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Thread: Los Angeles Raises Minimum Wage to $15 an Hour

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    Re: Los Angeles Raises Minimum Wage to $15 an Hour

    Quote Originally Posted by countryboy View Post
    What you described is unsustainable.
    I'm not sure how you come to that conclusion. If the $ is there right now in the form of transfer payments, it could be there instead in the form of wages.

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    Re: Los Angeles Raises Minimum Wage to $15 an Hour

    Quote Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
    You are perpetuating falsehoods. Although conservatives claimed that Obamacare forced more part-time jobs, it isn't true. In fact, there’s no evidence that the ACA is forcing a shift to part-time work, according to the Urban Institute and Robert Wood Johnson Foundation report.

    Business Insider: The Myth That Obamacare Is Destroying Full-Time Jobs Just Got Debunked



    As for your claim that "they [the government] could have simply paid for everyone to be insured, but again that is not the purpose." It was hard enough getting Obamacare passed conservatives. Single-payer just isn't in the cards.
    You need to look away from the propaganda machine and go talk to real people. I know several store managers who had to do just that on orders from the corporate offices. We deal with 4 parts stores, it happened in all three of the national chain stores. The only full time employees left are managers, all other counter personnel and drivers are part time. In reading your link there are plenty of observations and assumptions, but no hard facts. I have watched three stores hire more part timers after cutting full timers back to 25 hours and have seen the managers have to figure out how to do it. I can tell you that none of the managers were happy about it. My company is too small to worry about it, but we did see our insurance rates go up by 38% over the past two years, which is something else the liberal apologists claim isn't happening. We understand that to lie is liberal, but you are not required to carry your party's water even when you know you have to lie to do it. It just makes you a liar too.

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    Re: Los Angeles Raises Minimum Wage to $15 an Hour

    Quote Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
    You come to this conclusion because raises for the lowest paid workers were rising fast before there was a MW? Employers would raise wages out of the goodness in their hearts? The minimum wage came about when owners arbitrarily CUT wages. To combat deflation, the government instituted the MW.

    There is no evidence AT ALL that abolishing the minimum wage would make wages raise faster. That's just absurd and fantasy.
    Ask Henry Ford about how that works out...min wage didnt even exist then. He made wages go up on his own, so he got the best workers.


    Right now the average worker is MEANINGLESS and INCONSEQUENTIAL. You dont mean anything because you are easily replaceable. The employer has all the power when a min wage exists. You have a no skilled job...you automatically get min wage, there isnt even thought involved.

    Now if employers had to compete for labor, guess what, wages are going to go up. Also thank feminism for making wages go down by doubling the work force. When women stayed at home to be mothers wages were higher too....smaller workforce...more competition for labor. Right now women are expected to have jobs outside the home...so guess what, each individual worker is worth even less.

    And dont even get me started on immigration and amnesty....

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    Re: Los Angeles Raises Minimum Wage to $15 an Hour

    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    Sam's Club = Half the sales of Costco, and fewer products on the shelf. No comparison. It takes for more people to stock 5 times the SKU's than it does at Costco. Consider the difference in the stores, and what's on the shelf.

    It really shouldn't be that difficult to understand.
    You're the one that brought up walmart. Sam's club is a part of walmart, and it is a wholesale club, which is what Costco is.


    If you didn't like how they stacked up, why did you reference it?
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    Re: Los Angeles Raises Minimum Wage to $15 an Hour

    Quote Originally Posted by KLATTU View Post
    So raising the minimum wage, no matter how much, has no effect on employment?
    Who said that? Can you quote them?
    "Half full or half empty doesn't matter. What matters is, you've only got half a glass...so what are you going to do about it?" - Me
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    Re: Los Angeles Raises Minimum Wage to $15 an Hour

    Quote Originally Posted by SlevinKelevra View Post
    Standard restaurant model: total labor costs (MW workers, subMW workers, Managers, etc) = 25-30% of total costs, and operate at ~5% margin
    So , let's use some easy #s,

    Total Costs = 1,000,000
    Revenues= 1,052,600
    Margin = 52,600
    LaborCost_LOW=250,000
    LaborCost_HIGH=300,000


    Assume MW = 1/2 of total LaborCosts
    In LaborCost_LOW that would be 125,000
    In LaborCost_HIGH that would be 150,000

    Let's assume that you now need to double this (to make the math easier....)

    NEW:
    LaborCost_LOW: 375,000
    LaborCost_HIGH: 450,000
    TotalCost_LOW: 1,125,000
    TotalCost_HIGH: 1,150,000
    To maintain a ~5% margin, ceteris paribus
    Revenue_LOW = 1,184,000
    Revenue_HIGH = 1,211,000

    So Revenue needs to increase by ~
    Either 132,000 or ~158,000

    Since this place is running on ~1.05M in revenue, let's assume a ticket averages $10
    They are moving then 105,000 tickets a year.

    To recoup 132,000 or ~158,000 they would have to increase ticket price by
    1.25$ or $1.50 (~12-15%) --- in other words, the typical amount of inflation that
    restaurants face in a 5-6 year window anyways.


    Now before you go bat guano crazy, consider in the last decade, ice cream has gone up in price (at least here) by about $1 (~20%) while decreasing the volume by ~25% in the container. Hence a net change per unit volume of ~47%----- Consumers weather gradual price increases far more robustly than you give them credit for if the good/service is worth "it" or is unique.
    Somewhere.....a brain has exploded.
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    Re: Los Angeles Raises Minimum Wage to $15 an Hour

    Quote Originally Posted by SlevinKelevra View Post
    If you can make the same # of units with less employees, you shouldn't have been employing that many people to begin with (in a quasi self-fiduciary responsibility sense, although the altruism would be nice)
    Stop this. You're making brains explode.
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    Re: Los Angeles Raises Minimum Wage to $15 an Hour

    Quote Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
    The minimum wage is 80 years old and yet America continues to have a resilient and robust economy.

    The problem is that the myths that conservatives convince themselves are real, like increasing the minimum wage will cause people to lose their jobs and it will drive out small businesses, are not real.

    Minimum Wage Mythbusters - U.S. Department of Labor
    The study was done by Nicholas Potter, now a researcher at Washington State University. He said some businesses in Santa Fe did close and some said it hurt their competitiveness. But workers were overwhelmingly positive about the pay hike. And the fear of massive restaurant closures didnít happen, he said, though the cost of eating out did go up some.

    ďIt seemed to have helped workers and not hurt business too much,Ē he said.

    Potential price increases at restaurants was the biggest negative impact identified by the Berkeley researchers. The cost of eating out went up 2 to 3 percent when the minimum wage rose 25 percent. That means dining out in Seattle could go up as much as 7 percent if the city goes to $15 an hour.

    But another Berkeley researcher said there isnít an overwhelmingly negative impact on any type of business where the minimum wage has been raised.
    Actually, "the problem is that" liberals marvel at their idea of 'mystery hole' economics; just as the tourists at hillside shacks are assured that there are gravity holes that violate the laws of physics, and think they see balls rolling up ramps, gullible liberals flock to the partisan showman urging them to see violations of the laws of economics... "see the city where if you increase the cost of labor, nothing happens except folks purchase MORE more labor" and "our souvenir shops sells below cost because we make it up in volume".

    Please...

    Telling us that the US economy has had the bad idea of MW for 80 years says nothing about how much better it might have been (or might be) for the affected if it had never been established. The longevity of a number of bad economic and fiscal ideas (e.g. tariffs, agricultural subsidies, water and reclamation subsidies, etc.) tells us nothing other than the persistence of public ignorance and/or the power of special vested interests.

    The issue is not how well we do in spite of pin-headed prejudices, or whether it affects most people, BUT of what effect it has on those it claims to help, and the consequences to those it does not. Telling us (falsely) that the net result is the same misses the whole point of the controversy - it's as disingenuous as claiming that a new tax that exclusively takes from the poor (and gives a break to the rich) is 'irrelevant' because the net revenue is the same.

    THE core ISSUE is not the aggregate effect on an economy (although it may be an issue), but the effect it has on certain trades, people, and income groups.

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    Re: Los Angeles Raises Minimum Wage to $15 an Hour

    ludin;1064646584]yea well what you forgot was that that 52k is maybe what the owner takes. he has to make a pay check and I doubt he will make 52k a year. he will want a bit more.
    So....what you're saying is, that without some form of MINIMAL amount being REQUIRED of employers to pay their help, they would gladly pay them less and less in order for themselves to make more???
    plus that margin that you talk of is being spent to fix or repair things in the restaurant.
    First, that was left out in order to dumb this down for some folks. Second, repair costs AREN'T an every year issue, unless they are taking proper care of their equipment. If you have to fix something EVERY YEAR...you're either using it wrong, or you need to get a new one/call in on the warranty.
    you also fail to see that some people might not pay $12 dollars for his lunch.
    Temporary. For, you see, those people getting paid more at the restaurant or going to SPEND more, and when they DO, OTHER people are going to make more. That's what happens in a consumer economy vs a production economy.
    so they will lose some customers. also no business person raises prices to break even. they raise prices above the break even.
    so his price would go from 10 to 15 dollars.
    So, the amount they made in profit PRIOR to a rate increase wasn't sufficient all along, and they just wanted an excuse to INCREASE their GM%? You're really not painting a very rosey picture of small business owners, lol.
    you also forget that he now has increased taxes that he has to pay for. his tax bill just went up.
    Explain.
    you leave a lot of factors out of your stacked hypothetical.
    Well, yeah, it's a simplified scenario.

    By all means, come up with your own and present it.
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    Re: Los Angeles Raises Minimum Wage to $15 an Hour

    Quote Originally Posted by tech30528 View Post
    Yeah, except I don't produce "units", I fix cars, and not all mechanics or technicians are created equal. I have a guy who makes $12 who is great for brakes, suspension work and simple maintenance, and I have a top guy who can diagnose complex issues who makes twice that. I have someone who works in the office who also makes $12 an hour, her production is more difficult to calculate since she doesn't actually produce labor hours but is necessary to make the rest of our operations more efficient. This isn't theoretical, it is reality.
    So what you are saying is, you have people who are VITAL to your business, but who's value brought in to the company vary.

    And this applies to minimum wage how?
    "Half full or half empty doesn't matter. What matters is, you've only got half a glass...so what are you going to do about it?" - Me
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