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Thread: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South China

  1. #31
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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by humbolt View Post
    All nations are to enjoy freedom of navigation. The U. S. is among the group of all nations, and we trade with the nations in that area of the globe. Understanding these things is fundamental.
    Yes, true enough. Has anybody disputed that?? Now kindly show me where China has threatened to compromise anybody's ability to continue to peddle their trade via the shipping lanes that straddle the Spratlys?
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by humbolt View Post
    We have treaty obligations with Japan and the Philippines. Perhaps China should settle the dispute with the other claimants before declaring an economic exclusion zone and building a military base on disputed territory.
    At the very least then, the US should set back and leave them to settle their dispute. And if Japan or the Philippines initiate hostilities then the US should deny responsibility.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    China is not threatening it at present and China may never threaten it. However, if China were able to gain a position where it could militarily dominate the South China Sea, it would have a capacity to shut down shipping in those waters. The optimal approach would be a settlement of the historic disputes or at least development of a framework for managing differences among the countries even as the territorial disputes persist.

    As has been the case with rising powers in the past, China is almost certainly going to seek to translate its large and growing economic clout into military power. That need not mean inevitable conflict. How China, its neighbors, and the world's other major powers manage their differences will be important in avoiding the risk of conflict.

    In the end, China understands the importance of hard power. That its past period of weakness was exploited, especially during the 19th and early 20th centuries, has further strengthened the importance it places on hard power. Power remains the principle guarantee of security, even in the 21st century. Given today's emphasis on technology, one can reasonably expect that China will seek to develop strong military capabilities in all the possible military forums: land, sea, air, space, and cyberspace.
    You so nicely describe the US with that. Otherwise I agree with you that China understands the value of hard power, which is a no brainer, who doesn't. But China's understanding of this doesn't end with their experiences with Japan. The current military spending spree, (approximately 18% annual increase) has directly correlated to US military adventurism in the Middle East which has taken both China and Russia's breath away. And they have declared there concerns over it, and even blocked further US aggressions at the UN level. USFP is pushing Russia and China together, and pushing China on the Spratlys, (and greater SCS) and coming to unfounded conclusions about their intentions is either the product of bias hatred of China (god knows why) or just plain ignorance, or maybe both.
    Last edited by Montecresto; 05-27-15 at 03:12 PM.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Sorry, but America is moving AWAY from interfering foreign policy. Wait and see! The present uni-polar world status is waning. But don't fear, a balance of power is preferable.
    Oh yes. That worked so well in 1914........

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Yes, true enough. Has anybody disputed that?? Now kindly show me where China has threatened to compromise anybody's ability to continue to peddle their trade via the shipping lanes that straddle the Spratlys?
    Free trade and free passage are not limited to strictly maritime issues. Additionally, there are also disputed fishing rights among other things. All suggest that a solution be settled at a table for discussion, negotiation, and arbitration if necessary.

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    At the very least then, the US should set back and leave them to settle their dispute. And if Japan or the Philippines initiate hostilities then the US should deny responsibility.
    That would be preferred, but we aren't the country that's acting aggressively here - China is. And no, I'm not in favor of the US ignoring it's treaty obligations, and again no, we are not bound to honor the treaty when the other signatory initiates hostilities irresponsibly. We are bound to help defend them if they are attacked. As a result, we are compelled to watch closely.

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by humbolt View Post
    Free trade and free passage are not limited to strictly maritime issues. Additionally, there are also disputed fishing rights among other things. All suggest that a solution be settled at a table for discussion, negotiation, and arbitration if necessary.
    Right, so China isn't threatening the shipping lanes.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by humbolt View Post
    That would be preferred, but we aren't the country that's acting aggressively here - China is. And no, I'm not in favor of the US ignoring it's treaty obligations, and again no, we are not bound to honor the treaty when the other signatory initiates hostilities irresponsibly. We are bound to help defend them if they are attacked. As a result, we are compelled to watch closely.
    One cannot act aggressively when defending their territory. And China has several forms of title to the Spratlys, the others none. And China has accussed the others, save Brunei, of their own aggressive actions over the years in building military infrastructures on various islands in the archipelago, as well as stationing troops on them. This is NOT this cut and dry situation that the "hate China" crowd depicts. I suppose your amongst the party of hawks that even thinks China's pursuit of its interests in the South China Sea are worthy of a military response???
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Right, so China isn't threatening the shipping lanes.
    Did I say they were? I think you need to understand free and innocent passage - it doesn't pertain to maritime passage alone, and not solely to shipping, although that seems to be the only portion of this issue you seem eager to discuss. Could it be that the reason is that shipping itself, per se, is not the central issue? I think so.

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by Doppelgangirl View Post
    I'd be worried once the first nuke went off, it'd pretty much be the end of things.

    IIRC, China kicked our butts during practice "War Games" not too long ago.

    Kinda scary.
    Oooh when was this (even though war games =\= all out war).
    -----MOS 19D = cavalry scout = best damn MOS there is

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