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Thread: 'Accused is guilty': Campus rape tribunals punish without proof, critics say

  1. #31
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    Re: 'Accused is guilty': Campus rape tribunals punish without proof, critics say

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    While I disagree with the standard, I have no issue with a college like Amherst deciding to use this standard to decide the issue as it is a private university.

    I have a more significant issue with a State run school taking action against an individual that results in explusion or suspension for an act that is a criminal issue. Rape is a felony and a crime, and a state school should let what legal action occur rather than exterting a punishment upon the individual coming from a basis that the individual is assumed guilty.
    I couldn't disagree more. How we judge things in private affects how we judge things in public (i.e.: juries, etc.). When we dumb down the process for something important like criminal activity, that becomes our mindset. It is the very rare individual who would be able to fully separate one from the other... though I'm sure we all think that we are that rare individual.

    This is a big part of why I say: You either believe in "innocent until proven guilty", or you don't.
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    Re: 'Accused is guilty': Campus rape tribunals punish without proof, critics say

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    Hmm...



    I wonder if this has anything to do with it.

    Oh, almost forgot....if you're sending your son to college don't bother getting him a box of rubbers. Get him an attorney.
    Attorneys aren't allowed to appear on the males behalf, so that would be a waste of money.

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    Re: 'Accused is guilty': Campus rape tribunals punish without proof, critics say

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    BTW, here's a good rundown of the whole Amherst incident.

    Expelled student sues Amherst College, faulting investigation into 2012 rape case | GazetteNet.com

    Chick screws her roommate's boyfriend, figures this might piss off her roomie and decides to nail the guy's nuts to the wall. Yeah, the guy is a jerk for screwing around on his girlfriend but that doesn't make him a rapist.
    As I understand the story, he was not conscious when it happened, if that is possible.

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    Re: 'Accused is guilty': Campus rape tribunals punish without proof, critics say

    Quote Originally Posted by Samhain View Post
    Raise him to believe unless you have a signed, notarized affidavit, anything you do can come back to bite you?
    I don't think even that would work. The girl can always say she was coerced.

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    Re: 'Accused is guilty': Campus rape tribunals punish without proof, critics say

    Quote Originally Posted by Mason66 View Post
    As I understand the story, he was not conscious when it happened, if that is possible.
    So he's the one that got raped?

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    Re: 'Accused is guilty': Campus rape tribunals punish without proof, critics say

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    So he's the one that got raped?
    That is the story in this case and she reported it more than a year later with no evidence of any kind.

    This guys future was destroyed on her word alone more than a year later.

    She also had sex with another guy that same night.

    There are texts to prove it all, from her.

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    Re: 'Accused is guilty': Campus rape tribunals punish without proof, critics say

    Quote Originally Posted by Mason66 View Post
    That is the story in this case and she reported it more than a year later with no evidence of any kind.

    This guys future was destroyed on her word alone more than a year later.

    She also had sex with another guy that same night.

    There are texts to prove it all, from her.
    But if they had found in his favor, there would have been hell to pay. Protests, calls for action from various victim groups, having to formulate a new plan because of said calls to action, the college president being called before a special committee (or, worse, the local media) to explain why they run a college that is "hostile to women", and so on. You know the routine.
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    Re: 'Accused is guilty': Campus rape tribunals punish without proof, critics say

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    We either believe in "innocent until proven guilty", or we don't.
    Quote Originally Posted by Samhain View Post
    Looks like the majority of reported rapes in college don't have enough evidence to support convictions, let alone indictment.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    So you support this guy getting expelled?
    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    You here to make a point? Well make it. Some of these cases have already proven the male student innocence. You just want someone to go to jail to satisfy your attitude over other poorly prosecuted cases?
    I can see the point kinda went over your heads. My point was the article makes it sound like the beginning is here to start locking people up left and right without convictions or without enough evidence. But thats not true as presented by the data...
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  9. #39
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    Re: 'Accused is guilty': Campus rape tribunals punish without proof, critics say

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    I can see the point kinda went over your heads. My point was the article makes it sound like the beginning is here to start locking people up left and right without convictions or without enough evidence. But thats not true as presented by the data...
    That's not what I got from the article. What I got from the article is that the college's and universities are punishing male students with expulsion without evidence of an actual misconduct/crime happening. Just on the say of the woman. IE: Guilty until proven innocent... and even then still guilty.

    I got your point. Your point is that just because this guy in the OP's article says that he's innocent doesn't mean that he is. And that is true. But without evidence he should be considered innocent. That is the way it is in this country and the way it has been since this country was founded. And we shouldn't follow it just for that though. We should follow that philosophy because otherwise we'll go back to the ages when innocents were thrown into prison or put to death just on the say of someone with power. Claiming something without facts and the truth to back ya up has led to riots before. It's also led to mobs and lynching's. We don't need that in a civilized society.
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    Re: 'Accused is guilty': Campus rape tribunals punish without proof, critics say

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    But if they had found in his favor, there would have been hell to pay. Protests, calls for action from various victim groups, having to formulate a new plan because of said calls to action, the college president being called before a special committee (or, worse, the local media) to explain why they run a college that is "hostile to women", and so on. You know the routine.
    So he was an sacrificial lamb. I don't find that acceptable.

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