Page 8 of 16 FirstFirst ... 678910 ... LastLast
Results 71 to 80 of 155

Thread: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

  1. #71
    Sage
    jmotivator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:29 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    15,326

    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by radioman View Post
    This is the key point.
    We are furnishing what we are really good at--air power.
    That is a huge advantage for the forces fighting IS.
    Let the oppressed Iraqis overthrow their oppressors.....if they really want to.
    We aren't really providing much air power at this point, and we are REALLY good at land war too. Even ISIS knows this. Why do you think they waited until we left?

    But as McCain pointed out last week, we have run something like 160 sorties against ISIS and 75% of the sorties return to base without ever engaging the enemy. So for all the talk about US air power, the reality is we are attempting to do little and accomplishing less.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

  2. #72
    Sage
    jmotivator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:29 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    15,326

    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    And all the dead ISIS guys, also for display purposes?1
    How many ISIS guys have we killed?
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

  3. #73
    Sage
    jmotivator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:29 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    15,326

    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    U.S. Commanders will always have the responsibility of calling targets with the safety of civilians as a priority consideration. By law and morally. If that frustrates pilots, so be it.
    False.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

  4. #74
    Sage
    Montecresto's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Last Seen
    03-13-16 @ 10:59 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    24,561

    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    False.
    True, as witnessed by the sniveling pilots that aren't able to engage every target they see due to the proximity of civilians.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  5. #75
    Pontificator
    iliveonramen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    On a Gravy Train with Biscuit Wheels
    Last Seen
    12-18-15 @ 04:39 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    8,532

    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    Yep. So am I gathering form your argument that you posit the notion that maybe Iraqis enjoy being raped and murdered?
    No, my argument is that the Iraqi people are not begging for the US military to roll back into their country.

    ISIS bans guns in the regions they have conquered and the people are defenseless against the brutal whims of ISIS.
    The country is awash in guns. They may "ban" guns in their territory but there's a lot of territory they don't control. Rooting out weapon cache's is not easy....the idea that ISIS could effectively shut down access to weapons just doesn't strike me as likely.

    It's entirely the same thing. ISIS targets Christians and other non-Muslims first and then moves on to Muslims who to not follow the ISIS brand of Islam. This type of population control through fear is as old as humanity.
    The NAZI party had overwhelming support of their country. It wasn't a party that took over against the wishes of their people. From what you write you don't believe that...you believe that the vast majority of the country disagrees with ISIS control...unless I am getting your position wrong.

    The defense forces of Mosul were ill equipped and the ISIS attack was well planned with coordinated suicide attacks against key defense positions and armories. Mosul also held many sleeper cells who aided in undermining defense attempts in the city.
    It doesn't matter...let's say ISIS conducted this masterful attack on Mosul and Iraqi forces just couldn't hold up. The response is that the overall better equipped and better trained Iraqi army sweeps in and massacres ISIS militants.

    The alternative would be to let Iraq fall to ISIS. The Iraq forces were not prepared to mount an adequate defense across their entire boarder and lacked the intel and logistics that they had relied on the US for. It is entirely accurate to say that the Iraqi army was woefully equipped and corrupt. What I don't get is why that is used as justification for letting the Iraqi people, especially the Iraq minorities, be brutally murdered by ISIS.
    Because after a 10 year occupation and nearly a trillion spent we couldn't create a self sustaining government/military in Iraq? Are we forever committed to stationing armies in Iraq and policing their state? Why are you more concerned with Iraqi minorities than you are people anywhere in the world? Why is it so important that the one nation has US funded and created security at any expense?

    They have toppled an army many times their size and grown on each victory, maybe you should stop parroting Obama's "JV" argument.

    They would be easily dispatched by US forces, but absent US forces the Iraqis are demonstrably unable to cope.
    Because the army they fought was ****! Those soldiers had as much faith and willingness to fight as Iraqi Republican Guard troops had to die for Saddam. It's a paycheck for them. They weren't going to die for the Iraqi parliment or the Iraqi nation. How is it that that the Kurds are kicking ISIS's ass so badly? 5,000 Kurdish fighters just swept across northern Iraq! 5,000!!!! The Iraqi military had 280,000 individuals in their military!

    FOUR DIVISIONS collapsed in northern Iraq battling ISIS with few thousand. That is impossible....that are feats that only the US military could do with the help of US air power and our technology. The Iraqi army is just bad man. They had no will to fight or potentially die for their country. They were just in the uniform for a paycheck.

    What you are missing in this scenario is that the Iraqi army has to defend all cities in Iraq from potential attack. I am not arguing that the Iraqi army is that bad, they obviously are. That is not an excuse for sitting by while ISIS takes over Iraq.
    I agree with you to a certain extent...It's not like I'm completely disagreeing that ISIS is bad news and they do horrible things. I'm just curious how this same scenario doesn't play out again after we take out ISIS and hand over Iraq back to their own government. We would have to do something radically different...like split the country up with a Kurdish north and split Sunni's and Shiit's because nobody in that country seems to have a strong allegiance to the idea of Iraq.

    I'm just worried that any rollback of ISIS will just create a vaccuum taken advantage of by another militant group. As I've pointed out....ISIS isn't special, they don't have capabilities that can't easily be replicated by any other group with a few small arms and some fantatics willing to die by the cause.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

  6. #76
    Sage
    Ikari's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Colorado
    Last Seen
    Today @ 05:17 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Left
    Posts
    52,497

    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    U.S. military pilots carrying out the air war against the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria are voicing growing discontent over what they say are heavy-handed rules of engagement hindering them from striking targets.

    They blame a bureaucracy that does not allow for quick decision-making. One Navy F-18 pilot who has flown missions against ISIS voiced his frustration to Fox News, saying: "There were times I had groups of ISIS fighters in my sights, but couldn't get clearance to engage.”

    He added, “They probably killed innocent people and spread evil because of my inability to kill them. It was frustrating."


    US military pilots complain hands tied in

    Talk about frustrating. The chump in chief puts our forces in harms way and then wont let them kill the enemy. The "JV" team WANTS to die, and I want our military to oblige them.

    Nothing substantive is going to happen until Obama is out of the whitehouse-that dog wont hunt.
    It was like this in Vietnam too, nothing new here. It's what happens when you engage in these world police type actions instead of formal war. Probably another reason not to get involved in BS like this.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  7. #77
    Sage
    jmotivator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:29 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    15,326

    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    True, as witnessed by the sniveling pilots that aren't able to engage every target they see due to the proximity of civilians.
    False. You have several retired Air-force officers arguing that air power is useless with an indecisive command and control and you have an unnamed Pentagon official saying that they are taking so long because they have a lot of political decisions to make. That unnamed source outed themselves as an idiot, though, since their argument was that there were "reliable partners on the ground" to engage the forces. This bull*** is demonstrated by the success of the anti-ISIS campaign so far.

    Needless to say, by dithering on the call to engage the enemy they guaranteed the civilians are dead now.
    Last edited by jmotivator; 06-03-15 at 03:56 PM.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

  8. #78
    Sage
    jmotivator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:29 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    15,326

    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    It was like this in Vietnam too, nothing new here. It's what happens when you engage in these world police type actions instead of formal war. Probably another reason not to get involved in BS like this.
    While I would agree, the problem isn't in getting involved, it is in the commitment to the fight.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

  9. #79
    Sage
    Montecresto's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Last Seen
    03-13-16 @ 10:59 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    24,561

    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    A
    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    False. You have several retired Air-force officers arguing that air power is useless with an indecisive command and control and you have an unnamed Pentagon official saying that they are taking so long because they have a lot of political decisions to make. That unnamed source outed themselves as an idiot, though, since their argument was that there were "reliable partners on the ground" to engage the forces. This bull*** is demonstrated by the success of the anti-ISIS campaign so far.

    Needless to say, by dithering on the call to engage the enemy they guaranteed the civilians are dead now.
    The argument for boots on he ground is a whole other issue. The op is about pilots complaining that they can't engage every time they think they see an Islamic State fighter. That's just how things are going to be.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  10. #80
    Sage
    Ikari's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Colorado
    Last Seen
    Today @ 05:17 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Left
    Posts
    52,497

    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    While I would agree, the problem isn't in getting involved, it is in the commitment to the fight.
    World has rules for these sorts of police engagements. We know that going into it.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

Page 8 of 16 FirstFirst ... 678910 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •