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Thread: ISIS seizes key Iraqi city of Ramadi as government forces pull back

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    Re: ISIS seizes key Iraqi city of Ramadi as government forces pull back

    Quote Originally Posted by JANFU View Post
    At that time did they not have the men and equipment?
    No one figured the ineptitude, corruption and lack of leadership would cause such a disaster.
    Should they have, yes, did they, no. At that time the American public had had more than enough of Iraq and expending blood and treasure.
    From the link. Maliki asks for patience yet he was the one person responsible for most of this disaster.
    He backed Shia militias targeting Sunni's.
    He sold leadership positions in the Military.
    The West has done enough. The hatred between Shia and Sunni after this will not be glossed over.
    Syria, another ****hole.
    Lebanon, only a bombing or 2 before that place reverts to sectarian war, with Iran supporting Hezbollah.
    Saudi and Turkey want regime change in Syria.
    Turkey is on the border and a short drive thru Jordan for Saudi to Syrian territory.

    Iraqi Prime Minister Maliki Urges Greater U.S. Support | United States Institute of Peace

    Nouri al-Maliki - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


    In January 2011, once the government of Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki was formed, President Obama decided, with the concurrence of his advisers, to keep troops on. But he wasn’t yet willing to tell Prime Minister Maliki or the American people. First, Washington had to determine the size of a residual force. That dragged on, with the military pushing for a larger force, and the White House for a small presence at or below 10,000, due to costs and the president’s prior “all troops out” position. In June the president decided on the force level (eventually 5,000) and obtained Mr. Maliki’s assent to new SOFA talks.

    The Obama administration was willing to “roll over” the terms of the 2008 Status of Forces Agreement as long as the new agreement, like the first, was ratified by the Iraqi Parliament.

    Iraqi party leaders repeatedly reviewed the SOFA terms but by October 2011 were at an impasse. All accepted a U.S. troop presence—with the exception of the Sadrist faction, headed by the anti-American cleric Moqtada al-Sadr, which held some 40 of Iraq’s 325 parliamentary seats. But on immunities only the Kurdish parties, with some 60 seats, would offer support. Neither Mr. Maliki, with some 120 seats, nor former Prime Minister Ayad Allawi, the leader of the largely Sunni Arab Iraqiya party with 80 more, would definitively provide support. With time running out, given long-standing U.S. policy that troops stationed overseas must have legal immunity, negotiations ended and the troop withdrawal was completed.....snip~

    James Franklin Jeffrey: Behind the U.S. Withdrawal From Iraq - WSJ



    Yet Maliki comes in 2013 due to how bad things are and with ISIL ready to break into Syria. Twice in the same year. Even knowing he was going to be put out of office.

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    Re: ISIS seizes key Iraqi city of Ramadi as government forces pull back

    2007

    Before the United States invaded Iraq, Al Qa’ida was on the ropes. The United States and its coalition partners had rousted it from Afghanistan and toppled the Taliban, while a global manhunt was steadily shutting down jihadist cells from Morocco to Malaysia. Perhaps equally important, many Islamists, including fellow jihadists, harshly criticized bin Ladin for having rashly attacked a super power and, in so doing, causing the defeat of the Taliban, the only "true" Islamic regime in the eyes of many radicals.

    The invasion of Iraq breathed new life into the organization. On an operational level, the United States diverted troops to Iraq rather than consolidate its victory in Afghanistan and increase its chances of hunting down Bin Ladin. Today, Al Qa’ida is reconstituting itself in the tribal areas of Pakistan. Politically, Iraq vindicated bin Ladin’s argument that the primary enemy of the Muslim world was not the local Muslim autocrats, but the "faraway enemy," the United States. Today, Al Qa'ida is again on the march.[2]

    It was not supposed to be this way. Toppling Saddam Husayn’s regime was meant to usher in an era of prosperity for Iraq and put Osama bin Ladin and his followers on the run. Instead, the tables have turned. Today, Iraq is torn by crime, plagued by a vicious insurgency, and devoid of competent government and basic services. Strife in Iraq continues without end in sight, while the human and financial costs to the United States and its allies mount. With each car bomb and kidnapping, critics urging the withdrawal of troops grow more and more vociferous.

    Iraq and the Global War on Terrorism | Brookings Institution
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: ISIS seizes key Iraqi city of Ramadi as government forces pull back

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    You are in the minority opinion. A plurality of Americans acknowledge the Iraq war as a mistake!
    A plurality of American libs may acknowledge that but not Americans who are smart enough NOT to buy into the false narratives of the Democrats. ( Bush lied people died, Halliburton war for oil.. etc )

    Iraqi citizens, including Women were voting not long ago and now they're being persecuted.

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    Re: ISIS seizes key Iraqi city of Ramadi as government forces pull back

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    In January 2011, once the government of Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki was formed, President Obama decided, with the concurrence of his advisers, to keep troops on. But he wasn’t yet willing to tell Prime Minister Maliki or the American people. First, Washington had to determine the size of a residual force. That dragged on, with the military pushing for a larger force, and the White House for a small presence at or below 10,000, due to costs and the president’s prior “all troops out” position. In June the president decided on the force level (eventually 5,000) and obtained Mr. Maliki’s assent to new SOFA talks.

    The Obama administration was willing to “roll over” the terms of the 2008 Status of Forces Agreement as long as the new agreement, like the first, was ratified by the Iraqi Parliament.

    Iraqi party leaders repeatedly reviewed the SOFA terms but by October 2011 were at an impasse. All accepted a U.S. troop presence—with the exception of the Sadrist faction, headed by the anti-American cleric Moqtada al-Sadr, which held some 40 of Iraq’s 325 parliamentary seats. But on immunities only the Kurdish parties, with some 60 seats, would offer support. Neither Mr. Maliki, with some 120 seats, nor former Prime Minister Ayad Allawi, the leader of the largely Sunni Arab Iraqiya party with 80 more, would definitively provide support. With time running out, given long-standing U.S. policy that troops stationed overseas must have legal immunity, negotiations ended and the troop withdrawal was completed.....snip~

    James Franklin Jeffrey: Behind the U.S. Withdrawal From Iraq - WSJ



    Yet Maliki comes in 2013 due to how bad things are and with ISIL ready to break into Syria. Twice in the same year. Even knowing he was going to be put out of office.
    How does this fall at Obama's feet. the Iraqi's not offering immunity.
    Maliki did not know he was toast till last year when ISIL exploded across Iraq.
    Quote Originally Posted by RickJames3000 View Post
    You need to revisit the chain of association... you only insisted you were a Trump-supporter after you figured out that made you a pederast as well. If I were you. I'd be more discreet about it... but I guess it's your dime.

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    Re: ISIS seizes key Iraqi city of Ramadi as government forces pull back

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    A plurality of American libs may acknowledge that but not Americans who are smart enough NOT to buy into the false narratives of the Democrats. ( Bush lied people died, Halliburton war for oil.. etc )

    Iraqi citizens, including Women were voting not long ago and now they're being persecuted.
    Well then, you're not just a minority status amongst Americans, but amongst your own party, too! Hanging on the edge to dirty wars and dirty fuels has you in a precarious position, lol.

    In a Thursday panel at Cato on conservatism and war, U.S. Reps. Dana Rohrabacher (R-Calif.) Tom McClintock (R-Calif.) and John Duncan (R-Tenn.) revealed that the vast majority of GOP members of Congress now think it was wrong for the U.S. to invade Iraq in 2003.

    GOP Congressmen: Most Republicans Now Think Iraq War Was a Mistake | Cato @ Liberty
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: ISIS seizes key Iraqi city of Ramadi as government forces pull back

    Quote Originally Posted by JANFU View Post
    How does this fall at Obama's feet. the Iraqi's not offering immunity.
    Maliki did not know he was toast till last year when ISIL exploded across Iraq.
    Team BO was out and talking about how inept Maliki was and the Iraqi government. Mocking him. Like the B Team. Yet they couldn't handle such an inept leader to get a SOFA. Do you think it had to do with putting in some real effort? In 2013 Maliki is knocking and talking Security of the Country. Not Syria.....Iraqs.



    Could President Obama have showed more enthusiasm? True, Mr. Obama seemed to feel he couldn’t force an unwanted agreement on the Iraqi people, and he didn’t work with Mr. Maliki as President Bush had. But Mr. Obama spoke or met with Mr. Maliki three times in 2011, and Vice President Joe Biden was constantly in touch. What counted most with Mr. Maliki was not rapport but the coldblooded calculus of pluses and minuses affecting his political fortunes. On the other hand, the negotiations were disrupted repeatedly by White House staffers with public statements inaccurately low-balling the troop numbers and misinterpreting Iraqi decisions.....snip~

    Maliki knew in Dec of 2013 when he came to see BO.

    BO got his SOFA in 2014.....and he could have had talks to increase the troops. As you stated.....with ISIL's breakout.

  7. #127
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    Re: ISIS seizes key Iraqi city of Ramadi as government forces pull back

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Well then, you're not just a minority status amongst Americans, but amongst your own party, too! Hanging on the edge to dirty wars and dirty fuels has you in a precarious position, lol.

    In a Thursday panel at Cato on conservatism and war, U.S. Reps. Dana Rohrabacher (R-Calif.) Tom McClintock (R-Calif.) and John Duncan (R-Tenn.) revealed that the vast majority of GOP members of Congress now think it was wrong for the U.S. to invade Iraq in 2003.

    GOP Congressmen: Most Republicans Now Think Iraq War Was a Mistake | Cato @ Liberty

    The Iraqi resolution is irrelevent.

    Whats that have to do with Obama's disastrous foreign policy decision to pull all US forces out of Iraq ?

    He's the reason ISIS is now moving from town to town murdering and pillaging.

    Like I said, Iraqi's went from voting in elections to being persecuted by ISIS.

    Thats not Bush's fault, thats all on Obama.

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    Re: ISIS seizes key Iraqi city of Ramadi as government forces pull back

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Team BO was out and talking about how inept Maliki was and the Iraqi government. Mocking him. Like the B Team. Yet they couldn't handle such an inept leader to get a SOFA. Do you think it had to do with putting in some real effort? In 2013 Maliki is knocking and talking Security of the Country. Not Syria.....Iraqs.



    Could President Obama have showed more enthusiasm? True, Mr. Obama seemed to feel he couldn’t force an unwanted agreement on the Iraqi people, and he didn’t work with Mr. Maliki as President Bush had. But Mr. Obama spoke or met with Mr. Maliki three times in 2011, and Vice President Joe Biden was constantly in touch. What counted most with Mr. Maliki was not rapport but the coldblooded calculus of pluses and minuses affecting his political fortunes. On the other hand, the negotiations were disrupted repeatedly by White House staffers with public statements inaccurately low-balling the troop numbers and misinterpreting Iraqi decisions.....snip~

    Maliki knew in Dec of 2013 when he came to see BO.

    BO got his SOFA in 2014.....and he could have had talks to increase the troops. As you stated.....with ISIL's breakout.
    Points you made are valid. But until ISIL went rampaging with their brutality the average John Q Public wanted nothing to do with Iraq.
    2 wars, people wanted it done for.
    Quote Originally Posted by RickJames3000 View Post
    You need to revisit the chain of association... you only insisted you were a Trump-supporter after you figured out that made you a pederast as well. If I were you. I'd be more discreet about it... but I guess it's your dime.

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    Re: ISIS seizes key Iraqi city of Ramadi as government forces pull back

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    The Iraqi resolution is irrelevent.

    Whats that have to do with Obama's disastrous foreign policy decision to pull all US forces out of Iraq ?

    He's the reason ISIS is now moving from town to town murdering and pillaging.

    Like I said, Iraqi's went from voting in elections to being persecuted by ISIS.

    Thats not Bush's fault, thats all on Obama.
    Even ardent republican supporters of the failed Iraq war now admit it was a mistake. Your failure to acknowledge what's actually in the post you quoted proves my point. Sense, as most republican congressmen now admit, the invasion and occupation of Iraq was a mistake to begin with, it's a moot point talking about what you think Obama's doing. You're out on the branch alone.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  10. #130
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    Re: ISIS seizes key Iraqi city of Ramadi as government forces pull back

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Even ardent republican supporters of the failed Iraq war now admit it was a mistake. Your failure to acknowledge what's actually in the post you quoted proves my point. Sense, as most republican congressmen now admit, the invasion and occupation of Iraq was a mistake to begin with, it's a moot point talking about what you think Obama's doing. You're out on the branch alone.
    Nope. Not alone. And it might be opportune to say the invasion was wrong for many reasons, because it is politically correct and getting speaker engagements is easier, but that does not change the reality. And that was that it was quite right to go in at the time.

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