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Thread: U.S. Unemployment Falls to Lowest Level Since May 2008[W:489, 497]

  1. #351
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    re: U.S. Unemployment Falls to Lowest Level Since May 2008[W:489, 497]

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    No one pays …
    Happily ignored.

    >>Where do you think …

    Happily ignored.

    >>It has been almost 7 years left office, don't you think it is time to stop diverting from the Obama record?

    You made this comment in response to a quote from yerself. I don't think I've ever seen that.

    >>Said no such thing, just quoted other liberals like you.

    You said : "It is absolutely stunning how you railed against the lies and performance of Bush." I thought maybe you were agreeing that the Bush administration lied and performed poorly.

    >>There isn't a performance number from Bush that Obama has beaten.

    "Economically, Could Obama Be America's Best President?," Forbes, May 18, 2013

    "The Obama Recovery Has Been Miles Better Than the Bush Recovery," Mother Jones, Dec 6, 2014


    >>Prove it using BLS data?

    No problem. There are two sets of data: the
    establishment survey (CES) and the household survey (CPS).

    >>Obama inherited 143 million working Americans

    134 million in CES; 142.2 in CPS.

    >>that is now 147 million so where are those 12.3 million jobs??

    No, it's now 141.4 in CES, and 148.5 in CPS.

    So total nonfarm (CES) is up by 7.4 million, while total employment (CPS) is up 6.3 million.

    The 12.3 million figure is the difference between the CES number in Feb 2009 — 129.6 — when the effects of the Great Recession were still playing through the labor market, and today's figure. I guess that's 11.8 million. I stand corrected, although I think I made a mistake somewhere.

    With 223,000 jobs added in April, private-sector employment has grown for 62 consecutive months — the longest streak on record — to the tune of 12.3 million jobs over that time. — "5 Things You Should Know About the April Jobs Numbers : U.S. Department of Labor Blog," from Labor Secretary Tom Perez's blog

    Now to be fair, the difference between the CPS number in Dec 2009 — 138 — and today's figure is only 10.5 million. So you can choose that one if you want.

    >>You can't so I expect an apology.

    I'll pass.
    Last edited by mmi; 05-16-15 at 03:02 AM.

  2. #352
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    re: U.S. Unemployment Falls to Lowest Level Since May 2008[W:489, 497]

    Quote Originally Posted by mmi View Post
    Happily ignored.

    >>Prove it using BLS data?

    No problem. There are two sets of data: the
    establishment survey (CES) and the household survey (CPS).

    >>Obama inherited 143 million working Americans

    134 million in CES; 142.2 in CPS.

    >>that is now 147 million so where are those 12.3 million jobs??

    No, it's now 141.4 in CES, and 148.5 in CPS.

    So total nonfarm (CES) is up by 7.4 million, while total employment (CPS) is up 6.3 million.

    The 12.3 million figure is the difference between the CES number in Feb 2009 — 129.6 — when the effects of the Great Recession were still playing through the labor market, and today's figure. I guess that's 11.8 million. I stand corrected, although I think I made a mistake somewhere.

    With 223,000 jobs added in April, private-sector employment has grown for 62 consecutive months — the longest streak on record — to the tune of 12.3 million jobs over that time. — "5 Things You Should Know About the April Jobs Numbers : U.S. Department of Labor Blog," from Labor Secretary Tom Perez's blog

    Now to be fair, the difference between the CPS number in Dec 2009 — 138 — and today's figure is only 10.5 million. So you can choose that one if you want.

    >>You can't so I expect an apology.

    I'll pass.
    Don't know how to do the quotes, do you? Just like you don't know how to do any research. BEA.gov, BLS.gov, and the U.S. Treasury are the official sites for data and you ignore them all. I have done my job here and nothing is going to change your mind. Gruber was right. I assure you one of these days you will indeed grow up and realize what a fool liberalism has made out of you. The electorate got it this past election, when will you?

    Labor Force Statistics from the Current Population Survey
    Original Data Value

    Series Id: LNS12000000
    Seasonally Adjusted
    Series title: (Seas) Employment Level
    Labor force status: Employed
    Type of data: Number in thousands
    Age: 16 years and over
    Years: 1980 to 2013

    Year Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
    2001 137778 137612 137783 137299 137092 136873 137071 136241 136846 136392 136238 136047
    2002 135701 136438 136177 136126 136539 136415 136413 136705 137302 137008 136521 136426
    2003 137417 137482 137434 137633 137544 137790 137474 137549 137609 137984 138424 138411
    2004 138472 138542 138453 138680 138852 139174 139556 139573 139487 139732 140231 140125
    2005 140245 140385 140654 141254 141609 141714 142026 142434 142401 142548 142499 142752
    2006 143150 143457 143741 143761 144089 144353 144202 144625 144815 145314 145534 145970
    2007 146028 146057 146320 145586 145903 146063 145905 145682 146244 145946 146595 146273
    2008 146378 146156 146086 146132 145908 145737 145532 145203 145076 144802 144100 143369
    2009 142153 141644 140721 140652 140250 140005 139898 139481 138810 138421 138665 138025
    2010 138439 138624 138767 139296 139255 139148 139167 139405 139388 139097 139046 139295
    2011 139253 139471 139643 139606 139681 139405 139509 139870 140164 140314 140771 140896
    2012 141608 142019 142020 141934 142302 142448 142250 142164 142974 143328 143277 143305
    2013 143322 143492 143286 143579 143898 144058 144285 144170 144303 143568 144386 144586
    2014 145206 145301 145796 145724 145868 146247 146401 146451 146607 147260 147331 147442
    2015 148201 148297 148331
    Looks like 6 million to me at a cost of 8.2 trillion dollars added to the debt. Obama loses the House in 2010, didn't regain it in 2012, and lost the entire Congress in 2014. The world is a mess and this is the worst recovery in the history of our nation. You buy the rhetoric and ignore the substance buying what you want to believe. Some people will never get it and you appear to be in that group

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    re: U.S. Unemployment Falls to Lowest Level Since May 2008[W:489, 497]

    If unemployment was at its lowest level and wages were actually rising then I would be excited.

    The Obama administration has been FANTASTIC for creating low paying jobs. We need a President who is fantastic at creating small business owners, but that would require someone who accepts that equality does not exist in reality.

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    re: U.S. Unemployment Falls to Lowest Level Since May 2008[W:489, 497]

    Quote Originally Posted by imagep View Post
    And there probably would have been, if it weren't for the Great Bush Recession in between then and now. Maybe you didn't notice.
    No, the recession was the fault of the Democrats, who stood in the way of reform of Fannie and Freddie. That's what precipitated the financial crisis. Maybe you remember that.

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." --HL Mencken

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    re: U.S. Unemployment Falls to Lowest Level Since May 2008[W:489, 497]

    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    No, the recession was the fault of the Democrats, who stood in the way of reform of Fannie and Freddie. That's what precipitated the financial crisis. Maybe you remember that.
    Fannie and Freddi didn't cause the mortgage crisis. Borrowers, lenders, underwriters, investment banks, ratings agencies, insurance entities, etc... all had skin in the game. Trying to pass the blame on the GSE's is entirely short-sighted, not to mention void of data analysis.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    re: U.S. Unemployment Falls to Lowest Level Since May 2008[W:489, 497]

    Quote Originally Posted by Kushinator View Post
    Fannie and Freddi didn't cause the mortgage crisis. Borrowers, lenders, underwriters, investment banks, ratings agencies, insurance entities, etc... all had skin in the game. Trying to pass the blame on the GSE's is entirely short-sighted, not to mention void of data analysis.
    Wrong. Fannie and Freddie pumped billions and billions of toxic loans into the financial system which was tied together by credit default swaps and other derivatives. The Democrats refused to reform Fannie and Freddie, which were buying up subprime loans from everyone at government regulatory behest thereby creating an incentive to underwrite them. When the housing market went south it all came down.

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." --HL Mencken

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    re: U.S. Unemployment Falls to Lowest Level Since May 2008[W:489, 497]

    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    Wrong. Fannie and Freddie pumped billions and billions of toxic loans into the financial system which was tied together by credit default swaps and other derivatives.
    Perhaps you are unaware of what Fannie and Freddie actually do.

    The Democrats refused to reform Fannie and Freddie, which were buying up subprime loans from everyone at government regulatory behest thereby creating an incentive to underwrite them. When the housing market went south it all came down.


    The data tells a different story.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

  8. #358
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    re: U.S. Unemployment Falls to Lowest Level Since May 2008[W:489, 497]

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    And I am telling you it's not always the "low taxes/low barriers/low wages" are result of "neo-liberal" policy which by the way also spans 3rd way economics which even Bill Clinton, Tony Blair, Gordon Brown and a bunch of PMs in Australia support.
    I understand perfectly that BC pushed neolibereal policy, whether it was NAFTA, the massive cuts to poverty programs or deregulation under Rubin and Greenspan...all of that increased wealth inequality.

    Rather there are situations in which industries collapse because of overproduction, excess pollution and sometimes naturally it happens (creative destruction). They have just as much as role in the issues at hand. When these industries collapse they put pressure on wages, tax receipts, and bring in low barriers as well. You think Cable TV is gonna survive with the advent of higher broadband which will allow you more ability to watch streaming tv? Absolutely not. People will lose their jobs because of this technology.. just as Oyster and Crab industry in Maryland collapse due to excess pollution and over production.
    Bullchit, steel, auto, electronics....these industries did not decline in the US because of "domestic overproduction", imports of these items more than made up for the declines.

    There are underlying issues that have to be discussed outside of your "neo-liberal" meme. How do you get people to invest in cities and industries if you have no low tax rate carrot to hang in front of them? How do you get someone or company to make a long term investment in an area if you can't promise them taxes will stay the same during Governorships (Dem or Republican)? How can you say "Hey, invest here but we might raise your taxes despite the fact you pay $15hour and invest millions into environmental clean"?
    By again eliminating the policy of "race to the bottom" which allows the downward pressure on wages and domestic production. You further augment the desirability of a population by investing in education.

    Nobody wants to invest in uncertainty, people and companies that invest for the long term and the type of investment that sustains local economies look 30 years out in projecting costs. If the costs don't add up, they aren't gonna invest and they'll take those jobs overseas. That's not gonna change and it's certainly not gonna change with Obama's TPP push.
    TPP is not, by and large, a trade agreement. It is a further extension of copyright and patent protections for corporations, giving them greater rights to sue individual states govts when protection laws are enforced. It is NAFTA on steroids as far as that is concerned, so if you are against TPP (which any good little Hayekian should hold an opposite position to yours), then how can you argue in favor of neoliberalism? The TPP is neoliberalism, it is the freeing of corporations.

    You have to start thinking out of box. Long gone are the taxes of protectionist.
    No, they exist....in other countries, it is that we have allowed neoliberalists to write our US industrial policy.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  9. #359
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    re: U.S. Unemployment Falls to Lowest Level Since May 2008[W:489, 497]

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    Wages won't rise with TPP.
    Wages don't rise with neoliberal policy, that was the first point.

    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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    re: U.S. Unemployment Falls to Lowest Level Since May 2008[W:489, 497]

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    How do you explain the FACT that I grew up a Democrat, voted for Democrats for national office for about 20 years, and now realize that the party of Pelosi, Reid, and Obama don't represent the Democrat Party that I knew and supported?
    Um, because you are the epitome, the prime example of the Southern conservative.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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