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U.S. Unemployment Falls to Lowest Level Since May 2008[W:489, 497]

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Liberals controlling the 10 poorest cities in the US and the 10 most dangerous cities in the US is not ignorant rhetoric. The ignorance is you standing up for failure.
mmmm

10 poorest states:
Mississippi
New Mexico
Louisiana
Georgia
Washington DC
Kentucky
Alabama
Arizona
South Carolina
West Virginia

10 States with the highest crime rates:
Maryland
Florida
Louisiana
Delaware
South Carolina
New Mexico
Alaska
Nevada
Tennessee
DC

Care to guess which party controls the governorship and/or legislature of almost all of those states...?
 
10 poorest states … 10 States with the highest crime rates

I was thinking of using that, but I didn't think it offered an unqualified defeat for our opponents. ;)

Perhaps we can agree that all these lists can be very misleading. Poverty and crime are often not conditions that can legitimately be blamed on a state or local government.

Two minor points: As you know, DC is not a state. I think Maryland collects its stats differently and that may explain its top ranking. Strongly Democratic as you know, so we don't want it unfairly criticised.
 
Btw, since January, there are only 61,000 more Americans employed full time (252,000 less over the last month alone) and there are less women in total employed.

Table A-9. Selected employment indicators

Throw in a DOW that is flat for the year (and has been flat for 5 months now), a GDP that will probably be negative when revised for Q1 and is running about 0.7 so far in Q2 (according to GDPNow) PLUS consumer spending has been flat for months (all this despite ZIRP and 'QE' still going on to the tune of about $200 billion annually)...and things are not looking good.
 
Also, just another example of government creative math...213,000(!) jobs (not seasonally adjusted) were added by the BLS to the Estblishment data using their 'Birth Death model'.

In other words, it's an estimate. It's not part of the survey of businesses, it is an estimate the BLS uses (imo, to pad the numbers).

CES Net Birth/Death Model
 
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it is an estimate the BLS uses (imo, to pad the numbers)]

Damn! You caught us again. Yer one sharp cookie, DA. We can't slip anything past you. :(
 
mmmm

10 poorest states:
Mississippi
New Mexico
Louisiana
Georgia
Washington DC
Kentucky
Alabama
Arizona
South Carolina
West Virginia

10 States with the highest crime rates:
Maryland
Florida
Louisiana
Delaware
South Carolina
New Mexico
Alaska
Nevada
Tennessee
DC

Care to guess which party controls the governorship and/or legislature of almost all of those states...?

mmmmm......where did you get this list? Washington DC is the richest state, according to Forbes.

No. 1 Richest State: Washington, D.C.* - In Photos: The 10 Richest And Poorest States In 2014 - Forbes

By the way - the actual richest state is New Jersey. Chris Christie? He's a Republican.

mmmmmmm
 
Also, just another example of government creative math...213,000(!) jobs (not seasonally adjusted) were added by the BLS to the Estblishment data using their 'Birth Death model'.

In other words, it's an estimate. It's not part of the survey of businesses, it is an estimate the BLS uses (imo, to pad the numbers).

CES Net Birth/Death Model

You do realize the household survey uses a birth-death(and immigration) model too, right? And that the results of surveys are also estimates?

And you have yet to show the model is inaccurate when checked against a full count.
 
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Okaaaaay.

Sarcasm or not, take away the Birth/Death model estimates and the number of those employed (not seasonally adjusted) in April actually went down 35,000.

Table B-1. Employees on nonfarm payrolls by industry sector and selected industry detail

From that link: Not seasonally adjusted total non-farm in March was 140,284,000. In April it was 141,462,000 Change of 1,178,000 Take away the Birth Death and it was +965,000
I have no idea where the negative 35,000 comes from. Some bizzarre misreading I can't see.
 
It would be more accurate to say that neo-liberal economic policy (free market/low tax/low barrier) has caused the dramatic erosion of manufacturing in most if not all of these "democratic cities" wherein those govts had next to no impact upon the national neo-liberal policies....but the understanding of these ideas would require more than what is being displayed by the simplistic rhetoric spewed consistently in your "arguments".
Not exactly true.. in any sense.There are always underlying issues. Maryland (Baltimore) also had massive environmental issues with the Chesapeake Bay due to the legacy of industrialization. Chesapeake Bay was the world's first recognized dead zones (Hypoxic). It's still absolutely horrible which has killed or is in the process of killing the fishing.. Oysters and Blue Crab are majorly effected. Oyster population declined by 70% since 1980... it absolutely collapsed. Right now Chesapeake Bay has 1% of it's historical levels of Oysters. That's with Federal, State and Local funding to repopulate the Oyster population and to allow Oyster farms. It's a far cry from a time when 15 million bushels (50 pounds per bushel).. so we are taking 750m pounds or $1b plus industry gone in Maryland at current prices (unwashed)..

For Blue Crab.. 40 years ago, Maryland provided 50% of Blue Crab (hard shell) in the US. Since 1990 the population of Blue Crab in Maryland has fallen from 900m to 300m. It's an industry struggling to survive even with federal, state and local dollars.

Then throw on it.. to repair the Chesapeake the State of Maryland agreed to change it's taxing policy. If you live in a watershed area.. you are taxed a "rain fall tax", known as Stormwater Remediation Fee. You literally had to pay $$$$ because it rained on your property. Only 9 counties and city of Baltimore has this tax. If you are business you aren't gonna invest if you have to pay a tax on rain based on SQ FT (of your roof), but EPA said it needed to be done.. and only Maryland did it. VA, PA, DE, and WV said "bite me". It finally got repealed under the current Governor today.


Then throw in city of Baltimore's policy polices and every arrest (not conviction) is reported to DoJ and Baltimore looks like a crime riddled city thus looking unattractive, you can Dem Martin O'Malley for that screw up.

So hey.. you wanna stick with your story? I grew up outside of Baltimore, watching Baltimore news (WJZ, WMAR, and WBAL), WBAL 1090 AM and that's before it's right slant.. when Ron Smith was the radio station on in the house and the car. I consider the Charm city my home and know it damn well.
Interesting, but you never made a connection between oysters and neo-liberal policy. What this has to do with low taxes/low barriers/low wage gains is beyond me.
 
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I was thinking of using that, but I didn't think it offered an unqualified defeat for our opponents. ;)

Perhaps we can agree that all these lists can be very misleading. Poverty and crime are often not conditions that can legitimately be blamed on a state or local government.
I agree, and it is weird to me that when I made the same point earlier, you liked austrianecon's non-sequitur response.
 
It would also be more accurate to say that 'neo-liberal economic policy created those manufacturing jobs in the first place. It was neo-statist policies of the left that drove them into freer, more competitive markets. But I get now why people are liberals--they never have to accept any consequences of their failed ideology.
You could be more wrong, but this is bad enough. The post-WWII job gains in the US was a matter of domestic demand, a product of large redistribution back into education and R&D from higher marginal rates...which caused greater wage gains for middle class workers. That shifted dramatically in the late 70's with the introduction of neo-liberal policies of low tax/low barrier and union busting. Containerized shipping along with allowing our competitors to sell below cost imports gutted US manufacturing. Cheap imports are great when your paycheck collapses, but it is just a race to the bottom.

change-since-1979-300.gif
 
You could be more wrong, but this is bad enough. The post-WWII job gains in the US was a matter of domestic demand, a product of large redistribution back into education and R&D from higher marginal rates...which caused greater wage gains for middle class workers. That shifted dramatically in the late 70's with the introduction of neo-liberal policies of low tax/low barrier and union busting. Containerized shipping along with allowing our competitors to sell below cost imports gutted US manufacturing. Cheap imports are great when your paycheck collapses, but it is just a race to the bottom.

change-since-1979-300.gif
Too bad that graph doesn't back up your point. Wealth redistribution was not the cause of post WWII job gains.
 
Too bad that graph doesn't back up your point.
It backs up the fact that post-1979 (start of neo-liberal policy) coincides with the breaking of the wage gain/productivity connection.


productivity.png


Wealth redistribution was not the cause of post WWII job gains.
Simple contrarianism is not proof of argument.

The fact that you did not even begin to counter the correction of your upside down account of "statist v neoliberal policy" says much more than your attention to the graphic.
 
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it is weird to me that when I made the same point earlier, you liked austrianecon's non-sequitur response.

Well, I thought the information about the local economy there was informative. You may be right about the "non-sequitur" label, I'm not sure.

I live on Narragansett Bay in RI. We have been working hard in recent years to get it cleaned up. Aquaculture is a very promising industry, and of course our strong performance in tourism is tied to getting pollutants out of the water. This effort has brought together D's and R's around here, thank God. It's critically important that we get this done.

I just reread austrianecon's post. I'm not sure what his policy prescription is (he doesn't seem to like taxes, as you'd expect from his username), but I'm hoping he'd be onboard for cleaning up Chesapeake Bay, another very beautiful and economically important estuary.

I also liked the fact that loves Baltimore. That type of passion can be very useful in making progress on solving problems and taking advantage of opportunities.
 
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Well, I thought the information about the local economy there was informative. You may be right about the "non-sequitur" label, I'm not sure.

I live on Narragansett Bay in RI. We have been working hard in recent years to get it cleaned up. Aquaculture is a very promising industry, and of course our strong performance in tourism is tied to getting pollutants out of the water. This effort has brought together D's and R's around here, thank God. It's critically important that we get this done.

I just reread austrianecon's post. I'm not sure what his policy prescription is (he doesn't seem to like taxes, as you'd expect from his username), but I'm hoping he'd be onboard for cleaning up Chesapeake Bay, another very beautiful and economically important estuary.
Seriously, you don't understand that a plea to environmentalism was a non-sequitur to my comments on neo-iberal econ policy and the loss manufacturing jobs and wages....especially in light of your:

Poverty and crime are often not conditions that can legitimately be blamed on a state or local government.

?????

You don't see that his comment (and now your new one) have nearly nothing to do with the point I made?
 
I also liked the fact that loves Baltimore. That type of passion can be very useful in making progress on solving problems and taking advantage of opportunities.
Just to follow up, if you and he are going to make an argument about environment concerns in relation to US job and manufacturing, let me make clear that I am in no manner arguing that manufacturers should get away with polluting, manufacturing can be, and should be, responsible....and that goes to my point, allowing foreign manufacturers to sell products in the US that practice worse than US standards is simply moving the pollution somewhere else along with the employment. The costs of that pollution should be imposed upon those importers to reflect the true cost of manufacturing, instead of again allowing them to gut our employment and weasel out of their responsibility.
 
I am in no manner arguing that manufacturers should get away with polluting

I didn't for a second think that you were.

>>The costs of that pollution should be imposed upon those importers to reflect the true cost of manufacturing

Complete agreement from me. So we both find cost-shifting of negative externalities unacceptable.
 
Interesting, but you never made a connection between oysters and neo-liberal policy. What this has to do with low taxes/low barriers/low wage gains is beyond me.

And I am telling you it's not always the "low taxes/low barriers/low wages" are result of "neo-liberal" policy which by the way also spans 3rd way economics which even Bill Clinton, Tony Blair, Gordon Brown and a bunch of PMs in Australia support.

Rather there are situations in which industries collapse because of overproduction, excess pollution and sometimes naturally it happens (creative destruction). They have just as much as role in the issues at hand. When these industries collapse they put pressure on wages, tax receipts, and bring in low barriers as well. You think Cable TV is gonna survive with the advent of higher broadband which will allow you more ability to watch streaming tv? Absolutely not. People will lose their jobs because of this technology.. just as Oyster and Crab industry in Maryland collapse due to excess pollution and over production.

There are underlying issues that have to be discussed outside of your "neo-liberal" meme. How do you get people to invest in cities and industries if you have no low tax rate carrot to hang in front of them? How do you get someone or company to make a long term investment in an area if you can't promise them taxes will stay the same during Governorships (Dem or Republican)? How can you say "Hey, invest here but we might raise your taxes despite the fact you pay $15hour and invest millions into environmental clean"?

Nobody wants to invest in uncertainty, people and companies that invest for the long term and the type of investment that sustains local economies look 30 years out in projecting costs. If the costs don't add up, they aren't gonna invest and they'll take those jobs overseas. That's not gonna change and it's certainly not gonna change with Obama's TPP push.

You have to start thinking out of box. Long gone are the taxes of protectionist.
 
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How do you get people to invest in cities and industries if you have no low tax rate carrot to hang in front of them?

Perhaps with some sort of federal program, well-tailored to the local situation and designed to as much as possible involve local interests.

>>That's not gonna change and it's certainly not gonna change with Obama's TPP push.

You oppose the treaty?
 
Perhaps with some sort of federal program, well-tailored to the local situation and designed to as much as possible involve local interests.

No Federal program is localized. It's too complicated for them.. meaning Uncle Sam barely knows anything about local people, how they think, how they go about life or anything like that. I grew up outside DC (Camp David and Site R aka Underground Pentagon) and there was a world of difference just those that live inside of I-495 and those that live outside of it. Then once you get to Fredrick, MD it changes even more. You go from "flat landers" to "Mountain folk". Whole different world but still part of the Chesapeake area. But still the same issues. You'd need local to the point it was county size.

One thing I was always good at since I was kid.. I understand where I come from and where I've been. I get the people as I always immersed myself. I've lived all over the world.. I am a world traveler, I absorb knowledge.
>>That's not gonna change and it's certainly not gonna change with Obama's TPP push.

You oppose the treaty?

It's 100% bs of a treaty. I am for free trade, but on principle I am for fair free trade and nothing is fair with the TPP. Wages won't rise with TPP.
 
No Federal program is localized. It's too complicated for them

This is how things need to change.

>>Wages won't rise with TPP.

It's gonna be tough t' get wages t' move. But I agree that this is a bad treaty. I'd like to see it renegotiated. Otoh, in an increasingly international marketplace, I figure we can't expect to get as much as we want out of our trading partners. The key to getting a better treaty is to focus more on the interests of working class Americans, a group that has been suffering economically for quite a long time, and less on those of very large corporations. But of course that's very difficult to accomplish under current campaign finance laws.

So I have t' say that I'm not optimistic about the way things are gonna work out on this.
 
There seems to be a pattern forming here. But of course, the naysayers are going to deride this good news as well.

U.S. Unemployment Falls to Lowest Level Since May 2008 - Bloomberg Business

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Can someone in the right please concede that Obama is, and has been, GOOD for the economy?

I know how hard liberals are looking to find something positive in the Obama Administration after basically 7 years of disaster but what they continue to ignore is the fact that the U-6 Rate is 10.8% and there is nothing that the Obama Administration has done other than drive part time employment, discouraged workers, and stagnant economic growth to generate the headlines liberals want to ignore. The more part time jobs and more discouraged workers the better the official unemployment rate. Seems that liberals will indeed buy the headlines and ignore the actual results.
 
...the U-6 Rate is 10.8% ...

That's good news, it's dropped 7% from it's peak in 2009 and it's lower now than it was when Bush left office. Are you just looking for a way to bash the Bush administration? If so, you are succeeding.
 
I know how hard liberals are looking to find something positive in the Obama Administration after basically 7 years of disaster but what they continue to ignore is the fact that the U-6 Rate is 10.8%[/qutoe]
What directiton is it moving? That it's higher than the the U-3 is meaningless because it is impossible for it to be lower. So just saying "the U-6 rate is 10.8%" is meaningless and tells us nothing...it's a number out of context.


and there is nothing that the Obama Administration has done other than drive part time employment, discouraged workers, and stagnant economic growth to generate the headlines liberals want to ignore. The more part time jobs and more discouraged workers the better the official unemployment rate. Seems that liberals will indeed buy the headlines and ignore the actual results.

Part time employment as a percent of total employment:
fredgraph.png


The U-4 rate: Unemployed plus discouraged divided by labor force plus discouraged, compared to the official (U-3) rate:
fredgraph.png

If discouraged played as big a role as you claim, the gap would be getting wider...it's not. Discouraged have been declining, not growning.
 
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