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Thread: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

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    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Oh sorry I didn't realize those were pretend bombs.
    Think of them more like dog and pony show, for display purposes only bombs.

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    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    "Hey guys, here are the burned bodies of the men who an hour ago were raping and beheading you, we regret that some of you were caught in the blast." Easy sell.

    Throughout modern history you can find populations who will readily excuse the collateral damage that happened in the course of their liberation.
    You can also find lots of examples in modern history where the US interceded in a conflict with the best of attentions yet the US was the enemy.

    There are also lots of examples in modern history with a population that is fed up with a group deposes them from power.

    If the Iraqi people hate Isis that much why exactly aren't they killing those guys? Why haven't they thrown those guys out? It's not as if ISIS is some powerful military machine. Why exactly should we swoop again after training the military that threw down their arms and installing the government that was very unpopular and act like this time will be different?
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    You can also find lots of examples in modern history where the US interceded in a conflict with the best of attentions yet the US was the enemy.

    There are also lots of examples in modern history with a population that is fed up with a group deposes them from power.

    If the Iraqi people hate Isis that much why exactly aren't they killing those guys? Why haven't they thrown those guys out? It's not as if ISIS is some powerful military machine. Why exactly should we swoop again after training the military that threw down their arms and installing the government that was very unpopular and act like this time will be different?
    Im sure it will be worse than it is now.

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    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    Im sure it will be worse than it is now.
    It may not be, it may.

    I'll tell you one major difference...we will be spending a lot more money to put a lot more Americans in harms way if we expand it. That's a fact. It will definitely be worse for Americans.

    Also...ISIS popped up after 10 years pretty much as soon as we left. So in your viewpoint that means ISIS is an abnormally strong force that is impossible to replicate? My view is that what was built in Iraq was rotten to the core and it only took a couple of fanatics with AK's to overthrow it.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    It may not be, it may.

    I'll tell you one major difference...we will be spending a lot more money to put a lot more Americans in harms way if we expand it. That's a fact. It will definitely be worse for Americans.

    Also...ISIS popped up after 10 years pretty much as soon as we left. So in your viewpoint that means ISIS is an abnormally strong force that is impossible to replicate? My view is that what was built in Iraq was rotten to the core and it only took a couple of fanatics with AK's to overthrow it.
    Fight to win, or don't fight. Either option is better than what the chump in chief is doing.

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    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    I'm not advocating killing civilians. Civilians are going to die at the hands of ISIS, it is a matter of whether killing ISIS will allow more civilians to live versus letting ISIS run amok.
    If we are to retain anything near credibility, we will always have commanders assessing targets for "collateral damage" and acting appropriately, and the pilots can snivel all they wish. Even then, the numbers of civilians we've killed in the name of protecting civilians is unacceptably high.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    Fight to win, or don't fight. Either option is better than what the chump in chief is doing.
    I agree....actually. Not with the chump in chief part but the idea that you go all in or don't go in at all.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    U.S. military pilots carrying out the air war against the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria are voicing growing discontent over what they say are heavy-handed rules of engagement hindering them from striking targets.

    They blame a bureaucracy that does not allow for quick decision-making. One Navy F-18 pilot who has flown missions against ISIS voiced his frustration to Fox News, saying: "There were times I had groups of ISIS fighters in my sights, but couldn't get clearance to engage.”

    He added, “They probably killed innocent people and spread evil because of my inability to kill them. It was frustrating."


    US military pilots complain hands tied in

    Talk about frustrating. The chump in chief puts our forces in harms way and then wont let them kill the enemy. The "JV" team WANTS to die, and I want our military to oblige them.

    Nothing substantive is going to happen until Obama is out of the whitehouse-that dog wont hunt.
    Put a Democrat in charge of a theater of operations, and this is what you get. Wasn't this the same problem with LBJ and Viet Nam?

    Do. Or do not. There is no try
    . It just baffles them.
    It's a global Jihad, stupid. Allowing that poison into the country is only going to increase the damage it inflicts on others.
    Trump: "When You Open Your Heart To Patriotism, There Is No Room For Prejudice"
    Trump to NYT: “Try reporting accurately & fairly!”

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    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    You can also find lots of examples in modern history where the US interceded in a conflict with the best of attentions yet the US was the enemy.
    And this wouldn't be one of them. Iraq is begging us to get more involved.

    There are also lots of examples in modern history with a population that is fed up with a group deposes them from power.
    Not when the population is unarmed and their opposition is conducting systemic bloody slaughter. The population of Ramadi is no more equipped to deal with ISIS than the German Jews were equipped to deal with Hitler.

    If the Iraqi people hate Isis that much why exactly aren't they killing those guys? Why haven't they thrown those guys out? It's not as if ISIS is some powerful military machine. Why exactly should we swoop again after training the military that threw down their arms and installing the government that was very unpopular and act like this time will be different?
    These guys haven't been thrown out because the Iraqi population is largely unarmed and afraid, the Iraqi soldiers retreat because the military is woefully equipped and corrupt. On the one hand, absent US support in the early days of the invasion the Iraqi government consolidated their army around Baghdad, and left the peripheral troops with insufficient ammunition to hold off a siege. To make matters worse, when equipment was delivered to the outlying towns before the ISIS invasion it had a bad habit of finding its way to the black market.

    The Iraqi military was undisciplined and at this stage fully dependent of US logistics. Absent these logistics the capability of the army quickly deteriorated.

    ISIS has the advantage of being able to consolidate its firepower on individual objectives while the Iraqi force is tasked with protecting everywhere at once. In that kind of war the aggressor will always be on the march and the defender will always be caught off guard.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

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    Re: US military pilots complain hands tied in ‘frustrating’ fight against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    If we are to retain anything near credibility, we will always have commanders assessing targets for "collateral damage" and acting appropriately, and the pilots can snivel all they wish. Even then, the numbers of civilians we've killed in the name of protecting civilians is unacceptably high.
    They may not maintain credibility with YOU, but you aren't the one with a knife to your throat.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

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