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Thread: NRA executive suggests slain Charleston pastor to blame for gun deaths

  1. #301
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    Re: NRA executive suggests slain Charleston pastor to blame for gun deaths

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    excellent

    what is pathetic is the sentiments of several posters who just assumed that churches are somehow different or that parishioners who carry other places are "psychopaths" to carry in a church or that someone else carrying in a church "diminishes" their worship experience". or finally that God will somehow make a church immune to criminal attack
    To each his own on that subject, Jesus himself advocated arming oneself for defense should the situation warrant it so I wouldn't say that it is a sin per se to carry a defensive weapon into a church. I personally don't feel comfortable bringing a weapon into a church at this point in time because IMO preparing for even defensive violence goes against the message of love and peace, however, it is something I will concede is not the safest tactical position to hold, then again I have always been a bit of a risk taker.

    I detest real violence, especially that violence which results in victimizing others(force superior to the intended target's level to defend). While I love competitive violence like the fighting sports and even sparring with buddies, violence with a component of hatred and a will to injure turns my stomach.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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    Re: NRA executive suggests slain Charleston pastor to blame for gun deaths

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    So you own guns and belong to a gun club.

    You do realize that based on this alone many leftists already consider you a "gun nut".
    I have to say, the gun club is a range basically that offers classes. I took the gun safety classes there and felt safe there. Strict rules while down range and professionals who assist and give helpful advice in a very modern facility. It is also a social club, where wives go as well. No one talks about shooting a person in self defense. No red necks, just cops, ex miltary, a fair amount of teachers, etc. I prefer round targets instead of the human outlines. It is sport for me. I want to target compete one day. LOL. I played darts in bars for years, so this is the next step. The tactical courses look kind of fun too, because it uses athletics combined with gun skill. My gun is unloaded while in the house, clip out and empty. It is locked up with my golf clubs because it is a tool of sport. This is not "gun nut" ownership. Gun nuts carry openly in malls, restaurants, churches, and Walmart and brag about what they will do if someone breaks into their house with a big grin on their face.

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    Re: NRA executive suggests slain Charleston pastor to blame for gun deaths

    Quote Originally Posted by Nursmate View Post
    Send them home. Same as you would anyone else if they break the rule of "no weapons permitted".
    It is truly not that simple unfortunately. To send the armed person home without some form of force to put teeth into that request, you are issuing a request with the hope that the person will comply peacefully, 99% of people will honor that request without incident, another .5% will leave with complaint, but that last half a percentage will be the one to look out for. I have said many times, statistics are useless when you run into the outlier.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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    Re: NRA executive suggests slain Charleston pastor to blame for gun deaths

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    oh there are gun owners who don't understand what is going on with the gun ban movement.
    You said, "I don't believe her claim" talked about seminar callers like a good little Limbaugh sheep, then concluded "her comments are not consistent with gun ownership."

    That's discounting the idea that we can have sincere disagreements about gun issues, which is absurd. The NRA was split a few decades ago on the proper emphasis - people dedicated to responsible gun ownership had DEEP divisions about "the gun ban movement" etc.

    And I'm sorry but disagreeing with extremists on gun rights doesn't indicate a lack of understanding. It might indicate disagreement, rationally held.

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    Re: NRA executive suggests slain Charleston pastor to blame for gun deaths

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    To each his own on that subject, Jesus himself advocated arming oneself for defense should the situation warrant it so I wouldn't say that it is a sin per se to carry a defensive weapon into a church. I personally don't feel comfortable bringing a weapon into a church at this point in time because IMO preparing for even defensive violence goes against the message of love and peace, however, it is something I will concede is not the safest tactical position to hold, then again I have always been a bit of a risk taker.

    I detest real violence, especially that violence which results in victimizing others(force superior to the intended target's level to defend). While I love competitive violence like the fighting sports and even sparring with buddies, violence with a component of hatred and a will to injure turns my stomach.
    Biblical link please
    I know the one you are referring to, i suggest Matthew 26:52
    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    The damage to the black community from all this will be devastating.
    Not only on public perception and reputation, but cops simply won't want to police these neighborhoods anymore.
    The shooter was later found to be white.

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    Re: NRA executive suggests slain Charleston pastor to blame for gun deaths

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahlevah View Post
    Cotton might be "insensitive" and a "monster," but he's got a point: Another mass shooting in a "gun free zone."
    NO, NO, NO! This is such a WRONG-HEADED assessment of what led to this horrific act!

    Before continuing, I have to make an admission...

    For a very brief moment, I, yes even I entertained the though of how if only one member in that Bible Study group had a gun he or she could have stopped this massacre in its tracks. But then I caught myself.

    Let me be clear:

    IF PEACE LOVING, HONORABLE MEN/WOMEN CANNOT GO INTO A PLACE OF WORSHIP AND FEAR GOD MORE THAN MAN, THEN WE HAVE A VERY SERIOUS PROBLEM ON OUR HANDS!
    Going as far back as the Vikings, even those Orthodox Catholics whom they pillaged left their weapons outside the church doors. Even cowboys of the old West left their guns at home before going to church. So, IMO, Texas NRA Exec. Cotton is just plain WRONG!

    I get the organization's mantra as espoused by NRA Exec. VP, Wayne LaPierre, "The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun, is a good guy with a gun," but DAMN!!!

    It bears repeating:

    IF PEACE LOVING, HONORABLE MEN/WOMEN CANNOT GO INTO A PLACE OF WORSHIP AND FEAR GOD MORE THAN MAN, THEN WE HAVE A VERY SERIOUS PROBLEM ON OUR HANDS!
    As to Cotton's comment: The only person responsible for this tragedy is Dylann Roof. PERIOD!
    "A fair exchange ain't no robbery." Tupac Shakur w/Digital Underground

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    Re: NRA executive suggests slain Charleston pastor to blame for gun deaths

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    Non-responsive try again. so a guy comes to your church and the metal detector says he has a gun
    and you tell him to go home

    if he does-he was not going to be a problem to start with

    if he is a problem, you are dead and so are many others in the church

    good thinking there
    Seriously, pokes aside... If we use metal detectors as a first line of defense, at least it identifies the person who could be a potential problem. The second step should be security. It a shame, we as a nation would need this..but worth a try. For public safety regulations, mandate security for all public venues where large groups of people gather and high risk targets. We could use our returning military for those jobs. They are trained, highly skilled peace keepers. We train them well on how to treat civilians where they are guests in other countries. I would rather pay for security out of tax dollars and enjoy a day of shopping at the mall...than arrive at the ready and be on the look out for kooks while shopping.. This seems to be the mindset of those who feel the need to carry openly or concealed.

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    Re: NRA executive suggests slain Charleston pastor to blame for gun deaths

    Quote Originally Posted by JANFU View Post
    Biblical link please
    Luke22:36.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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    Re: NRA executive suggests slain Charleston pastor to blame for gun deaths

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    It is truly not that simple unfortunately. To send the armed person home without some form of force to put teeth into that request, you are issuing a request with the hope that the person will comply peacefully, 99% of people will honor that request without incident, another .5% will leave with complaint, but that last half a percentage will be the one to look out for. I have said many times, statistics are useless when you run into the outlier.
    Society will always experience a outlier of behavior, but we can at least try something to deter the 1%....we can't save everyone but we are seeing too much now.

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    Re: NRA executive suggests slain Charleston pastor to blame for gun deaths

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    Luke22:36.
    Luke 22:36 has had a number of interpretations.
    Knowing that you have not read thru the thread as it was posted a day or 2 ago.
    I had edited the original post to include Matthew 26:52
    And that one in my opinion is clearer than Luke 22:36.
    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    The damage to the black community from all this will be devastating.
    Not only on public perception and reputation, but cops simply won't want to police these neighborhoods anymore.
    The shooter was later found to be white.

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