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Thread: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224:1119]

  1. #721
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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    What he says is there is a large racist element of racism, which is a holdover from centuries of state enforced racism that wasn't officially over until after I was born, and that the South is a relative holdout compared to the rest of the country. I don't have any doubt that's true.

    I'm not sure why it's at all controversial to point out that the South is different (i.e. racism is more widespread) than the NE or the Mountain West. It just is, and for reasons that are simple to identify. Anyone born in the South pre-1970 or so had parents (on average) who fought like heck to preserve Jim Crow in this region. That just affects lifetime attitudes for millions living and voting right now.
    If you want to see some really nasty racism, go live in Chicago for a year or two. Martin Luther King even said Chicago was far more racist than any southern state.

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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    I've been talking to lots of people here in SC.
    The people you choose to talk to are not a representative sample of the White population in SC.

    A representative sample means a large random sample of all Whites living in SC.

    And we know what that representative sample thinks by the pols they've elected throughout SC's legislative districts, who apparently have decided that it's still OK to fly the Confederate flag in the statehouse. . .

    Confederate flag flying over South Carolina State House sparks controversy on social media | abc13.com

    And we also know that SC is a state where local police depts. apparently are unofficially allowed to shoot Black people at will, having grown accustomed to doing so, until someone happened to catch one of them on video doing it.

    If you want to prove to us that SC is not racist, then you will have to explain why the prosecutor in the Michael Slager case, Scarlett Wilson, opted for a grand jury indictment of the cop, when it wasn't even legally necessary (look it up if you like)--she could've simply pressed murder charges, causing the case to go straight to trial.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Everyone is appalled and heartbroken. Not one person, not even the scruffiest redneck, has said one word of affirmation of Roof or his actions in my hearing.
    CORRECTION: Decent people are appalled and heartbroken.

    And you can't credibly make statements about what "scruffiest rednecks" believe about this incident unless you've spoken to every one of them in the state about it. Otherwise, you're making a generalization based on a small biased sample.

    Incidentally, I know what it's like to grow up in a racist state. I grew up in the Phoenix, AZ, area, one of the most bigoted anti-immigrant places in the country. Like you, I never knew or spoke to anyone who was representative of that kind of bigotry--I was just never around them. But I certainly never felt an obligation to defend that place simply because I grew up there.

    I also knew better than to believe that what the majority of people think in a community in which I live is a reflection on me. It's not necessary to defend the place where I live or grew up in order to prove that I, personally, am not racist.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    That some people are using this tragedy to push their ignorant and bigoted view of white southerners is sick.
    this tragedy is irrelevant to that fact--there's plenty of other evidence to substantiate SC's racism--see above.

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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    The people you choose to talk to are not a representative sample of the White population in SC.

    A representative sample means a large random sample of all Whites living in SC.

    And we know what that representative sample thinks by the pols they've elected throughout SC's legislative districts, who apparently have decided that it's still OK to fly the Confederate flag in the statehouse. . .

    Confederate flag flying over South Carolina State House sparks controversy on social media | abc13.com

    And we also know that SC is a state where local police depts. apparently are unofficially allowed to shoot Black people at will, having grown accustomed to doing so, until someone happened to catch one of them on video doing it.

    If you want to prove to us that SC is not racist, then you will have to explain why the prosecutor in the Michael Slager case, Scarlett Wilson, opted for a grand jury indictment of the cop, when it wasn't even legally necessary (look it up if you like)--she could've simply pressed murder charges, causing the case to go straight to trial.



    CORRECTION: Decent people are appalled and heartbroken.

    And you can't credibly make statements about what "scruffiest rednecks" believe about this incident unless you've spoken to every one of them in the state about it. Otherwise, you're making a generalization based on a small biased sample.

    Incidentally, I know what it's like to grow up in a racist state. I grew up in the Phoenix, AZ, area, one of the most bigoted anti-immigrant places in the country. Like you, I never knew or spoke to anyone who was representative of that kind of bigotry--I was just never around them. But I certainly never felt an obligation to defend that place simply because I grew up there.

    I also knew better than to believe that what the majority of people think in a community in which I live is a reflection on me. It's not necessary to defend the place where I live or grew up in order to prove that I, personally, am not racist.



    this tragedy is irrelevant to that fact--there's plenty of other evidence to substantiate SC's racism--see above.
    Seriously. You are arguing with someone who lives in SC about what life is like there because of stupid **** you read on the internet. Someone who lives there. You've never been there, just read articles. Do you realize how you sound?
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
    Stephen R. Covey


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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    You mean to tell me that a small GA town of about 1200, many of who's own residents were opposed to this, is proof that SC is the most racist state in the country.
    The poster to whom I was responding was asking about the South, not SC.

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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    Seriously. You are arguing with someone who lives in SC about what life is like there because of stupid **** you read on the internet. Someone who lives there. You've never been there, just read articles. Do you realize how you sound?
    I'm citing evidence based on the large sample of Whites in the state, as opposed to personal experience, which isn't valid (since it's based on a small, isolated, and typically biased sample).

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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    The relevant statistic here is the no. of anti-Black hate groups per capita in SC vs. NY.
    The problem is - the SPLC doesn't track individuals - just organized groups. Per capita, there may be fewer racists in NY, but we can't assume that because they have so many more groups. Given the geographic size of the states and the fact that NY has more than twice as many hate groups, it stands to reason that the chances of running into a member of a hate group is higher in NY.
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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    BBBBZZZZTTTT!!!!! That loud and rather annoying noise is a buzzer telling you that you DID NOT provide the data requested. You stated quite clearly that



    Right now it is immaterial who Blacks voted for or who college educated folks voted for or upperclass whites voted for or three legged green albino's voted for with incomes of more than $85,000 a year. Your statement was not about them. Your claim was about THE VAST MAJORITY OF POOR WHITE PEOPLE IN AMERICA and you claimed the voted REPUBLICAN.

    So lets see the hard evidence on that. I even tried to get you started by providing you with the poverty statistics.

    So lets see it and forget about all the other smoke and mirrors. I have no interest in watching your lovely assistant bend over in the low cut dress while you are switching the other one in the box before you saw it in half. Lets just see what you claimed and the hard evidence for it.

    Or you could admit you simply said something wrong and we can leave it at that.

    And I read your linked story. Not one line in it - not one statistic in it - stated that a majority of poor whites vote Republican. You presented an attempt at evidence which does not even provide one iota of proof for your claim.

    If I am wrong about the content of your linked article - do more than just link to it - quote the relevant part which states that a majority of poor white voters in the USA voted Republican. You cannot because it does not.
    As the old saying goes, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. I gave you an article that clearly indicates that poor white Americans, in the vast majority, vote Republican. Now, if you're going to quibble that not all poor white Americans vote, I won't argue with you. However, the vast majority of poor white Americans who do vote or when they vote, vote Republican, your little dance not withstanding.

    If your only interest is playing little semantic gotcha games, go find one of the many liberal trolls who frequent this site - you'll find kindred spirits, like yourself, who have zero interest in discussing the actual issues.
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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    I'm citing evidence based on the large sample of Whites in the state, as opposed to personal experience, which isn't valid (since it's based on a small, isolated, and typically biased sample).
    He lives there. You read the internet. Think about that, then reply again. However isolated you think he is, he is far more integrated into that society than you are. Reading an article doesn't make you an expert on any local cultures. Living there does. Experience > reading other ignorant opinions of a place. As I said probably 15 pages ago. Go spend time in SC. Meet some people there. Then maybe your opinion will be more than just ignorant drivel.
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
    Stephen R. Covey


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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    Sorry, demographic segregation, which may have historical roots in racism, is not evidence of current institutional racism, since it's not forced,

    as opposed to sanctioned segregation--the case of the prom cited above, which is.
    The case you mentioned is just blatant racism...which the south is guilty of. The highly segregated cities in the north though are definitely due to conscious decisions and institutional reasons.
    So you think it's just chance that in the north and midwest there are parts of cities that are highly concentrated with blacks and it tends to have less access to public services including transportation? Racial zoning laws are based on cities like LA, NY, and Baltimore. Racism is universal in the US just some parts are much more blatant than others.

    The whole "i'm from the north you southern heathens" is like an obese person in a rascal looking at a smoker with disgust. Two people that are making poor decisions for their health just in different ways.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: Police: Multiple Victims in South Carolina church shooting [W:224]

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    He lives there. You read the internet. Think about that, then reply again. However isolated you think he is, he is far more integrated into that society than you are. Reading an article doesn't make you an expert on any local cultures. Living there does. Experience > reading other ignorant opinions of a place. As I said probably 15 pages ago. Go spend time in SC. Meet some people there. Then maybe your opinion will be more than just ignorant drivel.



    Thank you.


    I don't know what "SC" that ... person.. is talking about... but THIS is MY South Carolina...



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