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Thread: Tamir Rice:Judge finds cause for Murder charge over police killing 12 year-old[W:262]

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    Re: Tamir Rice: Judge finds cause for Murder charge over police killing of 12 year-o

    Quote Originally Posted by ludin View Post
    as I posted before bb guns and airsoft guns do not require the orange tip for some reason. i am not sure why that is.
    the only thing that needs an orange tip are actual toy guns.

    however other kids have been shot or almost shot doing that exact same thing off the guns that have them.
    Grandmama said he had the gun BECAUSE it looked real so that he could frighten and intimidate others. Start there. If kids are playing combat or cops and robbers or cowboys and indians or whatever...it doesnt matter if the gun looks real or if he is holding a stick making sounds. If the cops rolled up on a bunch of kids playing and started blasting, we would have a completely different conversation. They didnt and the video tape PROVES this wasnt a bunch of kids playing innocent games of cowboys and indians.

    Blame the kid. Blame grandmama for not taking it. The kid set the stage...not the cops,

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    Re: Tamir Rice: Judge finds cause for Murder charge over police killing of 12 year-o

    Quote Originally Posted by CRUE CAB View Post
    Um, have you not read my other posts on the subject. I don't blame the cops at all in this case.
    The kid made the gun look real.
    Gotcha. Apparently I misread your comment.

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    Re: Tamir Rice: Judge finds cause for Murder charge over police killing of 12 year-o

    Quote Originally Posted by ludin View Post
    he was walking toward them pulling up his shirt and reaching for a gun. they didn't know if it was fake or not.

    the logical thing to do was sit there and not do anything until the police tell him what to do.
    We've already covered most of the ground, but you keep asserting he was reaching for the gun. We don't know that - I've looked at the video and can't see the gun or tell what he was actually reaching for. The police assumed it was the gun, and shot him dead before they could know what he was doing or what his intentions were. We'll just have to disagree.

    Second, if you are black male in a bad neighborhood, of course the better move is to probably put your hands up and slowly lay down on the ground so you can be searched, but we shouldn't have to have passed a course in how to interact with cops and expect 12 year olds to get that right every time or else the cops are free to kill them, and have no repercussions. This isn't a police state.

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    Re: Tamir Rice: Judge finds cause for Murder charge over police killing of 12 year-o

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    It's almost like you don't have anything to argue so you're trying to simply claim that you haven't been caught lying again. Tell us, what kind of "gun" did Tamir Rice have in his possession? Are those "guns" required by federal law to have an orange tip? No. Are they required by state law? No. So how the hell is it illegal to remove the damn tip from one even if it came with it? Stop insulting us, man.
    i never lied in the first place so once again you prove you don't know what you are talking about.
    you just rant away and show you have no idea what you are referring to.

    your inability to go back and understand what is being talked about is 100% on you and you are only insulting yourself by your inane ranting.

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    Re: Tamir Rice: Judge finds cause for Murder charge over police killing of 12 year-o

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    the bailiff might shoot him or in some of the courtrooms I have been in the judge will

    others they might challenge him

    I don't think the kid pointed the gun at the cop and screamed DIE MFs. he didn't have time before he was shot
    In the courtroom scenario, the jury would hit the deck. The crowd would be screaming and would hit the floor or trample one another hitting the exits. Yes, the bailiff or judge might shoot him. Its not because he screamed die mother****er, it would be because he would pull what looks to everyone in that room in the moment (without the benefit of cute pictures of a perpetrator in softened lighting and the benefit of knowledge that it was in fact a toy gun) like a deadly weapon.

    The cops pulled up. The kid jumped up, raised his shirt and reached for what HE had been presenting as a deadly weapon. The cops responded to the threat HE had created. Tragic concurrence? Sure. Murder? GTF out of here with that. The preference of charges is offered to appease a community, not because it is the right thing to do.

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    Re: Tamir Rice: Judge finds cause for Murder charge over police killing of 12 year-o

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    We've already covered most of the ground, but you keep asserting he was reaching for the gun. We don't know that - I've looked at the video and can't see the gun or tell what he was actually reaching for. The police assumed it was the gun, and shot him dead before they could know what he was doing or what his intentions were. We'll just have to disagree.
    say what you want. it doesn't matter. the video clearly shows him lifting up his shirt and reaching for something in the front of his pants. your bias is your bias.

    Second, if you are black male in a bad neighborhood, of course the better move is to probably put your hands up and slowly lay down on the ground so you can be searched, but we shouldn't have to have passed a course in how to interact with cops and expect 12 year olds to get that right every time or else the cops are free to kill them, and have no repercussions. This isn't a police state.
    being black doesn't have anything to do with it and the fact you have to try and pull the race card shows how bad your argument really is.

    no i would expect a 12 year old to know not to take a gun from a house and point it in random direction in a park in a bad neighborhood.
    that is just common sense.

    cops are free to kill people that is a strawman. the cops are allowed to use deadly force if the situation calls for it.
    not knowing what to expect and having the person walking toward you pulling up his shirt and seeing a gun handle is enough to invite deadly force.

    unfortunately the kid got shot.

    however the bigger question is why is in he in a public park pointing guns around in random directions.

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    Re: Tamir Rice: Judge finds cause for Murder charge over police killing of 12 year-o

    Quote Originally Posted by ludin View Post
    i never lied in the first place so once again you prove you don't know what you are talking about.
    you just rant away and show you have no idea what you are referring to. your inability to go back and understand what is being talked about is 100% on you and you are only insulting yourself by your inane ranting.
    Lol, yep tell us again how it's illegal to remove the tip off a gun that has no federal requirement to have it. I'll wait.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Tamir Rice: Judge finds cause for Murder charge over police killing of 12 year-o

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    In the courtroom scenario, the jury would hit the deck. The crowd would be screaming and would hit the floor or trample one another hitting the exits. Yes, the bailiff or judge might shoot him. Its not because he screamed die mother****er, it would be because he would pull what looks to everyone in that room in the moment (without the benefit of cute pictures of a perpetrator in softened lighting and the benefit of knowledge that it was in fact a toy gun) like a deadly weapon.

    The cops pulled up. The kid jumped up, raised his shirt and reached for what HE had been presenting as a deadly weapon. The cops responded to the threat HE had created. Tragic concurrence? Sure. Murder? GTF out of here with that. The preference of charges is offered to appease a community, not because it is the right thing to do.
    never said it was murder. but the cop needs to be convicted.
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    Time for real gun control
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    You too are a gun banner if you want ANY person banned from guns.

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    Re: Tamir Rice: Judge finds cause for Murder charge over police killing of 12 year-o

    Quote Originally Posted by DVSentinel View Post
    Looked to me like he reached into his waistband as they pulled up. He sure as hell didn't raise his hands and keep them away from his body.
    But the gun could have been pink with flowers on it, and the police couldn't have known because he wasn't holding the gun when he was shot. It was still wherever he had it. In his belt or a pocket. We can't see from the video.

    A lot of the "controversy" seems aimed at whether the cops were supposed to know it was a "toy" gun and not a "real" gun. The article says a pellet gun, which is a real gun. The call was about someone waving a gun around, maybe a toy gun. Unless the person who called actually saw/heard it fire, then he, nor the police, could not have told the difference (as I demonstrated) and thus, the police had to treat it as if the kid was armed with a deadly weapon.
    Bottom line is at a minimum it appears the police handled this poorly from start to finish and if it appears on any training video, an example of how to mishandle what should be a routine call. And it cost Rice his life, so we are talking about it. I think people defending the cops here are giving the profession a bad name by trying to defend incompetence and tell us incompetence is in fact an appropriate police response to this situation.

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    Re: Tamir Rice: Judge finds cause for Murder charge over police killing of 12 year-o

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Lol, yep tell us again how it's illegal to remove the tip off a gun that has no federal requirement to have it. I'll wait.
    i don't have to explain to you nothing i said. so you just continue your inane ranting no one is listen and i am not going to respond to you again in this thread
    since you don't have the ability to know what you are talking about.

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