Page 8 of 11 FirstFirst ... 678910 ... LastLast
Results 71 to 80 of 103

Thread: Rick Santorum says supreme court's gay marriage decision not 'final word'

  1. #71
    Sage
    VanceMack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:50 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    52,853

    Re: Rick Santorum says supreme court's gay marriage decision not 'final word'

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    It does start out with views from 10 years ago. The majority of these gay marriage bans were enacted 10 years ago when one could still run a campaign on hating gays and it would work. The reality today is much different. States have had time to come up with solutions that aren't affected by recent rulings. They haven't. It's simply not all that profitable to attack the gays anymore. People have kids who are coming out of the closet now and they are being forced to change their views as more people are less and less afraid of being openly gay. This is the world we now live in VM and your continued tacit denial of it just makes it all the more enjoyable. I don't answer hypotheticals based on flawed "what ifs?!"
    Your dogged belief that I cant/wont accept things is comical. But if the hatred makes you feel better...by all means...CLING to it.

    The primary driver that will have changed is that a Judicial Entity will in effect FORCE 37 states (plus Puerto Rico) to act against their will. That MAY cause representatives of those states to seek a Constitutional Amendment to overthrow that decision and that will be their right. Thats how the system works. Will it pass? I think we agree its doubtful. But...does that mean they cant or wont attempt to? Nope.

  2. #72
    Sage

    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Huntsville, AL (USA)
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:05 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    9,510

    Re: Rick Santorum says supreme court's gay marriage decision not 'final word'

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack
    Santorum is of course CORRECT...absolutely. The SCOTUS has a ROLE...but that role is NOT God and Gospel. The SCOTUS interprets law. So if the vast majority of states that have been forced not by their citizens but by a handful of judges decide that it is time to pass a Constitutional amendment then they absolutely have that right to pursue it. Will it pass? Who knows. But there is a process.
    Judges that were duly elected by the citizens of their state and, as such, as duly representing their constituents. This is much different that those Supreme Court Justices where were appointed by the POTUS.

    What Santorum, Huckabee and Carson are trying to do is play off the personal anxieties of the religious faithful, that somehow their way of life and sense of morality will be crippled. Oddly enough, the people should be more pissed off about the SCOTUS' landmark decision on Citizens United than they need be on the gay rights issue, but because "marriage" and procreation are personal issues, standing up against gay marriage is an easy target since it conjures up fears of "diminished returns on life" itself.

    As to the "process" you mentioned above, since marriage is a licensed practice afford to the states, I'd say only the states have a right to make the decision on who will be permitted to marry. But once the SCOTUS rules favorable on ground of equality (and they'll have no choice since 37 states allow gay marriage), Congress won't be able to do a thing about it.

    Those that are claiming Santorum is wrong are themselves 'wrong', but really...they are just partisan ideologues being snarky.
    It's not being snarky. I happen to oppose gay marriage myself, but the only way to resolve the conflict that life partners are currently experiencing when a loved one is seriously injured or is dying due to a fatal illness and that loved one can't be at his/her partner's bedside or make any decisions on their behalf or claim their death benefits despite what was previously agreed upon through a legally binding contract that is voided due to conflicting federal laws is to grant them some form of a civil union even through common law to recognized their rights as human beings who otherwise shared a period of happiness and devotion to one another that for the lack of gender identity and procreation would be no different from the love you or I share with our "gender identifiable" female spouses (as men; males spouses as women).
    "A fair exchange ain't no robbery." Tupac Shakur w/Digital Underground

  3. #73
    Sage
    Hatuey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:56 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    41,622

    Re: Rick Santorum says supreme court's gay marriage decision not 'final word'

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Your dogged belief that I cant/wont accept things is comical.
    Well, you are the guy coming up with hypotheticals for things that won't happen so that automatically leads to the conclusion that you refuse to accept the inevitable. SCOTUS will rule in favor of gay marriage, and the majority of those who oppose it will simply wallow in attempts to explain why the system didn't work for them. The evil judges, the gay conspiracy, the media, you know, the usual drill. Why can't you simply accept this and move on? None of that pipe dream of yours is going to happen. The gays will keep getting married, and we'll have 50 years worth of whining on another issue that those who oppose change were defeated on.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

  4. #74
    Sage
    VanceMack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:50 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    52,853

    Re: Rick Santorum says supreme court's gay marriage decision not 'final word'

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Judges that were duly elected by the citizens of their state and, as such, as duly representing their constituents. This is much different that those Supreme Court Justices where were appointed by the POTUS.

    What Santorum, Huckabee and Carson are trying to do is play off the personal anxieties of the religious faithful, that somehow their way of life and sense of morality will be crippled. Oddly enough, the people should be more pissed off about the SCOTUS' landmark decision on Citizens United than they need be on the gay rights issue, but because "marriage" and procreation are personal issues, standing up against gay marriage is an easy target since it conjures up fears of "diminished returns on life" itself.

    As to the "process" you mentioned above, since marriage is a licensed practice afford to the states, I'd say only the states have a right to make the decision on who will be permitted to marry. But once the SCOTUS rules favorable on ground of equality (and they'll have no choice since 37 states allow gay marriage), Congress won't be able to do a thing about it.



    It's not being snarky. I happen to oppose gay marriage myself, but the only way to resolve the conflict that life partners are currently experiencing when a loved one is seriously injured or is dying due to a fatal illness and that loved one can't be at his/her partner's bedside or make any decisions on their behalf or claim their death benefits despite what was previously agreed upon through a legally binding contract that is voided due to conflicting federal laws is to grant them some form of a civil union even through common law to recognized their rights as human beings who otherwise shared a period of happiness and devotion to one another that for the lack of gender identity and procreation would be no different from the love you or I share with our "gender identifiable" female spouses (as men; males spouses as women).
    We'll see. If SCOTUS rules as expected, there will definitely be heat from many states to overturn their decision. AS is currently ongoing, states are still appealing the federal judges decisions which is a pretty clear indicator that they are not all willing to just go down without a fight.

    (BTW...most of those judges that decided on the states laws were not elected judges...they were appointed federal judges)

    Again...I personally hope this is settled once and for all in June.

  5. #75
    Sage
    Chomsky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Third Coast
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:41 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Left
    Posts
    17,900

    Re: Rick Santorum says supreme court's gay marriage decision not 'final word'

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    [...]

    And btw, Santorum would never be my choice for POTUS, nor would I vote for him for dogcatcher.
    Same here!

    I love dogs way too much!
    "When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross." - Sinclair Lewis

    The 10 Commandments of Logic - (Courtesy of Abbazorkzog Blog)

  6. #76
    Sage
    clownboy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Oregon
    Last Seen
    08-17-16 @ 09:31 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    26,087

    Re: Rick Santorum says supreme court's gay marriage decision not 'final word'

    Well, to those convinced of a victory for homosexual marriage in the SCOTUS decision - don't discount the history of the court. I think the decision will be far more nuanced than a yay/nay. Even when the court legalized abortion in Roe v Wade, they placed a ton of conditions and a mile of wiggle room in the decision.

  7. #77
    Sage
    VanceMack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:50 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    52,853

    Re: Rick Santorum says supreme court's gay marriage decision not 'final word'

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Well, you are the guy coming up with hypotheticals for things that won't happen so that automatically leads to the conclusion that you refuse to accept the inevitable. SCOTUS will rule in favor of gay marriage, and the majority of those who oppose it will simply wallow in attempts to explain why the system didn't work for them. The evil judges, the gay conspiracy, the media, you know, the usual drill. Why can't you simply accept this and move on? None of that pipe dream of yours is going to happen. The gays will keep getting married, and we'll have 50 years worth of whining on another issue that those who oppose change were defeated on.
    The hypothetical is...what if they DONT? Will YOU then be so committed to the pro gay marriage side just accepting it and dropping it and moving on? Its a direct and honest question. One you some reason cant manage to bring yourself to answer (And FTR...I already HAVE answered it).

    Sorry man. I care about you. Would it help you if I put on a little show of false outrage? Would that make you feel better...feel vindicated?

  8. #78
    Sage
    Hatuey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:56 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    41,622

    Re: Rick Santorum says supreme court's gay marriage decision not 'final word'

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    The hypothetical is...what if they DONT?
    They will. Any belief that the contrary is possible is simply delusion. That is why your hypothetical hasn't been taken serious. It's asking a person to consider another possibility that has no possibility of happening. It's an useless experiment.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

  9. #79
    Sage

    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:23 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    29,197

    Re: Rick Santorum says supreme court's gay marriage decision not 'final word'

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    There shouldn't be a need, but there is. Unfortunately, my fellow Americans took it upon themselves to vote against someone else's freedom, (either directly or indirectly via legislation) based on nothing other than a moral disapproval of that freedom. It's sad, and fundamentally unamerican. But because they did that, there is a need for SCOTUS to step in. Because my fellow Americans violated the constitution when they did that.
    actually it is 100% American to vote the way they want to vote and decide on issues like that. the fact that you didn't like the outcome doesn't mean that it wasn't American it very much was American as the people decided which way to vote.

    Santorum's quote is just lip service. He is technically correct, there is never a "final word" on anything because any law can change. Even the constitution can change. But it is still just lip service to the religious right because nobody is really delusional enough to believe this is going to go back to the way it was. Santorum knows full well there will never again be enough votes in congress or enough votes on a ballot to reverse the decision we all know SCOTUS is about to make.
    He is correct in a way. the SCOTUS is not the final word.
    Congress can still act to negate the ruling, but it is a long drawn out process that would probably end in failure.

  10. #80
    Sage
    VanceMack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:50 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    52,853

    Re: Rick Santorum says supreme court's gay marriage decision not 'final word'

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    They will. Any belief that the contrary is possible is simply delusion. That is why your hypothetical hasn't been taken serious. It's asking a person to consider another possibility that has no possibility of happening. It's an useless experiment.
    They probably will. Not the point. But your refusal to actually answer the question is telling...and really...it answers the question.

Page 8 of 11 FirstFirst ... 678910 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •