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Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS[W:452]

Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Interesting question, do you think it was? Are you going for the "if you ever thought anything they did has merit then you are a hypocrite" gambit?

I would also argue that the UN has changed considerably since 1948 and to try and force an equivalency between 1948 UN and the UN of the last several decades is foolish in the extreme.



This is a bizarre argument on your part. The UN doesn't become credible by creating resolutions, in becomes credible by enforcing them. It has a woeful track record of enforcing resolutions.

I think the UN human rights and women's rights councils are a good idea if they weren't run by the UN who appoints criminal regimes to head up the committees.



Yes, along with US funding.



I would? News to me.

You are vacant of knowledge concerning the UN if you think that it has an enforcement arm. So I see by way of not answering my questions, I was right, you turn on and off the UN's relevancy.
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

I am VERY pro-Soldier and very proud of our Military. It bothers me to see the condition that some of our Solider's are returning..fighting a war that will never be won. Even tho a Soldier makes the sacrifice to protect his or her country does not mean that we as a Nation should be reckless where we send them. The region is not worth the casualties or the resources. They will never separate religion from government and this is a must for peace. I do not think WE failed, I think the Iraqi people and government failed. We gave them a chance and they blew it. There isn't anything left to do, except maybe built a base there for stability, or stake an American flag there...since we have spent so much $$$, we practically own Iraq. :) j/k

Do you wonder why we went to Iraq in the first place? People simply point to Bush nowadays, but back then, many Democrats and Republicans alike were behind it. It's not like Bush pulled them into a room and told them there were WMD's and they simply believed him, there must have been strong enough evidence for Congress to believe as well. I guess my point is there were concrete reasons for going at the time and we shouldn't be ashamed of what we've done there, especially the troops....we shouldn't consider it a downright failure. I actually wish we would've kept a huge base there, like we did in Japan, which I think would help towards stability in the ME. I believe you though, the Iraqi's have blown it so far, it's hard to believe how little they've done for their own freedom. And it's sad to see so many troops with mental issues over this, I don't know if too many came back from Desert Storm with the same issues, but then again, Desert Storm was a quick and total victory, much more acceptable,mentally.
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Do you wonder why we went to Iraq in the first place? People simply point to Bush nowadays, but back then, many Democrats and Republicans alike were behind it. It's not like Bush pulled them into a room and told them there were WMD's and they simply believed him, there must have been strong enough evidence for Congress to believe as well. I guess my point is there were concrete reasons for going at the time and we shouldn't be ashamed of what we've done there, especially the troops....we shouldn't consider it a downright failure. I actually wish we would've kept a huge base there, like we did in Japan, which I think would help towards stability in the ME. I believe you though, the Iraqi's have blown it so far, it's hard to believe how little they've done for their own freedom. And it's sad to see so many troops with mental issues over this, I don't know if too many came back from Desert Storm with the same issues, but then again, Desert Storm was a quick and total victory, much more acceptable,mentally.

Greetings, JC. :2wave:

Bush left the SOFA open for Obama to either accept the agreement or renegotiate his own terms. Obama chose to do neither. End of story. We now see the Iraqi army today throwing down their weapons and running from ISIS. I can't tell you the number of times I've heard the comment "WTH? Why leave your weapons for the enemy to use against you!" I don't have an answer for that question....
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Greetings, JC. :2wave:

Bush left the SOFA open for Obama to either accept the agreement or renegotiate his own terms. Obama chose to do neither. End of story. We now see the Iraqi army today throwing down their weapons and running from ISIS. I can't tell you the number of times I've heard the comment "WTH? Why leave your weapons for the enemy to use against you!" I don't have an answer for that question....

Evening Pg :kissy:

Yeah, I don't get the mentality over there. They simply don't have the will to fight for the kind of freedom we have and I don't know why.

Hope your day's going well!:)
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Evening Pg :kissy:

Yeah, I don't get the mentality over there. They simply don't have the will to fight for the kind of freedom we have and I don't know why.

Hope your day's going well!:)

It was sunny and very humid earlier, but there's a thunderstorm going on right now! The curtains above the sink are blowing straight out - :wow: I got my last day teaching accomplished today, so I don't have to think about that again till Fall. :thumbs: Work going okay, or are you getting rained out?
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

It was sunny and very humid earlier, but there's a thunderstorm going on right now! The curtains above the sink are blowing straight out - :wow: I got my last day teaching accomplished today, so I don't have to think about that again till Fall. :thumbs: Work going okay, or are you getting rained out?

Very busy with work, though not rained out yet :2no4:. We did get a storm today, and it was real hot and humid before that, so the rain and the cool breeze it brought felt good. :) I'll bet your glad to have a little more free time from teaching for your gardening!
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Very busy with work, though not rained out yet :2no4:. We did get a storm today, and it was real hot and humid before that, so the rain and the cool breeze it brought felt good. :) I'll bet your glad to have a little more free time from teaching for your gardening!

Yep - that, and I hope to get to NC for a few days' "vacation," which is really to get some things done down there. We'll see.
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Yep - that, and I hope to get to NC for a few days' "vacation," which is really to get some things done down there. We'll see.

Hopefully there's no one else on your land this time. :shock:

Nite my friend :yawn: :2wave:
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Greetings, JC. :2wave:

Bush left the SOFA open for Obama to either accept the agreement or renegotiate his own terms. Obama chose to do neither. End of story. We now see the Iraqi army today throwing down their weapons and running from ISIS. I can't tell you the number of times I've heard the comment "WTH? Why leave your weapons for the enemy to use against you!" I don't have an answer for that question....

Polgara, you should know that the US can NEVER leave Iraq if you want to keep Islamic extremists contained! Can you see yet why Saddam's tight grip that didn't allow fighting amongst the various factions, and gave no quarters to al Qaeda or any other extremists groups was better than the vacuum created by the invasion and occupation of Iraq which the Bush era (2006) NIE concluded had caused a sudden increase to global terrorism, and made America less safe. I think the NIE is "end of story"!!!
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Hopefully there's no one else on your land this time. :shock:

Nite my friend :yawn: :2wave:

Nite, JC. Sleep well. :thumbs:
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Polgara, you should know that the US can NEVER leave Iraq if you want to keep Islamic extremists contained! Can you see yet why Saddam's tight grip that didn't allow fighting amongst the various factions, and gave no quarters to al Qaeda or any other extremists groups was better than the vacuum created by the invasion and occupation of Iraq which the Bush era (2006) NIE concluded had caused a sudden increase to global terrorism, and made America less safe. I think the NIE is "end of story"!!!

I'm all for letting them kill each other if that's their solution - like they have been doing for over 1300 years! :shock:
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

I'm all for letting them kill each other if that's their solution - like they have been doing for over 1300 years! :shock:

Well, you have to consider that there was far less of it going on when Hussein, Mubarak, Gaddafi and Assad had operational control. Either the US is destabilising the region by design, or we've had complete morons running our foreign policy for yyeeaarrss!!
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Well, you have to consider that there was far less of it going on when Hussein, Mubarak, Gaddafi and Assad had operational control. Either the US is destabilising the region by design, or we've had complete morons running our foreign policy for yyeeaarrss!!

Both ISIS in the ME and Boko Haram in Africa slaughtering at will - it's getting worse instead of better!
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Both ISIS in the ME and Boko Haram in Africa slaughtering at will - it's getting worse instead of better!

I know, it ain't nothin nice.
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Do you wonder why we went to Iraq in the first place? People simply point to Bush nowadays, but back then, many Democrats and Republicans alike were behind it. It's not like Bush pulled them into a room and told them there were WMD's and they simply believed him, there must have been strong enough evidence for Congress to believe as well. I guess my point is there were concrete reasons for going at the time and we shouldn't be ashamed of what we've done there, especially the troops....we shouldn't consider it a downright failure. I actually wish we would've kept a huge base there, like we did in Japan, which I think would help towards stability in the ME. I believe you though, the Iraqi's have blown it so far, it's hard to believe how little they've done for their own freedom. And it's sad to see so many troops with mental issues over this, I don't know if too many came back from Desert Storm with the same issues, but then again, Desert Storm was a quick and total victory, much more acceptable,mentally.

Saddam was on Clinton's radar too. At the time, Saddam was the bastard child of the ME. He was absolutely brutal with his war tactics in Iran and Kuwait. I do not blame Bush or Clinton, or the current POTUS. We cannot control human nature and using chemical weapons is a war strategy of the ME, along with human shields. Americans do not fight like that and I think that is what ruffles our feathers to get involved. I think that everyone thought that the last Iraq war would be like Desert Storm....less than 3 months. From what I understand, Kuwait was occupied by Iraq when we arrived on the scene. Iraqi soldiers were atrocious to the Kuwait citizens. Basically raped and pillaged the entire country. The only thing I remember in the 90's was respiratory issues and skin irritations from Desert Storm Vets. Iraq surprised everyone and our Soldier's who were front line really paid the price for 10 years. This one was horrific from IED explosions and suicide bombers...with kids and women. Imagine what our Solider's would experience with ISIS....the worst of the bunch. IMO, they are only baiting us to go over there so they can burn a US soldier every week on CNN in a cage...and make us turn against Muslim Americans for their buy in to the cause. Now is the time to pull out. We do not need their oil, everyone is pumping it and they cannot invade us on our own soil. I don't want our Solider's to think they failed...because they were awesome and perfect over there. They just needed to come home and they cannot control the behavior of another culture. Eventually that culture needs to take care of themselves.
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

you are vacant of knowledge concerning the un if you think that it has an enforcement arm. So i see by way of not answering my questions, i was right, you turn on and off the un's relevancy.

images.jpg

stop, or we won't stop you!
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Some Egyptian talk shows have an opinion on all of this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXodRLLkth4

Greetings, Grant. :2wave:

WOW! :shock: I didn't know my eyes could open that wide in shock this early in the day! While I agree that climate change is not the biggest threat this country faces - considering that everybody and his brother now think they should all have nukes, which I consider a bit more critical - their level of outrage, frustration, and sarcasm was totally unexpected! If this was a spoof, it was certainly a shock to watch! :beam:
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Brennan's opinion was cited very much in context.

You mean he was pouting, because he was being asked for results?
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

:shock:

If that doesn't represent proof then whatever else could ? Why was Iraq even mentioned at this time when as it transpired a load of Saudis were actually responsible ? Where were the calls for reprisals against Saudi Arabia rather than Iraq when that was quite quickly established afterwards ?

Who knows? But a sentence in a situation of pressure reported by someone at the meeting in a short scribble? I don't know that that is proof. I knew of the statement and would not disregard it, but I would not want to lend it too much weight. We just don't know, what was going on at the time and just before in the background, we weren't at the meetings. As I say, I would not want the bit forgotten if stronger evidence cropped up. But as it stands?
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Who knows? But a sentence in a situation of pressure reported by someone at the meeting in a short scribble? I don't know that that is proof. I knew of the statement and would not disregard it, but I would not want to lend it too much weight. We just don't know, what was going on at the time and just before in the background, we weren't at the meetings. As I say, I would not want the bit forgotten if stronger evidence cropped up. But as it stands?

Yes but'as it stands ' once they did know what happened and who's citizens were really responsible ,why was Iraq still attacked and Saudi Arabia completely ignored ?
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Yes but'as it stands ' once they did know what happened and who's citizens were really responsible ,why was Iraq still attacked and Saudi Arabia completely ignored ?

Look at the history running up to Iraq. It had nothing much to do with terrorism.
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Look at the history running up to Iraq. It had nothing much to do with terrorism.

It had nothing much to do with the history running up to Iraq either given the 9/11 retribution messages chalked often on bombs destined for Baghdad. Lets just say Americans were not being 'discouraged' to believe Iraq was somehow culpable
 
Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

Yes but'as it stands ' once they did know what happened and who's citizens were really responsible ,why was Iraq still attacked and Saudi Arabia completely ignored ?

Unfortunately, BushCo's never going to answer that.
 
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