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Thread: Nebraska Abolishes Death Penalty[W:203]

  1. #121
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    Re: Nebraska Abolishes Death Penalty

    Quote Originally Posted by LeoVlaming View Post
    I don't desire the death of anyone. But some people pose such an unacceptable risk to society that they deserve to be executed.
    Life in prison without parole removes that risk to society. So it seems that we can accomplish this without the use of the DP

    Quote Originally Posted by LeoVlaming View Post
    It is not so that the death penalty is more expensive than keeping somebody in jail for 50+ years. The "studies" that purport to demonstrate that do not take into account the full cost of housing, feeding, guarding, taking medical care of, etc somebody for all that time, let alone the cost of all the legal proceedings somebody can institute during such a period of time. That being said, coast is not a serious consideration or argument in this matter.

    Human justice, like everything human, is imperfect. That doesn't mean we have to abandon it.
    Actually, the calculations entail everything. The trials alone cost about 1 million dollars more for a DP case. Housing a DP inmate is much more expensive as well. In California, for instance, the annual cost of DP was about 137 million while it's annual cost for Life in Prison was 11.5 million. That includes keeping them and housing them and feeding them.

    So as we can clearly see, the DP has significantly higher costs associated with it.

    Human justice is imperfect, I never said anything else. Nor did I say to abandon it. I am not calling to nix the courts, I'm not saying we should close all the jails, I'm not advocating the cessation of all punishment. But I do say that for one part of it, a part that has no functional benefit and a plethora of negatives, we can do away with it while keeping risk to society the same and saving a crap ton of money. Plus we remove one more way for the government to legally kill us.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Nebraska Abolishes Death Penalty

    Quote Originally Posted by LeoVlaming View Post
    So you feel that it was very wrong to execute the commander of Auschwitz, right?
    Yes, horrible people commit atrocities.

    Now please explain clearly for me why an individual carrying out murder against an innocent is bad, but the state executing an innocent person is good. Because when I try to see the common thread in those two thoughts, protection of the innocent doesn't seem to be it. No more bon mots or deflections: please address directly the issue of the execution of innocent people.

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    Re: Nebraska Abolishes Death Penalty

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Life in prison without parole removes that risk to society. So it seems that we can accomplish this without the use of the DP
    As I demonstrated this is simply not true. Are you arguing people should be locked up in their cel 24/7 for the rest of their life and never be allowed to come into physical contact with anybody, not even for medical reasons?

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    Re: Nebraska Abolishes Death Penalty

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Actually, the calculations entail everything. The trials alone cost about 1 million dollars more for a DP case. Housing a DP inmate is much more expensive as well. In California, for instance, the annual cost of DP was about 137 million while it's annual cost for Life in Prison was 11.5 million. That includes keeping them and housing them and feeding them.

    So as we can clearly see, the DP has significantly higher costs associated with it.

    .
    This is not true. You are arguing that 50+ years of legal procedures is cheaper than 10+ years.

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    Re: Nebraska Abolishes Death Penalty

    Quote Originally Posted by LeoVlaming View Post
    As I demonstrated this is simply not true. Are you arguing people should be locked up in their cel 24/7 for the rest of their life and never be allowed to come into physical contact with anybody, not even for medical reasons?
    Where did you demonstrate that at?
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Nebraska Abolishes Death Penalty

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius46 View Post
    I misread your post. My apologies.
    Thank you (sincerely).

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    Re: Nebraska Abolishes Death Penalty

    Quote Originally Posted by LeoVlaming View Post
    This is not true. You are arguing that 50+ years of legal procedures is cheaper than 10+ years.
    People stay on death row for decades. Just stating that something is not true doesn't make it false. All the studies are self consistent with the greatly inflated cost of DP cases on the system.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Nebraska Abolishes Death Penalty

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Seriously, please explain for me why an individual carrying out murder against an innocent is bad, but the state executing an innocent person is good. Because when I try to see the common thread in those two thoughts, protection of the innocent doesn't seem to be it. No more bon mots or deflections: please address directly the issue of the execution of innocent people.
    Where did I say that the state executing an innocent person is good? You are being dishonest (or stupid). I am saying that the state executing an innocent person is regrettable just as it is regrettable when the state lets an innocent person die in prison.

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    Re: Nebraska Abolishes Death Penalty

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    People stay on death row for decades. Just stating that something is not true doesn't make it false. All the studies are self consistent with the greatly inflated cost of DP cases on the system.
    No, those studies do not take into account all the possible legal court cases (on all sorts of matters) an inmate can bring while he is incarcerated for life. Nor do they take into account the cost of medical care for people who are 70, 80 or 90 years old.

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    Re: Nebraska Abolishes Death Penalty

    Quote Originally Posted by LeoVlaming View Post
    Where did I say that the state executing an innocent person is good? You are being dishonest (or stupid). I am saying that the state executing an innocent person is regrettable just as it is regrettable when the state lets an innocent person die in prison.
    Regrettable, but not something worth stopping? Why is the life of an innocent on the streets of higher priority than the life of an innocent on death row?

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