View Poll Results: Should the flag be moved-removed from all State Buildings?

Voters
70. You may not vote on this poll
  • Moved

    5 7.14%
  • Removed

    46 65.71%
  • Stay where it is

    15 21.43%
  • Not sure

    4 5.71%
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Thread: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

  1. #291
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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    I did something very unusual for me, NIMBY...I liked a post from you.

    But I just want you to be aware that, while I basically agree with your post...especially your last sentence...I am still aware that, even though that last sentence is aimed at both sides of the political spectrum, you took a shot at the right in your first sentence and somehow neglected to take a similar shot at the left.
    I've gotten more even-handed with my bashing of each side lately, but acknowledge your last statement.
    I simply don't see the same even-handed posting from the far-right GOP conservatives on this board.
    When I do bash my own side, and there's plenty to bash, GOPs just move the goal posts.

    When I see cons use inner-city crime as a reason not to have gun control, I present a plan.
    It's called "targeted martial law" in which "rights" of criminals are suspended to go in and sweep high-crime areas with zero advance notice.
    I would use roving bands of Special Forces drawn from any number of police units--National Guards, State Police, City Police, US Soldiers.
    This is how a mod/con DEM thinks when he's pissed off--I could give a **** about the Bill of Rights under the extraordinary crime conditions we have.

    Obama should never have said the "******" word in a public interview.
    He should have said the "n-word".
    He changed the focus to him as the messenger and created more division.
    Obama and Clinton should have waited to bring up guns--knowing full well the discussion would get divisive right away.
    Saying that nothing would get done in DC on guns is true--but they should have waited until well after the burials.

    My #1 concern remains the divisiveness WITHIN the GOP in DC which continues to grind just about all legislation to a halt.
    I just saw where Rep. Meadows was stripped of his co-chair gavel, which has the Freedom Caucus up in arms.
    Also, the conservative Club for Growth is running ads against their own GOPs who support the Ex-Im bank.
    I could list another dozen examples of GOP division and indecisiveness preventing them from governing as you know.
    This is why it's difficult for me to be even-handed with my criticism of both sides .
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  2. #292
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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    Of course the history of the flag is relevant. And it wasn't some vague "some" who used it as a racist symbol - this was the elected officials of the State of S.C. who rose that flag over their capitol in defiance of the Feds pushing for civil rights for blacks.
    I'm not totally up on the history of that flag in respect to SC, but it seems to me that the elected officials in SC dealt with the pressure from the Feds around 20 years ago. Since then, it hasn't been an issue and still isn't as far as the Feds are concerned.

    That kind of makes the point of your post moot...don't you agree?
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  3. #293
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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Most in the south didnt fight the war to defend slavery. They fought the war top reject dominance of the north. Right, wrong, or indifferent most of their motives then are no different than the states today that insist on their independence and autonomy from an oppressive federal government.
    The state's rights/tenth amendment caused the civil war.
    Today, it is just a flimsy excuse for GOPs to rail on the fed and now hide behind Gov. Haley's skirt.

    To them, their cause was as noble and justified as the patriot 'traitors' that rebelled against the crown.
    Since you've spoken about dominance from the North,
    don't you find it odd that the "North" began the rebellion against the crown while the South was quite close to the crown,
    from the American Revolution all the way through the civil war?

    And California certainly has a fairly strong tradition of oppression of Asian people. Is that their lasting legacy?
    Shall we judge all Californians on their racism and oppression?
    I think it's high time that each state does have a "discussion" on their racist and oppressive past as part of their State History class .
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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    I've gotten more even-handed with my bashing of each side lately, but acknowledge your last statement.
    I simply don't see the same even-handed posting from the far-right GOP conservatives on this board.
    When I do bash my own side, and there's plenty to bash, GOPs just move the goal posts.

    When I see cons use inner-city crime as a reason not to have gun control, I present a plan.
    It's called "targeted martial law" in which "rights" of criminals are suspended to go in and sweep high-crime areas with zero advance notice.
    I would use roving bands of Special Forces drawn from any number of police units--National Guards, State Police, City Police, US Soldiers.
    This is how a mod/con DEM thinks when he's pissed off--I could give a **** about the Bill of Rights under the extraordinary crime conditions we have.

    Obama should never have said the "******" word in a public interview.
    He should have said the "n-word".
    He changed the focus to him as the messenger and created more division.
    Obama and Clinton should have waited to bring up guns--knowing full well the discussion would get divisive right away.
    Saying that nothing would get done in DC on guns is true--but they should have waited until well after the burials.

    My #1 concern remains the divisiveness WITHIN the GOP in DC which continues to grind just about all legislation to a halt.
    I just saw where Rep. Meadows was stripped of his co-chair gavel, which has the Freedom Caucus up in arms.
    Also, the conservative Club for Growth is running ads against their own GOPs who support the Ex-Im bank.
    I could list another dozen examples of GOP division and indecisiveness preventing them from governing as you know.
    This is why it's difficult for me to be even-handed with my criticism of both sides .
    I liked this post, too, because of your acknowledgement and it actually is pretty even-handed.

    But that's not to say I agree with everything you've posted. (where would be the fun in that, LOL!!)

    Your solution for inner-city crime would never happen...mostly because liberals would object.

    I disagree with your last paragraph...the one about GOP inner-divisiveness. That kind of thing generally gets worked out within the Party. But I have to say that the biggest factor preventing the GOP from governing is opposition from Democrats, in general, and Obama, in particular. If either of them made an effort to work with the GOP, they would be more successful. Of course, that works both ways. Opposition from the GOP has certainly prevented the Democrats from getting their way as well. So it goes in politics.
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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorgasm View Post
    I believe it is a 2/3rds majority. My question is what is the penalty for breaking the law?
    I'm not sure. I would have to believe however that violations of the law are grounds for impeachment and likely go against the oath of office. Contrary to what seems to have become the standard mindset of many in America, Executive Branch officers are not Kings that simply can disregard and break the law because they feel like it.

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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    The state's rights/tenth amendment caused the civil war.
    Today, it is just a flimsy excuse for GOPs to rail on the fed and now hide behind Gov. Haley's skirt.



    Since you've spoken about dominance from the North,
    don't you find it odd that the "North" began the rebellion against the crown while the South was quite close to the crown,
    from the American Revolution all the way through the civil war?



    I think it's high time that each state does have a "discussion" on their racist and oppressive past as part of their State History class .
    I dont find the link between the south and the crown all that surprising in 1776. It was the greatest concentration of british influence, there was a greater interdependence on textiles and trade...fiscal realities. Not surprising based on the facts of the day. I also dont find the race riots that occurred in the northern cities from 1900-1930 all that surprising. Its just part of history.

    And I think its fine to have discussions on race and racism as historical realities. Great opportunities to learn. Sadly...some ****head will seize on the opportunity to try to capitalize today on the fact that in 1850, Asians in California were treated as slaves, not allowed to associate with non-Asians, couldnt marry, couldnt own proeprty, etc. Modern California doesnt own the actions of historical California. But you know...next thing you know people will be demanding the flag of California be changed...

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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    This makes me very pleased. I think finally, and I mean finally, the history of the Confederate Flag on public property is coming to an end. The next thing to do is for the President to stop sending memorial bouquets to the Confederate war memorial at Arlington. That will happen in time. Probably within the next 2-3 administrations.

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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    This makes me very pleased. I think finally, and I mean finally, the history of the Confederate Flag on public property is coming to an end. The next thing to do is for the President to stop sending memorial bouquets to the Confederate war memorial at Arlington. That will happen in time. Probably within the next 2-3 administrations.
    We should also ignore our WWII dead in the cemeteries of Europe considering how many innocent civilians we kill over there.
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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    We should also ignore our WWII dead in the cemeteries of Europe considering how many innocent civilians we kill over there.
    Nope! =D

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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    No State can refuse or Government in general can refuse the right of the people to fly a flag on public grounds.
    I don't think you understand what I mean by removal of the flag from public land. I'm arguing for an end to state sponsorship of the flag. If some idiot wants to go on public land and wave a confederate flag, that is within their rights. If the government is obligated to sponsor the confederate flag because some citizens believe they should, that means they are obligated to fly any and all flags that any citizen wants recognized by the government, which is clearly not the case.

    Must be nice living in the 21st century before Karl Marx.


    They fought for their own reasons, doesn't mean they have to agree with the State reasoning. Just like today in current wars.
    Their private motivation doesn't earn them the right to government recognition via being named after streets/military bases etc. They fought to preserve slavery, and that should disqualify them from being honored by the government.
    Social democrat is no longer an accurate description of my views.

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