Page 46 of 64 FirstFirst ... 36444546474856 ... LastLast
Results 451 to 460 of 638

Thread: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS[W:452]

  1. #451
    Sage
    jmotivator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    13,388

    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    The IBC is but one source of estimate on the civilians killed in Iraq. There are many sources, and I'll post the range for you again here.

    Scientific surveys of Iraqi deaths resulting from the first four years of the Iraq War found that between 151,000 to over one million. Iraqis died as a result of the conflict.

    Casualties of the Iraq War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    And as Upsideguy correctly pointed out to you, killing civilians in an attempt to remove Saddam Hussein for killing civilians is stupid!
    As I suspected you were stuck in a faulty assumption. You are dumping insurgent and Iraqi army deaths in with the total. That is not what is or was being discussed. If that were my point then I would have included deaths from the Iran/Iraq war and the Gulf War into my totals and the deaths caused by Saddam would be closer to 2.5 million.

    Let me post that whole paragraph for you, Montecresto, since you mysteriously cut out the important part:

    "Scientific surveys of Iraqi deaths resulting from the first four years of the Iraq War found that between 151,000 to over one million Iraqis died as a result of conflict during this time. A later study, published in 2011, found that approximately 500,000 Iraqis had died as a result of the conflict since the invasion. Counts of deaths reported in newspapers collated by projects like the Iraq Body Count project found 174,000 Iraqis reported killed between 2003 and 2013, with between 112,000-123,000 of those killed being civilian noncombatants."

    Huh, editing out the part that proves you wrong? Typical.
    Last edited by jmotivator; 06-03-15 at 09:06 PM.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

  2. #452
    Global Moderator
    The Truth is out there.
    Kal'Stang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Bonners Ferry ID USA
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    28,214

    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Moderator's Warning:
    Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS[W:452]Lets stop with the personal remarks and stick to the topic or infractions/thread bans will be handed out.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

  3. #453
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Last Seen
    07-19-15 @ 05:33 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    972

    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    To the bolded, you lost me there dude, the rest probably has as much meaning. You came to DP to peddle a singular point Muslim=Enemy, and I'm not interested.
    Statistical methods applied to the Islamic texts showed that:

    Islam is far more of a political system than a religion.

    There is no unmitigated good in Islam for the Kafir (non-Muslim).

    Islam’s ethical system is dualistic and is not based on the Golden Rule.

    Islamic doctrine cannot be reconciled with our concepts of human rights and our Constitution.

    The great majority, 96%, of all Islamic doctrine about women subjugates them.

    The Sunna (what Mohammed did and said) is more important than the Koran in a Muslim’s daily life.


    Dr. Bill Warner, Author - Political Islam

    And this is why the Iraqi Army flees before the ISIS forces.

    Their allegiance and orientation is to Allah and they know that ISIS = the REAL followers of Allah.

    It is time we realize this costly lesson and not waste another dollar or a single US life there.
    Last edited by Tazmanian Devil; 06-03-15 at 11:36 PM.

  4. #454
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Canada, Costa Rica
    Last Seen
    05-16-16 @ 07:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    31,645

    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    As I suspected you were stuck in a faulty assumption. You are dumping insurgent and Iraqi army deaths in with the total. That is not what is or was being discussed. If that were my point then I would have included deaths from the Iran/Iraq war and the Gulf War into my totals and the deaths caused by Saddam would be closer to 2.5 million.

    Let me post that whole paragraph for you, Montecresto, since you mysteriously cut out the important part:

    "Scientific surveys of Iraqi deaths resulting from the first four years of the Iraq War found that between 151,000 to over one million Iraqis died as a result of conflict during this time. A later study, published in 2011, found that approximately 500,000 Iraqis had died as a result of the conflict since the invasion. Counts of deaths reported in newspapers collated by projects like the Iraq Body Count project found 174,000 Iraqis reported killed between 2003 and 2013, with between 112,000-123,000 of those killed being civilian noncombatants."

    Huh, editing out the part that proves you wrong? Typical.
    Excuse me for coming in late but are there figures available for those Iraqis killed by Coalition troops and those murdered by Islamists?

  5. #455
    Sage
    jmotivator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    13,388

    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Excuse me for coming in late but are there figures available for those Iraqis killed by Coalition troops and those murdered by Islamists?
    The IBC did an audit of their figures between 2003 and 2005 and found that 37% of the dead civilians were the result of coalition actions. I haven't seen an accounting of the full 9 years.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

  6. #456
    Sage
    Montecresto's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Last Seen
    03-13-16 @ 09:59 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    24,561

    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Y
    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    As I suspected you were stuck in a faulty assumption. You are dumping insurgent and Iraqi army deaths in with the total. That is not what is or was being discussed. If that were my point then I would have included deaths from the Iran/Iraq war and the Gulf War into my totals and the deaths caused by Saddam would be closer to 2.5 million.

    Let me post that whole paragraph for you, Montecresto, since you mysteriously cut out the important part:

    "Scientific surveys of Iraqi deaths resulting from the first four years of the Iraq War found that between 151,000 to over one million Iraqis died as a result of conflict during this time. A later study, published in 2011, found that approximately 500,000 Iraqis had died as a result of the conflict since the invasion. Counts of deaths reported in newspapers collated by projects like the Iraq Body Count project found 174,000 Iraqis reported killed between 2003 and 2013, with between 112,000-123,000 of those killed being civilian noncombatants."

    Huh, editing out the part that proves you wrong? Typical.
    Saved by the in-thread warning and your selective numbers from just the IBC, who aren't the only group to compile numbers on Iraqi civilian deaths during the ten year war. Also, any numbers accepted don't account for the wounded which would be two-three times the dead, and no numbers include the related deaths due to the destruction of needed infrastructure, nor the deaths subsequent to injuries sustained by bombing.

    Iraq Death Toll Reaches 500,000 Since Start Of U.S.-Led Invasion, New Study Says
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/1...n_4102855.html

    "We think it is roughly around half a million people dead. And that is likely a low estimate," says Hagopian. "People need to know the cost in human lives of the decision to go to war."
    http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...hs-survey-2013

    Iraq study estimates war-related deaths at 461,000
    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-24547256

    And the IBC uses a inaccurate method for counting.

    Several other attempts have been made to estimate the war dead, and particularly civilians killed by violence. Iraq Body Count is the most well known. It counted individuals reported in English-language newspapers, mainly, which SEVERELY limited its scope. The problem with these methods is that they only capture part of the total picture.

    http://web.mit.edu/humancostiraq/
    Last edited by Montecresto; 06-04-15 at 10:29 AM.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  7. #457
    Sage


    JANFU's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Alberta Canada
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:25 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    11,833

    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by Tazmanian Devil View Post
    Statistical methods applied to the Islamic texts showed that:

    Islam is far more of a political system than a religion.

    There is no unmitigated good in Islam for the Kafir (non-Muslim).

    Islam’s ethical system is dualistic and is not based on the Golden Rule.

    Islamic doctrine cannot be reconciled with our concepts of human rights and our Constitution.

    The great majority, 96%, of all Islamic doctrine about women subjugates them.

    The Sunna (what Mohammed did and said) is more important than the Koran in a Muslim’s daily life.


    Dr. Bill Warner, Author - Political Islam

    And this is why the Iraqi Army flees before the ISIS forces.

    Their allegiance and orientation is to Allah and they know that ISIS = the REAL followers of Allah.

    It is time we realize this costly lesson and not waste another dollar or a single US life there.
    Perhaps posting this in the Religious forums would better suit your purpose.
    If my post offends you, I deeply Apple-O-Jize.

  8. #458
    Sage
    jmotivator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    13,388

    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Y

    Saved by the in-thread warning and your selective numbers from just the IBC, who aren't the only group to compile numbers on Iraqi civilian deaths during the ten year war. Also, any numbers accepted don't account for the wounded which would be two-three times the dead, and no numbers include the related deaths due to the destruction of needed infrastructure, nor the deaths subsequent to injuries sustained by bombing.

    Iraq Death Toll Reaches 500,000 Since Start Of U.S.-Led Invasion, New Study Says
    Iraq Death Toll Reaches 500,000 Since Start Of U.S.-Led Invasion, New Study Says

    "We think it is roughly around half a million people dead. And that is likely a low estimate," says Hagopian. "People need to know the cost in human lives of the decision to go to war."
    Half-Million Iraqis Died in the War, New Study Says

    Iraq study estimates war-related deaths at 461,000
    Iraq study estimates war-related deaths at 461,000 - BBC News

    And the IBC uses a inaccurate method for counting.

    Several other attempts have been made to estimate the war dead, and particularly civilians killed by violence. Iraq Body Count is the most well known. It counted individuals reported in English-language newspapers, mainly, which SEVERELY limited its scope. The problem with these methods is that they only capture part of the total picture.

    The Human Cost of the War in Iraq

    And again you choose to argue the total dead rather than the civilian dead which was the actual discussion. You've simply moved the goalposts. Multiple verifications for a counter argument to a point I never made is a waste of both of our time.

    I like how you post the source that uses IBC to tally the civilian deaths and then YOU fault me for using the IBC!
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

  9. #459
    Sage
    Montecresto's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Last Seen
    03-13-16 @ 09:59 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    24,561

    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    And again you choose to argue the total dead rather than the civilian dead which was the actual discussion. You've simply moved the goalposts. Multiple verifications for a counter argument to a point I never made is a waste of both of our time.

    I like how you post the source that uses IBC to tally the civilian deaths and then YOU fault me for using the IBC!
    No fault for using the IBC. The fault is in relying on it exclusively, which as MIT points out is inadequate.

    And, the more recent BBC study corrects the faulty IBC count from earlier.

    About half a million people died in Iraq as a result of war-related causes between the US-led invasion in 2003 and mid-2011, an academic study suggests.
    University researchers from the US, Canada and Iraq based their estimate on randomised surveys of 2,000 households.
    The toll includes not only violent deaths from the invasion and subsequent insurgency, but avoidable fatalities linked to infrastructure collapse.
    It exceeds the 112,000 violent civilian deaths reported by Iraq Body Count.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-24547256
    Last edited by Montecresto; 06-04-15 at 10:46 AM.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  10. #460
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Canada, Costa Rica
    Last Seen
    05-16-16 @ 07:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    31,645

    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    The IBC did an audit of their figures between 2003 and 2005 and found that 37% of the dead civilians were the result of coalition actions. I haven't seen an accounting of the full 9 years.
    Yet those figures would be very important because we can all recall the suicide bombings against the Iraqi people, threats against the people if they tried to vote, etc., with Muslim murdering Muslin, and the precursors of ISL taking shape. List of bombings during the Iraq War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Page 46 of 64 FirstFirst ... 36444546474856 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •