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Thread: Inequality Troubles Americans Across Party Lines, Times/CBS Poll Finds

  1. #111
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    Re: Inequality Troubles Americans Across Party Lines, Times/CBS Poll Finds

    "Inequality" doesn't trouble me in any way, shape, form, or fashion. There's no rational reason for it to trouble anyone.



    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    This country was founded by rebelling against an aristocracy. We have built a new aristocracy, ensuring that the rich are very very rich and stay that way across generations, while poverty is inherited and the lower middle class has little chance to move up. Of course that troubles us. It is antithetical to everything we believe in. Unfortunately, we try to pretend that this problem doesn't exist and many people oppose measures to equal the playing field because they don't want anything holding them down when they become rich.
    This country was founded on by rebelling against an absolute central authority that taxed it relentlessly, on the basis that all men are equal and have unalienable rights to life, liberty, and property.

    You and yours want to build the same thing, only you think it's somehow better when it doesn't involve any kind of a monarch. It isn't.

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    Re: Inequality Troubles Americans Across Party Lines, Times/CBS Poll Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
    Is there an active effort to keep the 99% from becoming a 1%

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    Re: Inequality Troubles Americans Across Party Lines, Times/CBS Poll Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by Baralis View Post
    Because those that are privileged and powerful and have the means to more heavily influence the government put themselves in a protected position from small competitors and heavily skew the competitive field.
    Are you taking corporations? Because there are laws against monopolies. As far as the average person who's just trying to get ahead, the income gap has very little importance. Why should I care how much someone else makes. Unless this is all fueled by jealously.

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    Re: Inequality Troubles Americans Across Party Lines, Times/CBS Poll Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
    TRANSLATION: 'I dismiss your facts and figures because I want to believe what I want to believe.'

    In Sweden most children are born to unmarried women and it doesn't seem to be degrading Sweden.

    The fact is that everyone except for the top 1% have been economically stagnant or lost ground over the last 30 years. That can't be simply explained by accusing the bottom 99% of being lazy.
    Not in Texas. Not in Georgia.

    Not in red states. And not in homes with engaged, married parents.

    The 1 percent bullsh is just that. Bullsh.

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    Re: Inequality Troubles Americans Across Party Lines, Times/CBS Poll Finds

    It's interesting that they support the idea as it is;
    Can you imagine if they were actually correctly informed on the REAL income/wealth disparity?


    Old, but good.

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    Re: Inequality Troubles Americans Across Party Lines, Times/CBS Poll Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by avery45 View Post
    Are you taking corporations? Because there are laws against monopolies. As far as the average person who's just trying to get ahead, the income gap has very little importance. Why should I care how much someone else makes. Unless this is all fueled by jealously.
    I will give you an example of how big business uses their clout to persuade the government to pass laws to stifle competition. I have worked in logistics for over a decade. In the freight brokerage side of things we have about a dozen big players and the rest of the industry is comprised of small businesses many of which only have 1-5 employees and gross revenues of under $500K. Law requires all freight brokerages to carry a $10K surety bond however some of the big dozen are on a campaign to have the law changed to require a $100K surety bond. The larger surety bond has no benefit to these large companies and the only reason they want to have them required is many of the small competitors cannot afford them thus eliminating their competition.

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    Re: Inequality Troubles Americans Across Party Lines, Times/CBS Poll Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    So what if they catch up?
    You don't care about prosperity or American exceptionalism? Do you want your children to be better off than you? Do you care about anything?

    Here is a choice. Take your pick:
    A. Stagnation for the middle class.
    B. Strong growth for the middle class.

    What is your preference?

    When you're talking about taking money from the rich and giving it to the poor....there should be a reason to do so.
    When did I talk about this? What post? Where did I say that I support socialism?

    "Fair" is not a reason...."need" would be.
    My reason is "Better." If we can make America better why not do so? The way income is being distributed is morally wrong and is keeping the middle class from achieving its potential. We can be doing better.

    Americans as a whole can support themselves.
    Sure most of us can, but so can Mexico. Mere survival is easy, actually being the best takes work and fair laws.

    At some point, even the leftest of ideologues need to realize that there is a difference between need and want.
    If "need" is all that is important than there is no need to ensure that we stay a first world country because we can obtain our needs by being a second world country. I want America to have both needs and wants. I want America to be the most technologically advanced, the most prosperous nation in the world with both the most of what we need and want.

    You guys aren't pissed that the poor have it bad....you're pissed that some don't have it bad. If you're taking money from those that have "too much" and giving it to those that have less simply for the sake of doing it....you're (society) committing theft.
    Is this a response to someone else? I never mentioned taking money away from people and giving it to the poor. Taking money away from the successful and using it to fuel a welfare state is a really bad idea and won't help anybody. Just take a look at Europe.

    The American condition is actually better than in most other places in the world. You guys need to put away the torches and pitch forks and try to figure out how to earn your way to the 1% rather than trying to get the govt to give their money to you.
    Again, I don't support the welfare state. I actually support completely scrapping welfare and severely cutting social security.

    So your solution to all this is for everyone to be in the 1%. The problem is that only a limited number of career fields allow people to do this. If everyone tried to be a doctor for example, there would be too many doctors and the demand for every individual doctor would fall. This would greatly reduce earning for doctors and create high unemployment for them making the medical field no longer a route to the 1%.

    If everyone tried to create a small business there would be too many small businesses and the free market would weed out most of them.

    The reality is that there are a limited number of seats for executives, doctors, or small business owners, and there will always be a need for janitors, engineers, nurses, and teachers. It is great to encourage people to try to achieve more but the hard reality is that not everyone is going to be rich. So we should make sure that the middle class and the poor are treated fairly because most Americans are going to fall into these groups no matter what.

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    Re: Inequality Troubles Americans Across Party Lines, Times/CBS Poll Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by JayDubya View Post
    "Inequality" doesn't trouble me in any way, shape, form, or fashion. There's no rational reason for it to trouble anyone.

    This country was founded on by rebelling against an absolute central authority that taxed it relentlessly, on the basis that all men are equal and have unalienable rights to life, liberty, and property.

    You and yours want to build the same thing, only you think it's somehow better when it doesn't involve any kind of a monarch. It isn't.
    Here is something "troubling" about income inequality.

    In 2009 at the worst part of the recession incomes for the average Americans had fallen to $44,000, and incomes for the rich fell to $871,000 per year.

    In 2013 the incomes of the rich had recovered to $968,000. However even during this recovery the incomes for the average American had fallen to $43,900 from the worst part of the recession.

    Everyone lost because of the recession but only the rich gained from the recovery. That is really really troubling.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/28/up...abt=0002&abg=1

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    Re: Inequality Troubles Americans Across Party Lines, Times/CBS Poll Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by avery45 View Post
    Is there an active effort to keep the 99% from becoming a 1%
    Do you think everyone can become rich?

  10. #120
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    Re: Inequality Troubles Americans Across Party Lines, Times/CBS Poll Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by distraff View Post
    You don't care about prosperity or American exceptionalism? Do you want your children to be better off than you? Do you care about anything?
    American prosperity is not achieved through progressive disincentivization. America climbed the ladder to exceptional long before progressive taxation.

    Here is a choice. Take your pick:
    A. Stagnation for the middle class.
    B. Strong growth for the middle class.

    What is your preference?
    How do you propose creating strong growth for the middle class?

    When did I talk about this? What post? Where did I say that I support socialism?
    Then what are you talking about?

    My reason is "Better." If we can make America better why not do so? The way income is being distributed is morally wrong and is keeping the middle class from achieving its potential. We can be doing better.
    How is it "morally" wrong? Those that have made themselves worth more, made themselves irreplaceable or in demand, earn more. How is that morally wrong? What is morally wrong is forcing companies to pay easily replaceable people more than they warrant.

    Sure most of us can, but so can Mexico. Mere survival is easy, actually being the best takes work and fair laws.
    What laws are unfair?

    If "need" is all that is important than there is no need to ensure that we stay a first world country because we can obtain our needs by being a second world country. I want America to have both needs and wants. I want America to be the most technologically advanced, the most prosperous nation in the world with both the most of what we need and want.
    Need is not all that is important, but when establishing a point where the government needs to step in and assist....it should be based on what you need. Not what you want.

    Is this a response to someone else? I never mentioned taking money away from people and giving it to the poor. Taking money away from the successful and using it to fuel a welfare state is a really bad idea and won't help anybody.
    Then what do you propose?

    Just take a look at Europe.
    That was my point.

    Again, I don't support the welfare state. I actually support completely scrapping welfare and severely cutting social security.

    So your solution to all this is for everyone to be in the 1%. The problem is that only a limited number of career fields allow people to do this.
    Untrue. Anyone could do it. Getting into the 1% is more about wealth management than earning potential. However, if if the 1% were limited to a certain few professions....learn and engage in that profession....if you want to be rich. I guarantee you that most that complain about the 1% couldn't handle the stress or workload to get there and stay there.

    If everyone tried to be a doctor for example, there would be too many doctors and the demand for every individual doctor would fall. This would greatly reduce earning for doctors and create high unemployment for them making the medical field no longer a route to the 1%.
    And then a guy realizes there's no one around to fix toilets. He then opens his own plumbing business and makes millions.

    If everyone tried to create a small business there would be too many small businesses and the free market would weed out most of them.
    Then create a different one, a bigger one, a better one...until you get it right.

    The reality is that there are a limited number of seats for executives, doctors, or small business owners, and there will always be a need for janitors, engineers, nurses, and teachers. It is great to encourage people to try to achieve more but the hard reality is that not everyone is going to be rich. So we should make sure that the middle class and the poor are treated fairly because most Americans are going to fall into these groups no matter what.
    And when there becomes a shortage in those fields because they don't pay enough....the wage will rise.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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