    The value of Russias dollar is more relevent to when it spends outside of Russia-it still makes most of its equipment and its got plenty of buyers.

    And you mention carriers-we have so few operating now, that we are going to pull the carrier group that is operating in Iraq (you know-for the war Obama ended) is going to be pulled later this year, which only benefits ISIS.

    This chump in chief is shrinking the military at a very bad time, so bad that our military can't even get where it needs to be.

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    Re: Marines looking at deploying aboard foreign ships

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    Jeez...what's next?

    Deploy some Marines on the Moon in case ISIS gets a foothold there?
    If we ever needed to Russia would have to give us a ride.

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    Re: Marines looking at deploying aboard foreign ships

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    That's why I posted actual military capabilities. Anybody who thinks that Russia and China pose a threat to the US in any military capacity is simply out of their mind. Good grief, if we wanted to, we could literally nuke every major Chinese/Russian city overnight, cripple their entirely military infrastructure, and there wouldn't be a damn thing they'd be able to do short of kneeling down and asking for a quick death. It sounds really cocky, but the fact that Russia is telling the West not to fear Russia and China won't do much other than cry at the UN is proof enough.
    Im actually more concerned about them in proxy wars, not in direct conflict. They could nuke us too, and at least some missles would get through-so we have a defacto MAD deterrence in play.

    But thats besides the point-if our military can't be effectively deployed on its own now, ANY conflict (not even total war) would be more than the military can bear. And Obama did this for his political benefit-to spend the money on his social and wealth redistribution schemes.

    Truly a weak weak president.

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    Re: Marines looking at deploying aboard foreign ships

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    Our military advantage is a strategic one we should not give up lightly, shrinking the budget as we have while China and Russia are expanding theirs, and with the world as unstable as it is-is incredibly myopic.
    This is pretty silly. Budgets shrink when it is needed. Ours, even at levels slightly bellow those of 2010, still surpasses that of any other nation. The same with our military equipment. Hell, we could decommission half of our military equipment and we'd still have more than enough to overcome those of their militaries. What's your next non-point?

    Much of our budget goes to reseach and development that is being stolen and then altered by both China and Russia-thats nothing new.

    The value of Russias dollar is more relevent to when it spends outside of Russia-it still makes most of its equipment and its got plenty of buyers.

    And you mention carriers-we have so few operating now, that we are going to pull the carrier group that is operating in Iraq (you know-for the war Obama ended) is going to be pulled later this year, which only benefits ISIS.

    This chump in chief is shrinking the military at a very bad time, so bad that our military can't even get where it needs to be.
    All of that diatribe because you're still in denial. I specifically pointed to our actual military capabilities which vastly surpass those of any other supposed threat around the world. I specifically posted the words of people who have served in the armed forces unlike you or I. I specifically highlighted the resources at our disposal. Yet here you are, still going"Nuh-uh! Them's emboldened!"
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Marines looking at deploying aboard foreign ships

    More of US Conservative's horse**** propaganda. Nothing to see here.
    Freedom of speech is not freedom from criticism.

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    Re: Marines looking at deploying aboard foreign ships

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    This is pretty silly. Budgets shrink when it is needed. Ours, even at levels slightly bellow those of 2010, still surpasses that of any other nation. The same with our military equipment. Hell, we could decommission half of our military equipment and we'd still have more than enough to overcome those of their militaries. What's your next non-point?



    All of that diatribe because you're still in denial. I specifically pointed to our actual military capabilities which vastly surpass those of any other supposed threat around the world. I specifically posted the words of people who have served in the armed forces unlike you or I. I specifically highlighted the resources at our disposal. Yet here you are, still going"Nuh-uh! Them's emboldened!"
    "And it's all Obama fault!"

    It must be so fulfilling to do nothing during one's breaks from "saving lives" other than regurgitate this dishonest crap onto the forum all day.
    Freedom of speech is not freedom from criticism.

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    Re: Marines looking at deploying aboard foreign ships

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    Im actually more concerned about them in proxy wars, not in direct conflict.They could nuke us too, and at least some missles would get through-so we have a defacto MAD deterrence in play.

    But thats besides the point-if our military can't be effectively deployed on its own now, ANY conflict (not even total war) would be more than the military can bear. And Obama did this for his political benefit-to spend the money on his social and wealth redistribution schemes.

    Truly a weak weak president.
    Our military can be effectively deployed. Ship building capabilities haven't caught up to the actual number of people in the military. This was already explained to you by a poster who has served. Do you have any other non-points?
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Marines looking at deploying aboard foreign ships

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    That's why I posted actual military capabilities. Anybody who thinks that Russia and China pose a threat to the US in any military capacity is simply out of their mind. Good grief, if we wanted to, we could literally nuke every major Chinese/Russian city overnight, cripple their entirely military infrastructure, and there wouldn't be a damn thing they'd be able to do short of kneeling down and asking for a quick death. It sounds really cocky, but the fact that Russia is telling the West not to fear Russia and China won't do much other than cry at the UN is proof enough.
    Right how, the U.S. remains the world's foremost power. However, it is important to be able to wage and win more limited conflicts than existential ones. Otherwise, its interests and allies will be in a weakened position, as it is unlikely that the U.S. would threaten the destruction of another country or countries, much less carry it out, if only its own vital or critical interests were not at stake.

    That the number of U.S. combat troops has been decreasing and that the U.S. was not able to secure conclusive outcomes in either Afghanistan or Iraq (regardless of what one things of the decisions to go to war) suggests that the U.S. has areas where it needs to improve.

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