• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Hastert Case Is Said to Be Linked to Decades-Old Sexual Abuse

108? Ugh. But it's a dry heat, right :shock:

Humidity 7%, which is good, I still don't have my A/C on, running a big portable evaporative cooler, only works in low humidity.
 
I think the issue is that the "family values" thing I the type of thing one should personally strive to achieve. When family values are preached - people are more concerned with how other's act. If you want to show you are family values - keep your own house in order and you do not need to announce it.

In terms of affairs and such...they happen in real life and in political life. Unless there is something other than the affair (government secrets, underage , rape, bribery/extortion)I think the affair is a family issue.

And frankly - the "family values" moniker is used frequently to address gay issues. Again, not applying the "family values" to themselves, but used to bash others. Family values to me - assuring that your children are safe, fed, clothed, well educated, and healthy. It has nothing to do with pointing fingers at others. It reminds me of religion in general - it should be used as a blueprint on how to run your own life - not used as a weapon to degrade others.

But yeah, Clinton's sexual exploits were not a proud moment for him - and painful moments for his family. But as long as he wasn't screwing a kid or giving away government secrets - it was none of my concern. My concern was how this country faired under his Presidency. Pretty damned well. And frankly, he likely could be elected again if rules allowed.

That's fair - I don't like anyone preaching to me about anything to do with the personal lives of individuals. But speaking of how you choose to live and what you believe in personally is fine, and strangely expected in American politics. Here in Canada, we don't give a rats ass what religion or personal life choices a politician makes but seems in America, a politicians personal life is dissected completely and held up for criticism. Here, the spouse of the Prime Minister is virtually invisible, unlike your First Lady. You seem to want to elect a "family", not hire someone for a job. When you do that, people tend to promote their family as a model and then they get in trouble.
 
Humidity 7%, which is good, I still don't have my A/C on, running a big portable evaporative cooler, only works in low humidity.

That's why many Canadians retire to the American southwest - here, it's been very humid off and on the past few weeks and only in the high 70's low 80's.
 
That's fair - I don't like anyone preaching to me about anything to do with the personal lives of individuals. But speaking of how you choose to live and what you believe in personally is fine, and strangely expected in American politics. Here in Canada, we don't give a rats ass what religion or personal life choices a politician makes but seems in America, a politicians personal life is dissected completely and held up for criticism. Here, the spouse of the Prime Minister is virtually invisible, unlike your First Lady. You seem to want to elect a "family", not hire someone for a job. When you do that, people tend to promote their family as a model and then they get in trouble.

Even your creationists are more moderate and reasonable.

Fish fossils found by Calgary 'creationist'
 
This conservative doesn't expect anyone to live their lives by any standard they don't support themselves. This conservative believes in personal responsibility and taking ownership for your mistakes and weaknesses. This conservative doesn't throw out an entire group of people because of one person's failings. And this conservative doesn't have a major stigma about homosexuality.

It's a shame that you revel in the failings of people and can't wait for more. This conservatives hopes for the best in people.


That's why there are so many conservatives that support all this family value legislation, and get caught with their pants down. That's because they don't expect anybody to live up to expectations that they don't follow themselves. Right.
 
That's fair - I don't like anyone preaching to me about anything to do with the personal lives of individuals. But speaking of how you choose to live and what you believe in personally is fine, and strangely expected in American politics. Here in Canada, we don't give a rats ass what religion or personal life choices a politician makes but seems in America, a politicians personal life is dissected completely and held up for criticism. Here, the spouse of the Prime Minister is virtually invisible, unlike your First Lady. You seem to want to elect a "family", not hire someone for a job. When you do that, people tend to promote their family as a model and then they get in trouble.

I wish it were like that here. :peace And frankly I am sick and tired of folks out Jesus-ing others here (and that is not exclusive to the Republicans. Both sided pander.

I don't want to elect a family. I want the job to get done.

Clinton (for all of his personal flaws) seemed to get the job done. Let Hillary give him the grief he deserved for rolling his cigar.

I do not think anyone who helped elect him the first time had any doubts that he had a wandering eye and hands.:roll:
 
That's why many Canadians retire to the American southwest - here, it's been very humid off and on the past few weeks and only in the high 70's low 80's.

Until today, it has been amazing, only one 100 degree day. But, we are expecting another insane monsoon season like last year, with El Nino. Just got to keep the roof intact for one more summer.
 
I think the issue is that the "family values" thing I the type of thing one should personally strive to achieve. When family values are preached - people are more concerned with how other's act. If you want to show you are family values - keep your own house in order and you do not need to announce it.

In terms of affairs and such...they happen in real life and in political life. Unless there is something other than the affair (government secrets, underage , rape, bribery/extortion)I think the affair is a family issue.

And frankly - the "family values" moniker is used frequently to address gay issues. Again, not applying the "family values" to themselves, but used to bash others. Family values to me - assuring that your children are safe, fed, clothed, well educated, and healthy. It has nothing to do with pointing fingers at others. It reminds me of religion in general - it should be used as a blueprint on how to run your own life - not used as a weapon to degrade others.

But yeah, Clinton's sexual exploits were not a proud moment for him - and painful moments for his family. But as long as he wasn't screwing a kid or giving away government secrets - it was none of my concern. My concern was how this country faired under his Presidency. Pretty damned well. And frankly, he likely could be elected again if rules allowed.

I consider the whole 'family values' ticket to be meaningless rhetoric to deflect from the actual issued. That and 'I love the constitution' are two pieces of political rhetoric that make me examine the person much closer for fraud.
 
I consider the whole 'family values' ticket to be meaningless rhetoric to deflect from the actual issued. That and 'I love the constitution' are two pieces of political rhetoric that make me examine the person much closer for fraud.

I can understand that!

(The whole I think thou dust protest too much thing)
 
People can believe the right things and yet still be hypocrites in the personal actions they take. And don't forget, weakness of character is not limit to those who believe in the value of family and a moral lifestyle.

I always find it funny when people throw up the "wonderful family values politician" line. It's as if the actions of the individual would have been acceptable if only they didn't believe in the strength of families. Perhaps that's why so many modern day liberals love to ridicule wayward conservatives and yet still hold up President Clinton as a model and cherish his Presidency. I suppose if you have
no morals you can be easily excused for acting immorally.

An oldie that is never not current:

Political Moral Standards.jpg
 
$3.5 million dollars is insane. But being a lobbyist that is small change.

If one is a creationist, why oh why did your God make the human orgasm more powerful that meth. Clinton succumb to it. Even Einstein is reportedly had a little romp with Marilyn Monroe.

The only difference between Meth and Sexual Affairs is that with Sexual Affairs you usually don't lose your teeth.
 
I seem to have more respect for the average American than you do. In a country of well over 300 million people, I don't consider Denny Hastert to be the exemplar.

I have great respect for Americans, but not right-wing politicians and Haster is yet another example of why. The man's a hypocrite of the first order. If he wasn't so high and mighty, he'd just be a creep. There was another who got busted in a men's room. If they just stop trying to hide who they are we'll all get along better.
 
Was there ever any doubt? Nobody, and I mean NOBODY, pays $3.5M to somebody they didn't ass rape.

Really? Even an allegation can end someone's career. Just ask Washingon senator Brock Adams about that, the allegations were never proven against Adams and he denies them, but he abandoned a reelection bid over them.

Hastert could've paid him off just to avoid allegations.... There is no proof of actual sex abuse here, none will be prosecuted either
 
Was there ever any doubt? Nobody, and I mean NOBODY, pays $3.5M to somebody they didn't ass rape.



Everyone is entitled to their day in court, but what I've read so far doesn't look good for Hastert.

It looks like the feds have a good case. No one wants to lie to the FBI (That will get you locked up.).
 
Really? Even an allegation can end someone's career. Just ask Washingon senator Brock Adams about that, the allegations were never proven against Adams and he denies them, but he abandoned a reelection bid over them.

Hastert could've paid him off just to avoid allegations.... There is no proof of actual sex abuse here, none will be prosecuted either

Moving those amounts of money around was not on the up and up or we'd all know it by now. I do hate to these things happen, but it looks like Haster in the net just like Tom Delay was.
 
Everyone is entitled to their day in court, but what I've read so far doesn't look good for Hastert.

It looks like the feds have a good case. No one wants to lie to the FBI (That will get you locked up.).

Well said. That's why in the OP my only comment was, "this'll be interesting". When it starts to shake out we're going to learn more.
 
People can believe the right things and yet still be hypocrites in the personal actions they take. And don't forget, weakness of character is not limit to those who believe in the value of family and a moral lifestyle.

I always find it funny when people throw up the "wonderful family values politician" line. It's as if the actions of the individual would have been acceptable if only they didn't believe in the strength of families. Perhaps that's why so many modern day liberals love to ridicule wayward conservatives and yet still hold up President Clinton as a model and cherish his Presidency. I suppose if you have no morals you can be easily excused for acting immorally.

It is interesting, though, that when a Republican is involved in a sex scandal it usually involved another male. And often that male is underage.
 
Moving those amounts of money around was not on the up and up or we'd all know it by now. I do hate to these things happen, but it looks like Haster in the net just like Tom Delay was.

Well of course the money is the issue, he was structuring to avoid reporting requirements and then lied to the FBI about it, no doubt about the money.

I just am not willing to jump on the bandwagon and call him a perv yet, sex abuse allegations are by nature difficult to disprove and they can be the kiss of death to a political career. It is very plausible to pay someone hush money even of they're not guilty. Remember Cosby payed significant amounts of money to a young woman who claimed he had fathered her, until she got too greedy and he demanded a paternity test, she disappeared quickly
 
Everyone is entitled to their day in court, but what I've read so far doesn't look good for Hastert.

It looks like the feds have a good case. No one wants to lie to the FBI (That will get you locked up.).

Henry Cisneros ( Clinton's housing secretary) lied to the FBI about money he paid to a former mistress..... he got a 10,000 fine.

the bulk of Hasterts punishment will come from withdrawing his own money without telling the govt...... "the war on cash" is getting his ass in a sling.
 
That's why there are so many conservatives that support all this family value legislation, and get caught with their pants down. That's because they don't expect anybody to live up to expectations that they don't follow themselves. Right.

Did I say that? Did I claim to be a spokesperson for all conservatives? I provided my own opinion - do you have one?
 
It is interesting, though, that when a Republican is involved in a sex scandal it usually involved another male. And often that male is underage.

A psychologist or psychiatrist could speak to this more, but I think it's likely that those who are ashamed of being gay or bisexual and attracted to teenage males, which is different from being a pedophile, likely aspire to or try to hide behind those who oppose gay and bisexual activity. It's no different from gay or bisexual priests, as an example. As a result, when they are found out, they appear hypocritical. When you try to hide in a forest, you look for trees to hide behind. And when you're attracted to young men, you sometimes become a teacher or other childcare professional. You may think there are a lot of Republicans involved in such activity, but the vast majority of teachers are Democrats and there are far more teachers caught in such actions than politicians.
 
Back
Top Bottom