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Thread: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS[W:452]

  1. #141
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    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by eohrnberger View Post
    You're expecting Iran to keep it's word? To honor it's commitment to the West's nations in the P5+1 talks?

    What is it with this administration? First a community organizer president, and now a social worker negotiating nuclear arms agreements?

    Not sure that's what the GOP is saying. I think that's just what you hear. I think the GOP is more so saying 'don't lift any economic sanctions' as it's one of the few leverage points we have with Iran.
    Mm-hmm. Y'know, you're a wonderful example of just what I was talking about: the "do what we say or we bomb you" mindset that seems to be the only tool in the conservative diplomatic toolbox.

    I want to ask you two questions:

    (1) If a much stronger nation told a much weaker America that if we didn't scrap our entire bomb-making infrastructure, they'd bomb us and maybe even invade us, what do you think we'd do. Do you think we'd knuckle under, or would we redouble our efforts to build bombs?

    (2) Considering your answer to the previous question, what the hell makes you think that the Iranians would react any differently?

    This is why we do things like use REAL diplomacy - which, if you knew half as much as you think you do about diplomacy, is not the panty-waisted appeasement process you seem to think. There's a reason why diplomacy is often called "the velvet glove that covers the mail'd fist". Think about it.
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  2. #142
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    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by Higgins86 View Post
    Well you can't turn back time, so what do you think should happen with the current situation? Do you think we should leave Iraq to ISIS?
    Perfect time for Israel, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Egypt, Iran, and the rest to put their petty differences aside and face a gang of despots that threatens all of them. But US, no, I made myself clear to you in the first post.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by eohrnberger View Post
    Interesting that the intel came from a number of nation's intelligence services, all corroborating each other. So all these intelligence services were skewing the intel?

    How large is this conspiracy? Large enough that there'd be no way in hell of keeping a lid on it.
    To the bolded. No, that was BushCo that was massaging the intell, and there's plenty of corroboration on that. What's with you guys anyway, what's in it for you to defend that bastard administration to the death, hmm. Wtf is it???
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  4. #144
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    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by Higgins86 View Post
    Increase bombing, I would form together a collation of countries which would include Saudi Arabia/othe arab nations and get boots on the ground asap.
    This is happening now. Canada has boots on the ground and is involved actively in bombing raids both inside Syria and in Iraq. In fact, a Canadian soldier was killed in the fighting although Canadian troops are not officially involved in combat there.
    A Canadian conservative is one who believes in limited government and that the government should stay out of our wallets and out of our bedrooms.

  5. #145
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    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by MVictorP View Post
    "Evidences" are all over the place. During the American Revolution, there were some on your side (as well as on the other side, any other side) that wanted nothing but victory or death. Yeah, they were ready to die. They are now celebrated as heroes by your people, don't they?

    Did that meant that your nation (assuming it is the USA) is now a death cult?
    Not comparable at all. Suicide bombers WANT to die for their cause, US soldiers don't WANT to die for their cause.

    If that is the best you got then you lose.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

  6. #146
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    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    Not comparable at all. Suicide bombers WANT to die for their cause, US soldiers don't WANT to die for their cause.
    Yet some of them do. And not only that, those that do are deified by the population after "their sacrifice". It's exactly the same thing. Don't be hypocritical.

    If that is the best you got then you lose.
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  7. #147
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    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by MVictorP View Post
    Yet some of them do. And not only that, those that do are deified by the population after "their sacrifice". It's exactly the same thing. Don't be hypocritical.
    No, it isn't the same thing at all. If you are unable to see the difference then you are a lost cause.

    Coincidentally, do you see firefighters the same way? None of them want to die but risk their lives anyway and some even die... is that the same as a suicide bomber strapping on a vest and blowing themselves up in a disco?

    How about a police officer who runs into a collapsing building? They know they are risking their lives... are they just glorified suicide bombers?

    I'm wanting to know, really, how deep this delusion of yours actually runs.


    Yet it was more than what you can deal with. Sorry for making you look bad.
    Don't worry, you aren't making me look bad.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

  8. #148
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    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by jmotivator View Post
    No, it isn't the same thing at all. If you are unable to see the difference then you are a lost cause.

    Coincidentally, do you see firefighters the same way? None of them want to die but risk their lives anyway and some even die... is that the same as a suicide bomber strapping on a vest and blowing themselves up in a disco?

    How about a police officer who runs into a collapsing building? They know they are risking their lives... are they just glorified suicide bombers?
    Just because your bombers kill people in the comfort of a high-altitude plane does not make him any better than the one who straps explosives around himself. Both are killers, except one of them dies.

    And, of course, when you can afford the luxury of defeating your ennemy and not dying, it's usually a much better deal, ain't it? But it isn't everyone who can afford these luxuries. In some place, sacrifices above and beyond the call of duty are in order.

    Death is a job aspect that every policemen and firemen know about. And many of them will gladly die if others are saved, if the stakes are high enough, just like spies that get caught abroad. Doesn't mean your country is a death cult for that matter, and neither is Palestine. Their deaths are sacrifices in their minds, just like the dead war heroes you guys deify.

    I'm wanting to know, really, how deep this delusion of yours actually runs.
    I question your ability to comprehend... but serve yourself.

    Don't worry, you aren't making me look bad.
    You are able to do it on your own?
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  9. #149
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    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by MVictorP View Post
    Just because your bombers kill people in the comfort of a high-altitude plane does not make him any better than the one who straps explosives around himself. Both are killers, except one of them dies.
    One WANTS to die and the other doesn't. Do we need to start again? My point that you decided to challenge was that M.A.D. deterrent is not effective when one side wants to die. Your argument was that "no side wants to die" ... and you are proving that by saying the only difference between a bomber crew and a suicide bomber in that the bomber crew doesn't want to die? You are thrusting a dagger into the heart of your argument and declaring success.

    And, of course, when you can afford the luxury of defeating your ennemy and not dying, it's usually a much better deal, ain't it? But it isn't everyone who can afford these luxuries. In some place, sacrifices above and beyond the call of duty are in order.
    Ah, so some people are so bereft of luxuries that the only way they can conduct a war is by blowing up discos?

    Death is a job aspect that every policemen and firemen know about. And many of them will gladly die if others are saved, if the stakes are high enough, just like spies that get caught abroad.
    Yes, so dying trying to save others is noble. Blowing yourself up on purpose is meant to save nobody.

    Doesn't mean your country is a death cult for that matter, and neither is Palestine.
    People in Palestine cheer in the streets on news of innocent dead. And cheer in the streets at the news of a dead suicide bomber. That is a death cult.

    Their deaths are sacrifices in their minds, just like the dead war heroes you guys deify.
    No, wrong. They don't see their deaths as sacrifice, they see their deaths as personal gain. Again, they WANT to die. A simple fact that you have now agreed with on your quest to prove otherwise.

    Back to my original point: people who WANT to die are not governed by the central tenets of the M.A.D. deterrent.

    I question your ability to comprehend... but serve yourself.

    You are able to do it on your own?
    Cute!
    Last edited by jmotivator; 05-26-15 at 07:13 PM.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

  10. #150
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    Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS

    Quote Originally Posted by Henry David View Post
    The same group that deceived us and Mary Tillman about how her son died. The same group that deceived us regarding Jessica Lynch's experiences. The same group that deceives us about Abbottabad, that same group of known liars, that Cult Of Mendacity, the Pentagon.

    As Ike liked to call the group, the Military Industrial Complex and its corporate media. That is who deceived us. Some have been deceived, others have come to realize they've been deceived.
    Who exactly in the Pentagon?

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