View Poll Results: Should the flag be moved-removed from all State Buildings?

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  • Moved

    5 7.14%
  • Removed

    46 65.71%
  • Stay where it is

    15 21.43%
  • Not sure

    4 5.71%
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Thread: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

  1. #241
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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Black Dog View Post
    Morning MMC. Good, progress is always a good thing!
    Well.....not always. .....

    Yes this progress will be done and over with before the election really jumps off. Then the Demos and their brethren will have to fallback on the War with the Rich.

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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by HowardBThiname View Post
    Even if your claim is accurate, and you have not yet supported it with actual historical evidence, can't you understand that you are feeding the flames of racism by judging a symbol by its least common denominator? Let's just say you're correct and that some powerful white leaders were making a statement. If so - they are still among the few who feel/felt that way.
    Sure I have - that flag was raised in 1961, and it's not a coincidence that the raising of a Confederate battle flag occurred during a bitter battle over civil rights for blacks. You have to be willfully ignorant to conclude that the events are mere coincidences, and especially given the fact that the same flag was adopted by other states and by white racists opposing civil rights and fighting to maintain white supremacy. Those events are all related, part of the history of that flag.

    The alternative explanation is the flag was raised to honor the Southern heritage or some such nonsense, and that might fly if the Confederate battle flag was raised to commemorate some event and then removed after a week, a month, even a year, but it stayed for DECADES, an historical artifact, flying over the State's Capitol.

    And we have to assume that the white leaders who raised that flag had the support of 'the [white] people' in those states, because they elected white leaders who defended white supremacy and Jim Crow for DECADES. You're asking me to believe that gutless politicians who have always pandered to voters were somehow acting contrary to the will of the majority of their constituents, and there is simply NO evidence that is the case.

    Right now, you are playing into the hands of racists everywhere. And, in doing so, you're creating a false story. You're not acknowledging anything I've told you about what that flag means to descendants of the soldiers in the Civil War, white or black. You're not acknowledging how the flag has come to represent survival and the rebuilding of the South.
    I can acknowledge what that flag might mean to some people all day long and it won't change the fact that it was a mostly obscure flag until the civil rights battles started, and that the leaders of the movement against civil rights for their black residents raised that flag as their symbol of protest. That some might honor their dead relatives with it doesn't change that in 2015 that flag has been adopted as a symbol for white supremacists, same as it was the symbol for white supremacists occupying the highest state offices in the 1950s and 1960s.

    Think of this - consider the swastika, since we've been talking about it. What if, instead of shunning it - the Native Americans took back their ancient symbol of well being and friendship and printed it on everything they could. Eventually, the sight of the symbol would come to mean just that - and Hitler's bastardization of the it would fade. But, that didn't happen. Instead, out of a misdirected desire to put Hitler in his place, we've elevated the symbol to one of only hate and in doing so - every neo-nazi and antisemitic group has adopted it.
    OK, accepting your premise, then as this transformation of the symbol takes place, would you suggest that white, blue eyed, blonde Germans raise the flag and then ask Jewish residents to accept that when THEY raise the flag on the State Capitol, it means peace? Come one. Those Jewish residents would have known friends or family members slaughtered, millions of them in total, under that banner. No one with the slightest respect for Jews and the pain of that recent history would fly that flag and expect them to understand that it no longer means hate and a desire to wipe them off the face of the earth, but peace and love.

    And remember that you'd be asking Jews to ignore that white, blue eyed blonde Germans raised that Nazi banner in 1961 while fighting to keep Jews as second class citizens BY LAW, prohibited from attending state colleges, segregated in inferior schools, unable to eat in the same restaurants as Christians, or sit in the same movie seats, Jews only allowed in the back rows of buses, and unable to vote and exercise their rights as Americans, etc. and kept that Nazi banner on the state house continually for another 37 years and only removed it under protest from the Jewish community.

    Seriously, I can't believe you believe your own rhetoric. Please, put yourself in the shoes of Jews and ask yourself if you'd buy that nonsense....

    As I said - you're going to win this one.

    But, once again, we will have lost much.
    What will we have lost? A symbol of a racist past? Good riddance.

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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Good. The less open celebration of treason in our government, the better.
    So, when do we call for the public removal of Hillary?

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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    This is inane.

    Every flag has been abused. The Confederate battle flag does not represent a racist history...it represents history. Were some in the south racist? Of course. Do you think that people from the north need the Confederate Battle Flag to be racist? Of course not. Do people insist on banning the US flag because we have, under that flag, had some dark days in our own history? Do some people usurp the US flag and use it to further their own causes, including but not limited to, racist acts? You bet. What about the mejican flag? Does it represent periods of state sponsored racism? Do people use it as a symbol of racist acts? Is it shocking to know that some American Indian tribes use their own flags and banners as a symbol of racism, often using their 'pride' as a cause for discriminating against mixed race Indians?

    Want to give a symbol real power? Drive it underground.

    IF the people of South Carolina decide that it is time to retire the flag from the flagpole, let it be because it is their choice...not because of some projected hatred and shaming. Not every southerner is racist. Not even a majority of southerners are racist. Many take pride in their ancestry and heritage...a heritage that for MOST of them had nothing to do with slavery and racism.

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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by HowardBThiname View Post
    They should.
    We should care when we're discussing the causes of WWII or the history of the Third Reich?

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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    So, when do we call for the public removal of Hillary?
    As soon as the tanker arrives with the Compound W.

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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    This is inane.

    Every flag has been abused. The Confederate battle flag does not represent a racist history...it represents history. Were some in the south racist? Of course. Do you think that people from the north need the Confederate Battle Flag to be racist? Of course not. Do people insist on banning the US flag because we have, under that flag, had some dark days in our own history? Do some people usurp the US flag and use it to further their own causes, including but not limited to, racist acts? You bet. What about the mejican flag? Does it represent periods of state sponsored racism? Do people use it as a symbol of racist acts? Is it shocking to know that some American Indian tribes use their own flags and banners as a symbol of racism, often using their 'pride' as a cause for discriminating against mixed race Indians?

    Want to give a symbol real power? Drive it underground.

    IF the people of South Carolina decide that it is time to retire the flag from the flagpole, let it be because it is their choice...not because of some projected hatred and shaming. Not every southerner is racist. Not even a majority of southerners are racist. Many take pride in their ancestry and heritage...a heritage that for MOST of them had nothing to do with slavery and racism.
    It represents treason. Everyone flying it was a traitor. Literally by definition.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Well, certainly the customer is not an N-word.
    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    You know her?

  8. #248
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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    We continue to see leading GOP contenders for POTUS hide behind state's rights on the Confederate flag.

    What is not being addressed by everyone is the battle between state's rights and a strong central government.
    The overriding issue of our Nation since it was first formed--the tenth/civil war amendment.

    What I do see is Roof succeeding in his attempt to divide America--as evidenced on this board with the nonsensical back-and-forth posting .
    I did something very unusual for me, NIMBY...I liked a post from you.

    But I just want you to be aware that, while I basically agree with your post...especially your last sentence...I am still aware that, even though that last sentence is aimed at both sides of the political spectrum, you took a shot at the right in your first sentence and somehow neglected to take a similar shot at the left.
    TANSTAAFL

    “Certain types of loudmouthism should be a capital offense among decent people.” ― Robert A. Heinlein, The Moon is a Harsh Mistress

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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by JANFU View Post
    Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds | MSNBC

    Agree with the Governor
    Disagree with the Governor
    Not sure
    Taking down the confederate flag there requires nothing more than scissors, or a match.

    What's pathetic is the state officials formally debating over a childishly simple task that takes 10 min.

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    Re: Gov. Haley to call for removal of Confederate flag from Capitol grounds [W:154]

    Quote Originally Posted by humbolt View Post
    As soon as the tanker arrives with the Compound W.
    Mornin HB. White Out won't work, huh?

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