Page 7 of 8 FirstFirst ... 5678 LastLast
Results 61 to 70 of 80

Thread: Senate Democrats Block Progress on Obama’s Trade Authority

  1. #61
    Sage
    Montecresto's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Last Seen
    03-13-16 @ 10:59 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    24,561

    Re: Senate Democrats Block Progress on Obama’s Trade Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen.Seven View Post
    That's a good point. I have to admit, I am not familar with the details of TPP, but anything that checks this out of control presidency has to be a good thing. Hence, the POTUS should not be given even more power in the form of fast track authority.

    I applaud the democrats for having wisdom in this case, or at least acting in a wise manner for whatever reason, and chastise the republicans for lacking it.
    Connect the dots. Republicans are pro corporation, not that anybody should be anti corporation, and asking for fences if you will (certain restrictions and regulations) is not anti-corporation. Given human nature and the corrupting power of greed, which each and everyone of us has, we need people looking over the shoulders of big business (small business too) and the financial sector just as we need oversight, checks and balances in government. Because after all, as someone famously said, we wouldn't even need a constitution if men were angels, and we're not. 85% of the negotiators on 28 committees are corporate executives and industry lobbyist! Look at that imbalance and conflict right there. The deal began as a trade agreement between four smaller PRC's until the US jumped in and took the lead with the primary motivation of keeping China out of it. Containment of China. Now then, the GOP largely (not completely, TEA Party!!) wants to give to the presidency, decider authority on this trade. Ok, no big deal for the GOP, realizing that by the time TPP becomes law and is being implemented, Obama is long history. Still, why the desperation for no congressional oversight? It's not that all of that is necessarily bad, but what's missing in it is the benefit/liability to and representation of the average American worker. I've already pointed out labor unions and labor advocacy groups, which have scant input in the negotiations are voicing their concerns, but nobody seems to be willing to hold a microphone up to them. People argue the natural necessity of such treaties to be negotiated in secret and while I can see some merit to that argument, some people are tired of big ground shaking deals being done in secret and then made public for a minute and then voted on or just signed into law.
    This deal is a decade old almost, hundreds, maybe thousands of people have been working on it, when complete it will be 29 chapters and we're told that when it's complete, it will be made public for 60 days before processing for our scrutiny. But even if that does happen, and we've been promised such things before that didn't actually materialize, 60 days to look at, comprehend and distill something that hundreds or thousands of people have been working on for nearly a decade!!!??? It really needs help.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  2. #62
    Sage

    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Tennessee
    Last Seen
    Today @ 04:19 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    18,847

    Re: Senate Democrats Block Progress on Obama’s Trade Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by ludin View Post
    It isn't cryptic at all. Why would a president who constantly spouts he is for the American worker sign a bill that has a huge negative effect on American companies?

    I have to find it but one article had them opposing it because it would allow foreign nations to sue the US government for actions that undermine investment "expectations" and hurt their companies. what? since when do we allow this to happen?

    It wouldn't even be in US courts but before the World Bank and the UN which have anti-American views to begin with.
    there also were some other big negatives in the trade bill that will hurt American people and America itself.

    however when you consider the fact that Obama is an anti-colonialist then well it fits right in line of why he would give other countries power over America
    instead of protecting America's sovereignty.

    the other sticking point in the bill is the regulation on currency manipulation that Asian countries like China pull to keep a favored value over the dollar.
    that should be part of any trade agreement that we are going to deal on even terms as far as currency goes.
    I guess you realize that if the bill is consistent with Obama's ideology, it's also consistent with the ideology of the vast majority of the GOP, big business, the Chamber of Commerce, etc. So I guess you're saying the GOP, Chamber etc. is overwhelmingly against the American worker and American business as well.

  3. #63
    Sage

    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Last Seen
    Today @ 04:25 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    11,430

    Re: Senate Democrats Block Progress on Obama’s Trade Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    Good for them.
    I agree. I'm sick of the U.S. signing agreements that help other countries without helping us.

  4. #64
    Sage
    Geoist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:26 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Left
    Posts
    8,642

    Re: Senate Democrats Block Progress on Obama’s Trade Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    I understand. But I looked at your first post in this thread, and I can't tell whether or not you support TPP?
    Well, he is against ACA. That much we know.
    "Men did not make the earth ... it is the value of the improvement only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property... Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." -- Thomas Paine, Agrarian Justice
    http://www.wealthandwant.com/

  5. #65
    Sage
    Geoist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:26 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Left
    Posts
    8,642

    Re: Senate Democrats Block Progress on Obama’s Trade Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    i have always been for free trade, however that trade must be equal trade from both sides.
    TPP is managed trade. It is NAFTA/CAFTA on steroids.

    Certainly you have an opinion on fast track?
    "Men did not make the earth ... it is the value of the improvement only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property... Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." -- Thomas Paine, Agrarian Justice
    http://www.wealthandwant.com/

  6. #66
    Mixed Government advocate
    Master PO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    93,000,000 miles from Earth where its very Hot
    Last Seen
    06-15-17 @ 10:08 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    31,333

    Re: Senate Democrats Block Progress on Obama’s Trade Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoist View Post
    TPP is managed trade. It is NAFTA/CAFTA on steroids.

    Certainly you have an opinion on fast track?
    i belive all legislation should be out in the open, and plenty of time to read understand and debate it.

  7. #67
    Tavern Bartender
    Kinky tres borrachos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    New England
    Last Seen
    05-02-17 @ 05:59 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    38,185

    Re: Senate Democrats Block Progress on Obama’s Trade Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    I have to say I find it curious, and just a little bit humorous, that some of the same posters who were criticizing Republicans for not wanting to let Obama bind America to a secretly negotiated deal with Iran are now cheering on Democrats for not wanting to let Obama bind America to a secretly negotiated trade deal with the Asian group.

    American politics are wonderful.
    I was trying to figure out what mystified me here, and you nailed it.

    Interesting.

    I actually have no opinion either way on what I know about this; everything written or spoken has a partisan slant. So I'm not going to criticize either side (Obama & those for it, nor those against it).
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. ~W.C. Fields

  8. #68
    Sage
    Montecresto's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Last Seen
    03-13-16 @ 10:59 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    24,561

    Re: Senate Democrats Block Progress on Obama’s Trade Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    i belive all legislation should be out in the open, and plenty of time to read understand and debate it.
    Do you want the president to have fast track authority on such a vast trade deal, or do you want congressional oversight?
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  9. #69
    Sage
    Montecresto's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Last Seen
    03-13-16 @ 10:59 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    24,561

    Re: Senate Democrats Block Progress on Obama’s Trade Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoist View Post
    Well, he is against ACA. That much we know.
    But over all, the PPACA is positive. There are negatives about it as any such monstrosity will have, some big, many many small ones that we deal with in our business (medical billing and consulting) daily, literally that are being ironed out. You might be surprised how many times we've received new guidelines (particularly from Medicare and Medicaid) from the implementation of PPACA, only to be modified due to industry complaints of too imposing for the benefit. I'm trying to say that not everything in the 2,000 pages of the bill have rolled out smoothly as you might expect, and I'm talking about lots of little things in addition to the initial roll out trouble that everybody's aware of. That said, there's great benefits to it and those that want to "repeal every last word of it" are wrong.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  10. #70
    Guru
    sawdust's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Last Seen
    03-04-16 @ 08:47 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    3,177

    Re: Senate Democrats Block Progress on Obama’s Trade Authority

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    That's of course the main problem with fast track authority. All ANYONE not a corporate lobbyist (for the most part) knows is what's been leaked by various sources. It's impossible to really know whether to support the bill or not because we and most of Congress can't see the damn thing, but the POTUS wants fast track authority on this giant black hole.
    I heard Rand Paul on the radio who claimed he read the bill. He said it was not easily understood because it was written in Washingtonian legalese. I still don't know if I support it but I know that the process should be transparent. I understand that the dems in the Senate have come to some kind of agreement. and passage is imminent.
    "A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury." Attributed to Alexander Tytler

Page 7 of 8 FirstFirst ... 5678 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •