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Thread: Obama quest for fast-track trade bill defeated for now in House

  1. #141
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    Re: Obama quest for fast-track trade bill defeated for now in House

    Quote Originally Posted by bubbabgone View Post
    Exactly so.
    And it's not only that.
    I frankly don't trust some of the people on either side of this.

    Another big factor is that on the one hand we're told that the deal has restrictions on Presidential power, yet Barack Obama is a proponent.
    We know that the language in Laws that seem clear to most means very little to Obama.

    Bottom line, like many things it seems we're not getting honest analysis on this deal ... partly because very few people are allowed access to it.
    Never a good sign.
    this is the first i have seen that TPP would limit presidential power
    how so?
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    Quote Originally Posted by Hari Seldon View Post
    No BILLIONAIRE left behind!
    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Why confuse things with facts?

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    Re: Obama quest for fast-track trade bill defeated for now in House

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Pretty stupid to discuss the "merits" of a trade deal that only three legislators have actually looked at.
    The legislation on which the House and Senate voted was made public and available to all members of the House and Senate. The TPP is not yet agreed, so there is no text of the agreement. If an agreement is reached, it should be made public and all Members of the Congress will have the opportunity to examine it.

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    Re: Obama quest for fast-track trade bill defeated for now in House

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    The legislation on which the House and Senate voted was made public and available to all members of the House and Senate. The TPP is not yet agreed, so there is no text of the agreement. If an agreement is reached, it should be made public and all Members of the Congress will have the opportunity to examine it.
    The drafts have been available to them all along. Last I heard, there had actually read them and quite naturally, those three do not support TPP!
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama quest for fast-track trade bill defeated for now in House

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    The drafts have been available to them all along. Last I heard, there had actually read them and quite naturally, those three do not support TPP!
    What you're talking about are incomplete negotiating drafts. There's no agreement, so whatever is finally voted on may differ--and perhaps significantly in some cases--from those working documents. I reserve judgment on TPP until there is an agreement and I've had a chance to read it. If more provisions are favorable than unfavorable, in other words the nation would have a net economic gain, then I'll support it. But right now, it's premature for me to take a stance on something that has not yet been agreed, much less finalized.

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    Re: Obama quest for fast-track trade bill defeated for now in House

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    this is the first i have seen that TPP would limit presidential power
    how so?
    That's part of the distrust I was talking about ...
    On Thursday’s broadcast of Laura Ingraham’s radio show, Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-AL)80%
    , an outspoken opponent of the so-called fast-track Trade Promotion Authority (TPA) being currently being considered by the U.S. House of Representatives, took on his fellow Republican Rep. Paul Ryan (R-WI), who has been speaking out for the passage of the legislation.

    Sessions responded to Ryan’s earlier claim that the TPA would limit President Barack Obama’s ability to negotiate trade agreements, to which Sessions said if that were indeed the case, Obama should considering a veto of the TPA. [8:30 in]
    Sessions: Paul Ryan Claim TPA Limits Obama 'Ridiculous' - Breitbart

    That's what pisses me off ... whotf to believe? ... I'm inclined toward Sessions ... but we need to see the language and the holes therein.
    Better never than late.

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    Re: Obama quest for fast-track trade bill defeated for now in House

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Pretty stupid to discuss the "merits" of a trade deal that only three legislators have actually looked at.
    we aren't talking the merits of that trade deal which is why I said you don't know what you are talking about.

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    Re: Obama quest for fast-track trade bill defeated for now in House

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    What you're talking about are incomplete negotiating drafts. There's no agreement, so whatever is finally voted on may differ--and perhaps significantly in some cases--from those working documents. I reserve judgment on TPP until there is an agreement and I've had a chance to read it. If more provisions are favorable than unfavorable, in other words the nation would have a net economic gain, then I'll support it. But right now, it's premature for me to take a stance on something that has not yet been agreed, much less finalized.
    Oh I'm well aware of the incompleteness, and the fact that there's more material added regularly for the legislators to travel to the basement to read. But typical as it is, only a few have done so, and based upon what they're seeing now, they oppose it.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama quest for fast-track trade bill defeated for now in House

    Quote Originally Posted by ludin View Post
    we aren't talking the merits of that trade deal which is why I said you don't know what you are talking about.
    What is this talking about?


    Originally Posted by ludin
    yea well we shouldn't be losing that much, and the gains that we get should cover those people that lose.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama quest for fast-track trade bill defeated for now in House

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    The drafts have been available to them all along. Last I heard, there had actually read them and quite naturally, those three do not support TPP!
    If others chose not to be informed, that says a lot of about their work as legislators. That the working drafts, not final agreement, have been readily available debunks some of the conspiratorial narratives advanced by some political pundits. Access exists. Many Members of Congress chose not to take advantage of that access.

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    Re: Obama quest for fast-track trade bill defeated for now in House

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    If others chose not to be informed, that says a lot of about their work as legislators. That the working drafts, not final agreement, have been readily available debunks some of the conspiratorial narratives advanced by some political pundits. Access exists. Many Members of Congress chose not to take advantage of that access.
    Have you read what's involved in reading the drafts?
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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