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Thread: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224:1119]

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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    Yes, the SA is quite clear indeed...and the obvious context of the first clause - the preparatory clause which sets the context of the entirety of the Amendment, particularly in view of the political issues and debates of the time over whether we should have an army at all or instead simply rely upon militias - is flatly ignored by the modern gun-rights lobby.

    I really don't want to debate it - not because I can't prove my point to my satisfaction, but because every such debate I've seen devolves into what I can only liken to a religious debate over Biblical texts wherein with rhetorical tap-dancing, one side will obfuscate or flatly ignore the obvious text and the context thereof. Why? Because that side absolutely must at all costs protect its beliefs, its dogma.

    And so it is with the SA - to modern gun-rights enthusiasts, the obvious context of the preparatory clause and the politics of the time in which it was written must be ignored, or at a minimum, twisted in order to protect their beliefs, their dogma. It's a religious debate in form, if not in function.

    And that's why I really do try to stay out of SA debates - they're a waste of time and effort.
    Fair enough. Although in my case the fact of the SA's political role as an impediment to change is more important than any theological consideration. One historical point to consider: since 18th century militia members often provided their own weapons, the first clause adds weight to the second rather than limiting it.
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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by Threegoofs View Post
    Do I need to type slower?

    You can't propose solutions if you can't recognize the problem.
    You aren't proposing any solutions, does that mean you just recognize the problem?
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
    Stephen R. Covey


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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    I am well armed, I take measures against being a victim. what exactly does that comment have to do with this thread? Have you come up with any suggested changes in the law that would have prevented this massacre?
    Good luck getting him to answer that. I have tried and tried and tried.
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
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    Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    You aren't proposing any solutions, does that mean you just recognize the problem?
    Nope.

    But why propose solutions to people who don't see a problem?

    It's like outlining a treatment course of chemotherapy with someone who refuses to accept they have cancer.
    Many Trump supporters have lots of problems, and those deplorables are bringing those problems to us. They’re racists. They’re misogynists. They’re islamophobic. They're xenophobes and homophobes. And some, I assume, are good people.

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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by Threegoofs View Post
    Nope.

    But why propose solutions to people who don't see a problem?

    It's like outlining a treatment course of chemotherapy with someone who refuses to accept they have cancer.
    You are spending a lot of time avoiding the question. And I am asking to better understand your position. Is that not what we should be doing here. You keep posting that we need gun control and quoting the onion. What laws do you believe would have an impact and why?
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by bubbabgone View Post
    The kid appears to be a full-of-hate sociopathic loser.
    But I'll tell you something, I feel seriously humbled by the reaction of those people down there who were personally affected.
    I'm pretty sure I wouldn't feel the way they say they do.
    I saw clips of the 19 year old son of one of the victims, Chris Singleton. He was speaking with his baseball team standing behind him. In addition to be amazingly articulate for a young person, he stressed how he forgave the shooter. He spoke about his mother, and how she loved to pray for him and his sister. If you have a chance, watch it. Tears came to my eyes.

    Chris Singleton Delivers Inspiring Speech After Losing His Mom in Charleston Church Shooting | E! Online

    Here is a young man who was personally impacted by this. He lost his mother in the most horrific way. Yet unlike the internet keyboard warriors, he didn't blame Fox News and the GOP. He didn't call for people to "mobilize". He didn't scream and rant and point fingers at the gun manufacturers. He spoke of love and forgiveness.

    Many people, including many on this board, should shut their mouths and close their fingers, and let someone who this tragedy really impacted speak. This is the way this should be. This young man is a damn inspiration.
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. ~W.C. Fields

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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    You are spending a lot of time avoiding the question. And I am asking to better understand your position. Is that not what we should be doing here. You keep posting that we need gun control and quoting the onion. What laws do you believe would have an impact and why?
    No. You are begging for solutions so you can immediately dismiss them because you clearly can't see a problem.
    Many Trump supporters have lots of problems, and those deplorables are bringing those problems to us. They’re racists. They’re misogynists. They’re islamophobic. They're xenophobes and homophobes. And some, I assume, are good people.

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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by Unaffiliated View Post
    It's simply the basic civilizational principle of the thing.


    You don't need a handgun. Certainly the average Republican who advocates that they need guns who lives in an all-white rural area or suburban area certainly doesn't need a handgun.

    You don't need an automatic-semi weapon. There is zero need for that.

    Hunting rifles are the only logical thing that makes sense. No other legal gun makes any logical sense whatsoever from a civilizational point of measure.
    you really are in no position to tell anyone else what they need. need has nothing to do with constitutional rights. we need firearms to protect our rights BTW

    its a basic civilization sort of thing. armed men are citizens, disarmed people are subjects or often victims.
    Quote Originally Posted by EarlzP View Post
    Why would you not want to register your weapon?
    Quote Originally Posted by Celebrity View Post
    , as long as you can own one or fewer guns, your right to bear a firearm is not being infringed upon.

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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    I saw clips of the 19 year old son of one of the victims, Chris Singleton. He was speaking with his baseball team standing behind him. In addition to be amazingly articulate for a young person, he stressed how he forgave the shooter. He spoke about his mother, and how she loved to pray for him and his sister. If you have a chance, watch it. Tears came to my eyes.

    Chris Singleton Delivers Inspiring Speech After Losing His Mom in Charleston Church Shooting | E! Online

    Here is a young man who was personally impacted by this. He lost his mother in the most horrific way. Yet unlike the internet keyboard warriors, he didn't blame Fox News and the GOP. He didn't call for people to "mobilize". He didn't scream and rant and point fingers at the gun manufacturers. He spoke of love and forgiveness.

    Many people, including many on this board, should shut their mouths and close their fingers, and let someone who this tragedy really impacted speak. This is the way this should be. This young man is a damn inspiration.
    See?

    No problem!

    Just love everyone and forgive them, and wait till it happens again.
    Many Trump supporters have lots of problems, and those deplorables are bringing those problems to us. They’re racists. They’re misogynists. They’re islamophobic. They're xenophobes and homophobes. And some, I assume, are good people.

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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by Threegoofs View Post
    No. You are begging for solutions so you can immediately dismiss them because you clearly can't see a problem.
    there are no problems that can be solved by left-wingers attacking gun owners because they don't like the way many of us vote

    when one's motivations are not honestly stated, a real discussion cannot take place
    Quote Originally Posted by EarlzP View Post
    Why would you not want to register your weapon?
    Quote Originally Posted by Celebrity View Post
    , as long as you can own one or fewer guns, your right to bear a firearm is not being infringed upon.

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