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Thread: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South China

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    How are the Spratly's outside of China's territorial waters?
    Do they legally own each one of the many rock outcroppings?
    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    The damage to the black community from all this will be devastating.
    Not only on public perception and reputation, but cops simply won't want to police these neighborhoods anymore.
    The shooter was later found to be white.

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    How are the Spratly's outside of China's territorial waters?
    Arbitration 101: Philippines v. China | Asia Maritime Transparency Initiative
    A ruling on the jurisdictional issue may be expected anytime within 3 to 6 months after the middle of June 2015. This is on account of the importance of the crucial issue of jurisdiction, the pace at which the Tribunal has proceeded thus far, and assuming that a hearing on oral arguments is not called for, and that Vietnam’s statement does not result in additional proceedings. The latter depends largely on the results of consultations on the matter. This ruling will determine whether the case will terminate at this stage or proceed any further.
    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    The damage to the black community from all this will be devastating.
    Not only on public perception and reputation, but cops simply won't want to police these neighborhoods anymore.
    The shooter was later found to be white.

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by JANFU View Post
    Do you think that China claiming what they have claimed in the China Sea is not meant to provoke/intimidate other countries including the US.
    A strategic pivot is exactly what China is doing with the SC Seas claim and building in areas/reefs outside of their territorial waters.
    .

    That's correct JF. Its 6 sites that has most attention, and it is what has all those other Asian nations condemning the moves. As this asserts more of China's Claims. While diminishing theirs.




    Comparison of current operational distances of PLA bases with airstrips from<br />Taiwan versus the Spratly Islands (distances in nautical miles).(“China’s First Airstrip in the Spratly Islands Likely at Fiery Cross Reef,” Ethan Meick, using Google Maps; adapted from David Shlapak, “Chinese Air Superiority in the Near Seas,” in Peter Dutton, Andrew S. Erickson, and Ryan Martinson (eds.), China’s Near Seas Combat Capabilities (China Maritime Studies, U.S. Naval War College, February 2014))


    One of the military initiatives China’s likely to undertake once it’s done building the islands is to implement an air-identification zone (a.k.a. ADIZ), says Peter Dutton, director of the China Maritime Studies Institute at the U.S. Naval War College. But China’s Spratly ambitions likely go way beyond mere military might, he adds.

    “It certainly also means supporting the fishing fleet, oil and natural-gas exploration, the ability to support law enforcement and coast guard, in addition to military activities,” says Dutton. “The islands being built up in the South China Seas really do present a major problem for other claimants in the region in that regard, because China simply outclasses them in every dimension of state power needed to reinforce [its claims].”.....snip~

    China&#39;s Island-Building Spree Is About More Than Just Military Might - Defense One

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    That's correct JF. Its 6 sites that has most attention, and it is what has all those other Asian nations condemning the moves. As this asserts more of China's Claims. While diminishing theirs.




    Comparison of current operational distances of PLA bases with airstrips from<br />Taiwan versus the Spratly Islands (distances in nautical miles).(“China’s First Airstrip in the Spratly Islands Likely at Fiery Cross Reef,” Ethan Meick, using Google Maps; adapted from David Shlapak, “Chinese Air Superiority in the Near Seas,” in Peter Dutton, Andrew S. Erickson, and Ryan Martinson (eds.), China’s Near Seas Combat Capabilities (China Maritime Studies, U.S. Naval War College, February 2014))

    One of the military initiatives China’s likely to undertake once it’s done building the islands is to implement an air-identification zone (a.k.a. ADIZ), says Peter Dutton, director of the China Maritime Studies Institute at the U.S. Naval War College. But China’s Spratly ambitions likely go way beyond mere military might, he adds.

    “It certainly also means supporting the fishing fleet, oil and natural-gas exploration, the ability to support law enforcement and coast guard, in addition to military activities,” says Dutton. “The islands being built up in the South China Seas really do present a major problem for other claimants in the region in that regard, because China simply outclasses them in every dimension of state power needed to reinforce [its claims].”.....snip~

    China's Island-Building Spree Is About More Than Just Military Might - Defense One
    Oil, gas, fishing rights, minerals and control of the area. They can easily create a Denial of Area to any country they wish to.
    Denial of Area, making it costly in blood and treasure is meant to lock out the US from Asia.
    And China play a long game, and that is my opinion.
    They want Asia and the countries near them to be more like client states.
    TPP will also cost them trade and investment.
    India is upping their military spending, why, due to China and security issues.
    But China only has so long to do this.
    Aging population and as economists say, China will be old, before they are rich.
    India on the other hand is or will be a Superpower in the next 20-30 years.
    Then we have Malaysia, economy on fire and growing fast.
    As to the US pivot to Asia, well that is what most countries are doing as Asia is where growth is.
    There will not be a Unipolar world for much longer, with the US at the top of the heap.
    More likely Tri Polar. US-China-India-
    And Russia, well until they reform their economy and legal titles to property, rid themselves of corruption, they will be China's Putz Boys.
    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    The damage to the black community from all this will be devastating.
    Not only on public perception and reputation, but cops simply won't want to police these neighborhoods anymore.
    The shooter was later found to be white.

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by JANFU View Post
    Do they legally own each one of the many rock outcroppings?
    We've been over this repeatedly. Yes, having read from an array of differing accounts, taking into consideration all the different biases and subjective interests of not only the six countries which have the overlapping claims, but various advocacy groups, experts in international/foreign affairs, and so on, China emerges as the most legitimate claimant, they simply do. And I remain frustrated by those that continue to point to the infrastructure that China has built on "disputed islands" while the other claimants (save Brunei) have in fact constructed their own infrastructures as well as rotated troops upon the very same "disputed islands" without a single mention, let alone criticism. Additionally you won't comment on the fact that Taiwan has laid claim to the entire Spratly archipelago and the implications that has on Vietnam, Philippines and Malaysia??!!
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    With China's title to the Spratly's, why wouldn't they have the traditional 12 nautical mile radius around them. Why have US ships remained outside that radius?
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by JANFU View Post
    Oil, gas, fishing rights, minerals and control of the area. They can easily create a Denial of Area to any country they wish to.
    Denial of Area, making it costly in blood and treasure is meant to lock out the US from Asia.
    And China play a long game, and that is my opinion.
    They want Asia and the countries near them to be more like client states.
    TPP will also cost them trade and investment.
    India is upping their military spending, why, due to China and security issues.
    But China only has so long to do this.
    Aging population and as economists say, China will be old, before they are rich.
    India on the other hand is or will be a Superpower in the next 20-30 years.
    Then we have Malaysia, economy on fire and growing fast.
    As to the US pivot to Asia, well that is what most countries are doing as Asia is where growth is.
    There will not be a Unipolar world for much longer, with the US at the top of the heap.
    More likely Tri Polar. US-China-India-
    And Russia, well until they reform their economy and legal titles to property, rid themselves of corruption, they will be China's Putz Boys.


    But UNCLOS doesn’t make it quite so easy for countries to parcel up the sea in search of tuna and crude. An island must be naturally formed—and not reclaimed—land that sits above water at high tide—otherwise it gives the claimant country no right at all. Meanwhile, rocks that can’t “sustain human habitation or economic life of their own” grant their owners no more than the 12-nm territorial sea.




    It certainly also means supporting the fishing fleet, oil and natural-gas exploration, the ability to support law enforcement and coast guard, in addition to military activities,” says Dutton. “The islands being built up in the South China Seas really do present a major problem for other claimants in the region in that regard, because China simply outclasses them in every dimension of state power needed to reinforce [its claims].”.....snip~
    Last edited by MMC; 05-30-15 at 01:31 PM.

  8. #278
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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by JANFU View Post
    Do they legally own each one of the many rock outcroppings?
    Who's defining "legally" here. If you have any knowledge about how the US came into possession of Hawaii, I'd like you to explain to me how it merits your definition of legal?
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    We've been over this repeatedly. Yes, having read from an array of differing accounts, taking into consideration all the different biases and subjective interests of not only the six countries which have the overlapping claims, but various advocacy groups, experts in international/foreign affairs, and so on, China emerges as the most legitimate claimant, they simply do. And I remain frustrated by those that continue to point to the infrastructure that China has built on "disputed islands" while the other claimants (save Brunei) have in fact constructed their own infrastructures as well as rotated troops upon the very same "disputed islands" without a single mention, let alone criticism. Additionally you won't comment on the fact that Taiwan has laid claim to the entire Spratly archipelago and the implications that has on Vietnam, Philippines and Malaysia??!!
    China and Taiwan agreed years ago on this.
    Building was for the most part halted with the agreement made some time ago.
    China also thru that agreement out the door along with all claimants discussing a solution.
    They are making a Territory claim on other countries territory.
    Then China goes on a massive building spree, and claiming all of the disputed Islands.
    Do they have legal claims to some, yes, all of them, no.
    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    The damage to the black community from all this will be devastating.
    Not only on public perception and reputation, but cops simply won't want to police these neighborhoods anymore.
    The shooter was later found to be white.

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    With China's title to the Spratly's, why wouldn't they have the traditional 12 nautical mile radius around them. Why have US ships remained outside that radius?
    Why would they poke China in their face.
    The US position is for all parties to jointly negotiate a settlement.
    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    The damage to the black community from all this will be devastating.
    Not only on public perception and reputation, but cops simply won't want to police these neighborhoods anymore.
    The shooter was later found to be white.

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