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Thread: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South China

  1. #221
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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    US Raises Opposition To China's Moves In South China Sea

    www.npr.org News World AsiaNPR


    May 15, 2015 - The Obama administration says China is making aggressive grabs for disputed islands in the South China Sea. The mounting tensions loom ...


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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    1. America Can Stop Chinese Aggression in Asia - The ...

      nationalinterest.org/.../superpower-showdown-ameri...


    2. The National Interest


      Mar 6, 2015 - Superpower Showdown: America Can Stop Chinese Aggression in Asia ... Beijing's actions in the South China Sea should not be shocking ...



    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    China's New Airstrip in the South China Sea Is Almost ...

    foreignpolicy.com/.../chinas-new-airstrip-in-the-south-chi...


    Foreign Policy


    Apr 16, 2015 - Declaring a zone over the South China Sea, as Chinese scholars and ... stand up to what it sees as China's aggression in the South China Sea.
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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    China is on a crazy mission to build artificial islands. What ...

    www.vox.com/2015/3/13/8203713/south-china-sea-explained


    Mar 13, 2015 - Filipino demonstrators at a 2014 protest against Chinese aggression in the South China Sea. (JAY DIRECTO/AFP/Getty Images) ...
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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    But no ally has asked the US to uphold its treaty obligations here nor inferred that it needs to. The US seems to have taken it upon itself to provoke China over what is a regional storm in a teacup 8000 miles away. Why is it doing this ?
    No, they haven't to my knowledge, not yet. It behooves us to understand the nature of the conflict and what may be expected of us if it escalates. Any responsible government with such obligations would do this. England would. Russia would, and anybody else you care to think of who has those obligations and that capacity. It's simply prudent. Let me remind you, we are not the ones threatening to fight here. China is the one doing that. I assume they want to fight with those in the region who have some gripes because they've taken some belligerent actions against some of them. That, and the free passage thing I mentioned before are the reasons why we have some small stake in the adventures there. Beyond that, no, I don't think we're particularly interested in the Chinese island being constructed other than for an assessment of the military capabilities they intend to base there.

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Those treaty obligations aren't open on both ends. The Philippines for example can't reach out and poke a stick at China expecting the US to be there when China snaps back. Well, they can, and the US likely would be there, but that's not the intent or literal purpose of such agreements. Furthermore, such agreements exist to give countries the "cover" of legitimacy to militarily operations in places they want to be but otherwise couldn't defend the right to be.
    We aren't that naive. We've done that very thing ourselves, as has virtually any other nation of mention at one time or another. As I've said earlier, the legitimacy of the various claims should be weighed in an impartial international forum. Now, if you claim that such a forum doesn't exist I won't argue that, but there is one who's expressed purpose is just that. Beyond that, we are wise to keep an eye on things there, and if that means overflights in international air space, we should do that.

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by JANFU View Post
    Not that I do not like the answers, the answers have no substance.
    I ain't talking about the islands. Look at the 47 agreement and the new claims. Right into territorial waters of other countries. The n47 map claimed part of 2 nations territory. That ain't water.

    No answer on why China reneged on their agreement and specifically demanded one on one negotiations. That one is easy to answer.

    No answer on why China does not avail themselves of the Seas Convention? Why? Can you answer that.
    No answer on why China reneged on their past agreements. Again an easy one
    No answer on why the US is supposedly in the wrong?
    No answer on why these countries are asking for US diplomatic assistance.
    No answer on why China does not take this to the UN? Because they will lose.
    Why is the US in the wrong on this?
    We'll then that's the problem, I've been talking about the Spratly's (and a bit on the Paracel's) exclusively, the whole time.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by humbolt View Post
    We aren't that naive. We've done that very thing ourselves, as has virtually any other nation of mention at one time or another. As I've said earlier, the legitimacy of the various claims should be weighed in an impartial international forum. Now, if you claim that such a forum doesn't exist I won't argue that, but there is one who's expressed purpose is just that. Beyond that, we are wise to keep an eye on things there, and if that means overflights in international air space, we should do that.
    I've proven Chinese claims to the Spratly's for one hundred and thirty years, if you don't even haul out their more ancient history. The US annexed Hawaii (that's right, I said annexed, absorbed, TOOK possession of, essentially stole, in 1898) a hundred and twenty years ago. Suppose another country decided to overlay claims upon it in the mean time, do you think the US would put up with being told that we need to go before some fictitious world body to be informed whether or not our possession and occupation is legal? You do realise that the US doesn't give a **** about those "sand castles" but that this (along with TPP) is about holding China down, containment, an attempt to prevent China from becoming the undisputed regional power. This is a uni-polar world god damnit, and the US is the authority, who does China think they are???
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  9. #229
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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    China's Dangerous Game - The Atlantic

    www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/.../chinas.../380789/


    The Atlantic


    If China can impose its will in the South China Sea, at least five rival .... Chinese ships in order to raise the cost of Chinese aggression to unacceptable levels.
    Greetings, Jack.

    Exceptionally enlightening link on China!

    While we've been focused on barbarians like ISIS in the ME, and Boko Haram in Africa; we now have Russia trying to expand their influence in the Crimea and the Ukraine; and we're trying to negotiate with Iran on a nuclear deal that no one likes! Meanwhile, China has been busy inking deals for oil, gas, uranium, gold and other commodities with countries around the globe, and now they decide it's time to further their plans on the Spratlys, causing unrest in the South China Sea area? In addition, they hold at least a trillion dollars of our debt. Too many "coincidences" happening lately to suit me! Why is all this converging now, and for what purpose - to overwhelm us? *just musing* :

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    Re: Beijing warns US: 'We will fight back' as battle of words escalates over South Ch

    Quote Originally Posted by polgara View Post
    Greetings, Jack.

    Exceptionally enlightening link on China!

    While we've been focused on barbarians like ISIS in the ME, and Boko Haram in Africa; we now have Russia trying to expand their influence in the Crimea and the Ukraine; and we're trying to negotiate with Iran on a nuclear deal that no one likes! Meanwhile, China has been busy inking deals for oil, gas, uranium, gold and other commodities with countries around the globe, and now they decide it's time to further their plans on the Spratlys, causing unrest in the South China Sea area? In addition, they hold at least a trillion dollars of our debt. Too many "coincidences" happening lately to suit me! Why is all this converging now, and for what purpose - to overwhelm us? *just musing* :
    Polgara????????? This is NOTHING NEW

    The People's Republic of China (PRC) claims all of the Spratly Islands as part of China, and has had a long naval presence in the territories.

    The Republic of China (ROC), which ruled mainland China before 1949 and has been confined to Taiwan since 1949, also claims all of the Spratly Islands.

    Basis for PRC's and ROC's claimsEdit
    China claims to have discovered the islands in the Han Dynasty in 2 BC. The islands were claimed to have been marked on maps compiled during the time of Eastern Han dynasty and Eastern Wu (one of the Three Kingdoms). Since the Yuan dynasty in the 12th century, several islands that may be the Spratlys have been labelled as Chinese territory,[60] followed by the Ming Dynasty[61] and the Qing dynasty from the 13th to 19th Century.[62] In 1755,[62][63] archaeological surveys the remains of Chinese pottery and coins have been found in the islands and are cited as proof for the PRC claim, but they are more likely to have come from shipwrecks of passing Chinese junks.[64]

    Chinese fishermen have fished around the islands since 200 BC.[34]

    In the 19th century, Europeans found that Chinese fishermen from Hainan annually sojourned on the Spratly islands for part of the year, while in 1877 it was the British who launched the first modern legal claims to the Spratlys.[32][33]

    When the Spratlys and Paracels were being surveyed by Germany in 1883, China issued protests against them. The 1887 Chinese-Vietnamese Boundary convention signed between France and China after the Sino-French War said that China was the owner of the Spratly and Paracel islands.[34] China sent naval forces on inspection tours in 1902 and 1907 and placed flags and markers on the islands. The Qing dynasty's successor state, the Republic of China, claimed the Spratly and Paracel islands under the jurisdiction of Hainan.[35]

    The Spratlys and the Paracels were conquered by Japan in 1939. Japan administered the Spratlys via Taiwan's jurisdiction and the Paracels via Hainan's jurisdiction.[32] The Paracels and Spratlys were handed over to Republic of China control from Japan after the 1945 surrender of Japan,[36] since the Allied powers assigned the Republic of China to receive Japanese surrenders in that area.[35]

    After WW2 ended, the Republic of China was the "most active claimaint". The Republic of China then garrisoned Itu Aba (Taiping) island in 1946 and posted Chinese flags and markers on it along with Woody island in the Paracels, France tried, but failed to make them leave Woody island.[32] The aim of the Republic of China was to block the French claims.[35][37] The Republic of China drew up the map showing the U shaped claim on the entire South China Sea, showing the Spratly and Paracels in Chinese territory, in 1947.[35]

    Spratly Islands dispute - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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